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Tervigon's Brood Progenerator

Tyranid Codex pg 52 wrote:All units of tervigants, spawned or otherwise, within 6" of a Tervigon can use the Tervigon's Leadership for any tests they are required to take. They also gain the benefits of the Tervigons Toxic Sacs and Adrenal Glands (if it has any).

GW Tyranid FAQ 1.2 pg 4 wrote:Q: At what point does my model need to be in range of a Tervigon to
gain the bonuses of Brood Progenitor special rule? (p52)
A: When you put the bonuses to use, i.e. when the model is
charged or when it makes its close combat attacks.

At a local Madison tourniement, several players claimed that the FAQ states that only those specific models in the unit that are within 6" can benefit from Brood Progenerator ability. In otherwards if you had one model in a unit of 10 termigants within 6" that was charged, only that model would benfit from poison and counter attack.

Now how I read this (together with the codex entry) is that a Termigant unit needs to be within 6" of Tervigon at the time the benefit is used to benefit from Brood Progenerator. To do so, at the time the benfit is to be used you check to see if a model in the unit is within 6" of the Tervigon. I don't see any laungauge that directly contradicts the codex entry.....the FAQ doesn't state "only those models in a tervigon unit that are in range benefit from Brood Progenerator".

Am I wrong? How are other tournie organizers and Tournie players reading this?

This will come up at Adepticon as several of the Madison Players will be attending and they will be bringing nids. I don't want them to be short changing themselves due to misrepresenting a FAQ. Of course I don't want to play it wrong either.

Looks to me like the whole unit receives the bonuses if one model is within 6"
The FAQ is only clarifying when you make the check to see if the unit benefits.

 Eldarain wrote:
Looks to me like the whole unit receives the bonuses if one model is within 6"
The FAQ is only clarifying when you make the check to see if the unit benefits.

That is how I read it...but the FAQ mentions checking distance for the individual "models" rather than units?

Thats for determining if the unit is eligible. You measure to see if any models are in range.

GW simply made a poor choice of wording for the FAQ question.

The UNIT does or does not gain the rule depending on whether the unit is in range, per the normal rules for measuring units.

The FAQ mentions models, because the benefits are USED by models. Models throw attacks at +1S, models ignore wounds using FNP, etc.

People continually read FAQ questions and answers as though they are rules text in a rulebook, when they are not. They are questions and answers ABOUT rules text, so you can't just read the FAQ and just ignore the actual text of the rules.

Can this question and answer be read in a way that doesn't break what the rules as written say? If so, then that is how it must be read and played. The question and answer do not say that they change the special rule's text...they just answer when you check to see if a model benefits from the ability, but the text for the ability still just requires the UNIT itself to be within range, not individual models.

The reason the question and answer are written this way is because you have to check range when a particular MODEL is making its attacks...this means an individual unit can theoretically have to check more than once if it contains models fighting at different Initiative steps, for example, based on when those individual models within the unit are actually making their attacks.

But the range itself still only ever matters whether the UNIT is within range or not.

Pretty much what has been said. At initiative step, check if "unit" is in range. It's the same as checking range for objectives, it doesn't have to be every model. If one gant is in 6" at the start of initiative 4, (after consolidating) then you have both poison and furious charge. Note though that you check range for counter attack before anyone attacks.

Thanks everyone for responding!

Jifel, for furious charge, would you check range when first initiating/declaring the charge (prior to movement) since the bonus is granted to a charging unit?

Otherwise, I follow that poison would be checked when you actually roll to wound.

 wyomingfox wrote:
Thanks everyone for responding!

Jifel, for furious charge, would you check range when first initiating/declaring the charge (prior to movement) since the bonus is granted to a charging unit?

Otherwise, I follow that poison would be checked when you actually roll to wound.

You check to see if you get the bonus when the time comes to use it i.e. at initiative.

Ah, I wasn't aware that furious charge was granted at an intiative step. I thought furious charge was like counter attack: the bonus comes into being when you intiate the action of charging (FC) or getting charged (CA). Thanks.

 wyomingfox wrote:
Ah, I wasn't aware that furious charge was granted at an intiative step. I thought furious charge was like counter attack: the bonus comes into being when you intiate the action of charging (FC) or getting charged (CA). Thanks.

Nope, that is the WHOLE POINT of the FAQ question...you check range (to the unit) when the model is about to attack. If the unit is within range at that point, then the models attacking then get the bonus.

So, for example, a unit of Termagants could charge some Necron Wraiths with Whip Coils. The Termagants that are in base contact, now are striking at I1. So the other Termagants (not in base contact) strike first. You check range to the Tervigon and see that this unit is within 6" and therefore those Termagants can get the Furious Charge +1S bonus for being within 6" of a Tervigon with Adrenal Glands. After that, the Wraiths strike next at I2 and kill a bunch of Termagants that happen to be the ones within 6" of the Tervigon.

So now when the I1 step rolls around, you check range again for your Termagant unit again and discover it is no longer within 6" of the Tervigon meaning those Gants striking at I1 aren't getting any benefit from the Tervigon for their attacks.

Gotcha! Thanks again.

This is not the clearest faq to interpret for me either.