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I would really like your thoughts on this subject.

At first I like the idea that 1 kit can make multiple unit types. Examples such asGrey Knight terminators/paladins. There are enough 'subtle' small parts where you can distingish between a terminator and a paladin. The kit also comes with all the weapon options avaliable to you as allowed by the codex.

Recently GW is starting to go overboard with this concept. Examples such as the Dark Angel Terminator kit. The kit can be made into 3 unit types. Which means whatever one you choose, you will be left to tons of spare parts which seems to be a waste of money given the price increase for this kit. Second thing I dislike is that the kit does not allow you to make a unit with all the upgrades options allowed by the codex. such as you only get a pair of lighting claws and thunder hammer when the codex allows you to field mulitple per squad.

I would perfer the Deathwing kit be broken up into 3 sets and with same price as the current terminator kits; 1 for Deathwing Knights, 1 for Deathwing command/shooty marines, and 1 for Deathwing CC with only lighting claws and TH/SS. I know GW is doing this in 1 kit for money saving and also to gouge us for the extra money since we will buy as many kits as we need anyway. But I want your thoughts if this trend continues or gets worse.

Imagine in the future, the 'new' Space Marie kit, 5 models where you can build 5 Tactical or Assault or Devestator models. Costs slighty more then the current 10 man tactical squads, but only comes with 1 of each of the heavy weapon choice. How would you feel then?

wufai wrote:

Recently GW is starting to go overboard with this concept. Examples such as the Dark Angel Terminator kit. The kit can be made into 3 unit types. Which means whatever one you choose, you will be left to tons of spare parts which seems to be a waste of money given the price increase for this kit. Second thing I dislike is that the kit does not allow you to make a unit with all the upgrades options allowed by the codex. such as you only get a pair of lighting claws and thunder hammer when the codex allows you to field mulitple per squad.

This makes absolutely no sense. First you complain that there's too many bits an that you're having to pay for stuff that's left over, only to go on lamenting the lack of more bits. Wut?

Well, the DW kit is a bit of an oddball. It only gives you ONE thunder hammer. So if you want your TH (or LC) DW dudes, you're pretty much forced to buy an Assault Terminator box, or buy the weapons from a bits site. The former which, incidentally, is what I'm going to do as I wanted tabardy terminators to convert into Black Templars.

Whilst I can see what you're saying personally I don't see a huge problem with having combination kits. The parts always fit well with other kits in the same range so you can simply buy another box of normal terminators to use the parts. Plus it's good to have lots of parts for further conversions.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
This makes absolutely no sense. First you complain that there's too many bits an that you're having to pay for stuff that's left over, only to go on lamenting the lack of more bits. Wut?

Because you have too many bits you don't need and you don't have enough of the stuff you do need. For example, the TH/SS issue: you need one for every model in the unit, but you only get one. On the other hand you have leftover stuff you don't need no matter what unit you make. So it's the worst of both worlds: you overpay for the one unit you want, and then you have to overpay again to get extra parts to finish arming them properly.

It looks like a BT Terminator upgrade kit to me. Think Ill buy it and be very happy with it.

I think the deathwing kit is the exceptio though. In my experience the other multi-unit kits (Necrons, for instance) seem to come with enough bits to fit out the unit how you like, but most of the other units don't have the range of options available to Deathwing Terminators.

 Peregrine wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
This makes absolutely no sense. First you complain that there's too many bits an that you're having to pay for stuff that's left over, only to go on lamenting the lack of more bits. Wut?

Because you have too many bits you don't need and you don't have enough of the stuff you do need. For example, the TH/SS issue: you need one for every model in the unit, but you only get one. On the other hand you have leftover stuff you don't need no matter what unit you make. So it's the worst of both worlds: you overpay for the one unit you want, and then you have to overpay again to get extra parts to finish arming them properly.

Precisely. GW pays a few cents more (max) for having more stuff in the box to justify the hefty price increase but you don't need all the stuff in it anyway.

What utter rot, as a long time Deathwing player the multi-part plastic kit is a HUGE improvement over the gakky pewter terminators of yesteryear.

If you think of it less than being a catch-all unit for Deathwing and rather a Knights/Command Squad box set, it's great value.

And you can easily get the bitz to make 2-3 units of termies out of ONE box.

This is a massive improvement.

