Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So, according to Lexicanum, Astronomicon was constructed at the time of the Emperor.
Now, itis directed by his will but powered by slowly sdaining of specially trained psikers.
So how did it worked during the first phase of great crusade, when Emperor went about gathering primarchs, and the Astronomican (as far as i understand) remained on Terra?
If Thorian inquisitors would manage to incarnate Emperor in to material universe, would be he still capable of directing the Astronomicon, as he presumably did when crusading?

IIRC the Corpse-Emperor only holds a fracture of the psychic might of his former self and before that he was able to focus the Astronomican easily without being on Terra. Also I think that the mind-crushing of the thousands of psykers per day is mainly to hold the Emperor 'alive' not powering the Astronomican itself.

IIRC, during the Great Crusade, the Emperor projected the astronomican. When he was crippled and put on the Golden Throne, it was modified to project the astronomican. Part of the reason it consumes 10,000 psyker souls a day.

I think it's because he is near death. If he was to project the Astronomicon in his current state his remaining essence would disappear into the warp.

Keeping him fed on the life force of psykers ensures that he is kept alive to continue.

Looking at it from that point of view, it kinda sucks to be the Emperor.

Alternatively, the Emperor is dead and no longer doing anything other than being a symbol, and it is the modified Golden Throne that uses the essence of the Psykers to continue to project the beam.

It's difficult to imagine that he literally projects the Astronomican, even if that is what the fluff asserts. (As always, we have to keep in mind that some of the principles were not developed with the kind of precision demanded by our discussions.) As OP mentioned, he traveled around quite a bit during the Great Crusade. And did a lot of other distracting things, including almost getting killed at least once. Also, it strikes me as extremely stupid that the Emperor would ever fight on any front line if the Astronomican would simply vanish with his death. But perhaps that is exactly why he chose a warmaster in the wake of Ullanor.

It's always been unclear how exactly the Astronomican worked before the Emperor went kabput. The best theory I've seen is the systems that Magnus destroyed trying to warn the Emperor of Horus' betrayal allowed it. Which would help explain just why the Emperor was so furious when Magnus screwed them up.

Good point. Magnus really fethed up.

A childs error

I doubt Magnus knew how it worked exactly since it was the emperors personal project (if i remember correctly),.. though smart he was... But! I have yet to read the novels where he appears..

 Harriticus wrote:
It's always been unclear how exactly the Astronomican worked before the Emperor went kabput. The best theory I've seen is the systems that Magnus destroyed trying to warn the Emperor of Horus' betrayal allowed it. Which would help explain just why the Emperor was so furious when Magnus screwed them up.

Wasn't that the beginnings of his human entrance for the webway?

 -Loki- wrote:

 Harriticus wrote:
It's always been unclear how exactly the Astronomican worked before the Emperor went kabput. The best theory I've seen is the systems that Magnus destroyed trying to warn the Emperor of Horus' betrayal allowed it. Which would help explain just why the Emperor was so furious when Magnus screwed them up.

Wasn't that the beginnings of his human entrance for the webway?

Yes, and a life support system for The Emperor. The golden throne can do a lot of jobs.

The Astronomicon was originally both powered and directed by the Emperor. Once the Emperor was forced on the Throne to keep the webway shut and daemons at bay he couldn't also power the Astronomicon so the Choir was put in place to power it whilst the Emperor directs it.

Note that the Adeptus Astronomica, the psychers powering the Astronomicon are different from those sacrificed to the Emperor.

Armadeus wrote:

 -Loki- wrote:

 Harriticus wrote:
It's always been unclear how exactly the Astronomican worked before the Emperor went kabput. The best theory I've seen is the systems that Magnus destroyed trying to warn the Emperor of Horus' betrayal allowed it. Which would help explain just why the Emperor was so furious when Magnus screwed them up.

Wasn't that the beginnings of his human entrance for the webway?

Yes, and a life support system for The Emperor. The golden throne can do a lot of jobs.

it was only made into a life support system after he was crippled. The plans for the modification were, IIRC, given to Dorn to have completed.

