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I didn't say having light anti-infantry WASN'T important...every successful army has to be able to deal with hordes. I just said it was the least important of the army requirements, after addressing things like grabbing and holding objectives, dealing with fliers, dealing with light armor spam, etc.

In the example list above, several units have multiple roles. You've got a couple very cheap scoring units (PCS) to go in the vendettas to grab distant objectives (I assume, they could also run along and do Move Move Move and FRFSRF). The large blobs threaten a very wide range of units, and serve roles of both grabbing objectives and killing enemy units.

The manticores also address multiple threats, both armor and infantry.

What do firewarriors do? They're an expensive, limited-role unit. Against the list above, they get nuked by the manticores (possibly killing the ethereal, as it's all indirect and can snipe him) and are quickly a non-factor.

I realize infantry are becoming a larger factor in games than they were in 5th edition, but any weapon can act in an anti--personnel role, even if excessive/inefficient for the role. Not every weapon can go from hurting troops to hurting vehicles or monstrous creatures.

Str.5 is particularly efficient at killing infantry and it can threaten up to T8 monsters which can be helpful. It also wounds T6 on a 5+ which is nice. So I do believe that FW can deal with a nice variety of things, more than a blob outfitted with all Lasguns can. Of course the blob is bigger, but it also costs quite a bit more (consider the HQs attached, etc).

Anyway, if a Tau list were to play that list, they could kill Manticores with weight of fire and also have things like SMS to deal with the blob. It doesn't hurt that your standard gun wounds the guardsmen on a 2 and that you can buff your shooting in both BS and number of shots.

I'd disagree that dealing with flyers and light armor spam is more important than dealing with infantry. I think 6th ed. Tourney results will back that up. Infantry heavy armies are the ones winning, so anti-infantry firepower takes precedence over anti-Mech. At the first 6th ED. NOVA I only saw one flyer heavy army in the top 8 and that was Neil Gilstrap, who afterwards switched the army up quite a bit. I played vs two Necron air forces and easily beat both because neither had enough firepower or ground presence to capture more objectives than I.

IMO, 6th favors infantry-heavy armies and favors those armies that can take out infantry efficiently. FW aren't great troops but they can do well and you've got to take either them or Kroot, so you make what you can of it.

If anyone is interested:

Lootas will wound Tau at 48" at an average rate of 5/9 or 5pts of wounded damage, ignore armor, cover saves will vary.

At 30-18.1" FW's will wound Lootas at an average of 1/3 or 5 pts wounded damage, ignore armor, vary cover save.

At less than 18 (after movement even) 2/3 or 10 points wounded.

Shootas will wound Tau at 18" at 4/9 or 4 pts per wound but not ignore armor.

At 18" tau will wound, and ignore armor, at 2/3 or 4 pts per wound, cover saves will vary.

So compared to the Orks at least for shooting wounding purposes, not factoring in cover saves, FW's are priced EXACTLY the same as the Orks 2 most taken (overwhelmingly) units.

Please tell me that Shootas and Lootas are OVERCOSTED, and convince GW while you're at it.

And they all have Ld base of 7.

Yes, I setup very specific conditions but not horribly so. Realistic IMHO.

Fire warriors cost 9 points, DE warriors cost 9 points
DE warriors have higher initiative, fleet, WS, BS, Ld and a splinter rifle
Fire warriors have grenades, a 4+ save, and a pulse rifle.

the pulse rifle has +6" range and is better against armor, T2,3,4
the splinter rifle is better at T6, 7, 8.
They are even at T5, although even there the pulse rifle has +6" range.
With the BS adjustment, the firewarrior is better at shooting T3 and AV10, 11.
With the BS adjustment, the DE warrior is better at shooting T5+
Both are equal at killing T4 assuming range is not an issue.
DE are better in assault, but without grenades they still suck pretty hard.

The extra WS and fleet are not much use for the DE
The 4+ save is pretty great for Tau.

Comparing those two I would say the Fire warrior certainly isnt under priced

There's lots of AP 5 shots thrown around by troops. I'd say the 4+ armor is pretty nice compared to the 5+ of the DE warrior. The look DE players get when I start lobbing the incindiary whirlwind rounds is priceless. Especially from behind a building or something.

 PipeAlley wrote:
If anyone is interested:

Lootas will wound Tau at 48" at an average rate of 5/9 or 5pts of wounded damage, ignore armor, cover saves will vary.

At 30-18.1" FW's will wound Lootas at an average of 1/3 or 5 pts wounded damage, ignore armor, vary cover save.

At less than 18 (after movement even) 2/3 or 10 points wounded.

Shootas will wound Tau at 18" at 4/9 or 4 pts per wound but not ignore armor.

At 18" tau will wound, and ignore armor, at 2/3 or 4 pts per wound, cover saves will vary.

So compared to the Orks at least for shooting wounding purposes, not factoring in cover saves, FW's are priced EXACTLY the same as the Orks 2 most taken (overwhelmingly) units.

Please tell me that Shootas and Lootas are OVERCOSTED, and convince GW while you're at it.

And they all have Ld base of 7.

Yes, I setup very specific conditions but not horribly so. Realistic IMHO.

Comparing them with lootas isn't fair, because the lootas job does not include staying alive long enough to be scoring in round six. Likewise, the boy's have the ablative capacity to do it without help.

I don't think FW's are overcosted, but this comparison is weak.