Would you prefer if they went to the Forgeworld model?
GW sells you a box of 5-10 bodies and then you pay almost the same ammount to get a box full of weapons?

Magnets.
You get all the kits, in one box.

It also takes up less space than 3 boxes, meaning there's more chance your FLGS will have it in stock.

Oh I like the multi-kit policy all right. What I really want to see:

Multi-kit warriors/shrikes/raveners
Multi-kit Harpy and something new
New multi-kit Obli/mutilators in plastic
A multi-kit Orc box (containing pieces to model Shootas/Sluggas/Lootas/Burnas/Tankbustas/other - think "Grey Hunter possibilites" box) - although this one will never happen.

And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

 Peregrine wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
This makes absolutely no sense. First you complain that there's too many bits an that you're having to pay for stuff that's left over, only to go on lamenting the lack of more bits. Wut?

Because you have too many bits you don't need and you don't have enough of the stuff you do need. For example, the TH/SS issue: you need one for every model in the unit, but you only get one. On the other hand you have leftover stuff you don't need no matter what unit you make. So it's the worst of both worlds: you overpay for the one unit you want, and then you have to overpay again to get extra parts to finish arming them properly.

As opposed to not having one of the bits at all. Which is the other "option"

GW will not make 3 separate kits, because that is 3x as expensive to make, 3x as expensive to ship and 3x as expensive to stock (holding stock costs money people) when for a lot of people being a little bit creative gets you round the "issue"

Its like people complaining a devastator box doesnt contain 4 x every weapon. Crazy, shortsighted-ness that doesnt think about the reality of running a retail modelling business at all.

What utter rot, as a long time Deathwing player the multi-part plastic kit is a HUGE improvement over the gakky pewter terminators of yesteryear.

If you think of it less than being a catch-all unit for Deathwing and rather a Knights/Command Squad box set, it's great value.

And you can easily get the bitz to make 2-3 units of termies out of ONE box.

This is a massive improvement

+1 there, with one box, I managed to build a nice Deathwing Knights unit (without those stupid bare faces .... give me damned helmets on those terminators !) and "convert" regular Space marines Assault Termies to shootie ones and create one Belial (based on the Sarge with the power sword's point resting the ground)

You can't do everything possible with this box, but if you want 5 TH/SS, just buy a regular Space Marines Assault Termies box and mix/match + add bits from the DW box / DA upgrade sprue / FW Termie shoulder pads to give them a Dark Angels look

There are many things that I can say to complain about GW.

"Having too many bitz left over" will never be one of those things.

I see where the OP is coming from.

Even with magnets, the max amount of models you can use is still only 5, which is not helpfull in a game.

You are paying for all these parts, that you will only be able to use a few at a time. The best way is to find cheap regular or dark vengeance termites and convert them up.

It's good with most things, but sometimes it irritates me. Like, the IG Infantry Squad box. I have way too many left over Grenade Launchers. Honestly, the only weapons anyone ever equips Guardsmen with are Meltas, Plasmas, and Flamers (and that's dependent). Thankfully I can convert some...

I love gakloads of extra bitz in a kit. I have so many burnas and burna backpacks from the loota/burna box, and it's always handy to have spare bits that look like fuel tanks and weapon stocks to build upon. Same with the nob box and others. If you only have one thunder hammer, use a little creativity and turn your surplus bitz into something similiar.

I really like it! If you want all of one build of terminator save yourself 10 bucks and buy the kits already available. I plan to just use it to make myself some knights and a command squad and trade away all the silly robes to for more usefull pieces.

Why would you think that you would get every loadout possible for a unit than can take so many different pieces of wargear? Are there kits available that offer that? The only one that comes to mind as being even close is the venerable dreadnought but then i think even it is missing a few things... like autocannons.

TL/DR: New Kit good! MORE BITZ GOOD!!

I am good with it. It allows you to save a few bucks by hitting up ebay for the extra bits you need.

You can't do everything possible with this box, but if you want 5 TH/SS, just buy a regular Space Marines Assault Termies box and mix/match + add bits from the DW box / DA upgrade sprue / FW Termie shoulder pads to give them a Dark Angels look

but buying 2 units to make one unit of TH/SS terminators seems kind of a waste of money . why buy the DA terminators at all then , from the other side of the table your opponent wont see the difference between a DA and non DA terminators anyway , double that if not painted.