 Shadox wrote:
IIRC the Corpse-Emperor only holds a fracture of the psychic might of his former self and before that he was able to focus the Astronomican easily without being on Terra. Also I think that the mind-crushing of the thousands of psykers per day is mainly to hold the Emperor 'alive' not powering the Astronomican itself.

This, if the emporer were to ever come back, his power would be virtually infinite due to the worship of trillions and trillions of people. Right now I would say that every ounce of his being is going towards not dying and whatever is left to guide the astronomican.

I believe the extra psyker power is required because the Emperor is pulling double duty. During the Crusade he only had to worry about projecting the Astronomicon, and that was apparently a relatively easy thing for him to do. He now has to do that as well hold the webway closed, and he is doing it in what is effectively a dead body on a broken Golden Throne.

So if somehow the Emperor died -HERSY BLAM - D:

The whole imperium would be fethed, daemons would swarm from the web way to destroy terra and no more space travel. Essentially age of strife x 9000?
I mean even assuming the speculation that if the Emperor was allowed to die he would be reborn was true... (I just learned he is holding back the webway as well) there would be literally no point offing himself to carnate the Emperor back, everything would be more screwed.

 wubMarine wrote:
So if somehow the Emperor died -HERSY BLAM - D:

The whole imperium would be fethed, daemons would swarm from the web way to destroy terra and no more space travel. Essentially age of strife x 9000?
I mean even assuming the speculation that if the Emperor was allowed to die he would be reborn was true... (I just learned he is holding back the webway as well) there would be literally no point offing himself to carnate the Emperor back, everything would be more screwed.

Warp travel is possible without the Astronomicon, it's just less accurate and more dangerous, and so necessitating shorter warp jumps rather than full fledged warp travel. So you'd likely see the Imperium break up into pocket areas, defined by the local center of power's safely navigable warp distance.

Terra itself would be fethed though yes. Perhaps the Grey Knights and the Ordo Malleus could save it/ find some way of closing the rift, given much more is known about daemons now but that's pure speculation. If they did however it's possible the Astronomicon could exist in some form given it's the Choir that powers it.

 rems01 wrote:

 wubMarine wrote:
So if somehow the Emperor died -HERSY BLAM - D:

The whole imperium would be fethed, daemons would swarm from the web way to destroy terra and no more space travel. Essentially age of strife x 9000?
I mean even assuming the speculation that if the Emperor was allowed to die he would be reborn was true... (I just learned he is holding back the webway as well) there would be literally no point offing himself to carnate the Emperor back, everything would be more screwed.

Warp travel is possible without the Astronomicon, it's just less accurate and more dangerous, and so necessitating shorter warp jumps rather than full fledged warp travel. So you'd likely see the Imperium break up into pocket areas, defined by the local center of power's safely navigable warp distance.

Maybe, maybe not. Seeing as how GW keeps on saying that if the Emp falls so does the Imperium and humanity fall.

Terra itself would be fethed though yes. Perhaps the Grey Knights and the Ordo Malleus could save it/ find some way of closing the rift, given much more is known about daemons now but that's pure speculation.

If Emp can't close it, I doubt the Grey Knights can. Maybe the Eldar could? I've heard it said that the rift on Terra would be somthing like a new Eye of Terror being born bu with Terra being the heart?

If they did however it's possible the Astronomicon could exist in some form given it's the Choir that powers it.

IIRC, Emp is the one to direct it.

If Emp can't close it, I doubt the Grey Knights can. Maybe the Eldar could? I've heard it said that the rift on Terra would be somthing like a new Eye of Terror being born bu with Terra being the heart?

Well I think the Eldar would get blockaded by 2 sector full of Imperial Battleships, unless they somehow have a sneaky web-way near terra, or unless the Harlequins somehow get to that point of the webway and close it off from within. In any case I feel that they'd be too late, and we would have 2 eyes of terror.

The end of the Imperium proceeds unless the emperor reincarnates and brings it back from the brink.

Im glad i found this the astronomican confused me to.

It would increase the Grimdark by a factor of 10 if the rift opened up and caused Terra to become a daemon world...

Pretty sure the rest of the broken Imperium would continue to fight and die amongst the stars even if that did happen

Where can I read more on that Terra webway portal that emperor is presumably holding close?