Using the Deathwing box to field a 5-man unit thunder-hammers is very easy.

Put the 5 terminators together as completely vanilla Deathwing terminators. No robed heads or torsos, and without the Knight-specific right shoulder pads. Then give the Thunder Hammer to the Sergeant, and the maces to the other four, with storm shields on all 5. Then just play against some people who will allow conversions without having a cow.

Done. Counts-as Thunder Hammers for a whole squad. Being completely vanilla compared to actual Knights, plus having a leader with an actual TH/SH to signify the conversion intention should set them apart very nicely.

Complaining about the extra bits from the Deathwing box is completely crazy. Especially if you are fielding a Deathwing army, so will need more than one squad. Buy one Command Squad box, and buy the rest as the cheaper normal Terminator boxes. Spread the extra bitz from the Command box across the whole army to give all those otherwise vanilla Terminators a Deathwing aesthetic.

Better yet, Buy a Deathwing box, and a 15 dollar set of Dark Vengeance Terminators off the 'net. Combine the two as above, and you have 10 terminators for 75 dollars, without even taking Internet discounts on the Command Box into account (like for instance, I can get this combo for 3 whole dollars more then the Command box alone at retail price).

I had sworn off painting any more Space Marines. And then, such a deal, with the incredible bitz from the Command box, is entirely responsible for convincing me to play a Deathwing army (though I won't paint it as Deathwing).

I love it. That is all.

it annoys me. the grey knight kit has too much going on. the arms end up with all kinds of wierd poses unless you follow the instructions strictly. thats what happens when GW mixes two handed weapons with one handed. its a big pile of annoying crap.

I also dont like rank and file getting so detailed. if i just want regular grey knights, they dont need so much clutter. i can do without so many annoying details.

id rather have a seperate less detailed box for regular knights but then for purifiers, fine, they can have tons of stuff hanging off of them.

At that rate it might be better to just cut the price down and sell the base model and separate the wargear into its own purchase. I however liked the GK Terminator boxes coming with just about any combo you could want, shorting only on hammers and heavy weapons. Than again, I magnetized every option in the box for the 10 models I got. Having trouble finding extra heavy weapons and hammers though.

Chaos Terminators on the other hand... Was not happy with the included bitz at all, no options really. For the same price as the GKs too!

This is an odd topic to find a true solution to though.

Well, the thing is that the DW kit does in fact have all options other than the missing 4 lightning claws and 4 thunder hammers. Especially the hammers wouldn't have been that hard to include probably, considering the shields were already there anyway. And frankly not many people use lightning claws much these days, plus you get the 5 extras from each Assault terminator box, so there's extra bits of those floating around a lot.

As it is, it seems that just about the only bits I really need from the DW kit for my Templars are the tabard torso fronts and the Cyclone launcher. All the rest I could take from the Assault terminator box, pretty much. I'll have to see if I'm going to sell some of the extra bits or what, because since I already have 5 TH+SS terminators and 15 shooty ones, adding a full 10 more seems a bit excessive since I'm not a DW player In fact I don't foresee myself needing more than 1-2 shooty 5-man squads and up to 8 TH+SS models. And the shooty squads might not get much use once BT loses the second heavy weapon per 5-man squad.

I actually really loved the new box, mostly because I already had a ton of Terminators. I built the Knights from the box, but then had lots of other bits that I could combine with older terminators to make them more Dark Angelly. You get one of every heavy weapon, which is way more generous than the last Terminator box I bought.

I can see the point that this is a lot of "useless" bits to force people to buy, but I think for most Dark Angel players, the extra bits will be invaluable for customizing and tweaking the army. Generic/Ultramarines might not get the same value out of it, but that's why there will still be the other two Terminator boxes on the shelf.

I get annoyed with the gk sets as all the options probably raise the price. But at least there's lots of leftovers.

I love the new box. The SHields and varied shoulderpads and torsos give you many options. Heck i'm taking the shields off my old TH/SS and repplacing them with the new DA shields.

Then give the Thunder Hammer to the Sergeant, and the maces to the other four, with storm shields on all 5. Then just play against some people who will allow conversions without having a cow.

you now this way you could put anything on a terminator base and be cool with it . Problem in 6th is that with WYSIWYG a power mace and a thunder hammer are two different things. just like a bolter and a plasma gun are both guns , but have different rules.