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2013/11/19 23:08:24
Subject: Re:Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
Ok some intended to be seen as helpful comments for you:
The following features suck:
1. The Anima fantasy flooring. As mentioned by others the pavement and roads needs to be a lot more irregular. Frankly I was put off by this.
2. Individual tilesets for the Hellscape. Now I am not a Hellscape customer so take this with a pinch of salt, but I think there is a terrible error just waiting to happen.
Take a look at this:
You might not even have seen the error yourselves, unlike the other boards this one has not been shown as a 4x4. Notice all the others fit together, this however has no correcting terrain, each tile from this one to all the others id individual and independent and unconnected. Irts all verty well to have funky scarring in the shape of runes, and perhaps you can pull it off but unless the scarring connects at the sides all you are left with are bathroom tiles with a wierd pattern. I suppose hell could be a grid of squares but it would make more sense of the scarring connected at every corner and side and formed pattern within the tiles.
Please show us a grid of all four (five) tiles together and you will see what I mean, or at least challenge me to show I am wrong and your vision fits together as a whole.
[/size]
Also some suggestions for you.
1. Please consider making some walls for the Anime Wars battleboard.
You have each tile connecting at yellow and black striped sections, wouldnt it be nice if those were doorways. A series of appropriate + , L and T sections would tern the board into a series of 2"x"2" rooms (holds?) to fight over.
2. Modify the Dropzone Commander Battleboards please.
This new board unlocked is four of Hawk Wargames 1"x1" tiles.
Might youi utilise the levity of having larger tiles to make the tiles less regular along the internal edges. It still looks too much like four tiles.
Also how are you going to raise or indent the grass areas? I wonder if it will remain practical to add a layer of flock ourselves for extra texture
Also consider adding feature Mr Lewis missed:
- Gutters and road drainage grates.
- Manholes.
- Some occasional irregularities like broken or raised/indented pavements. Please don't leave it prefectly smooth.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/11/19 23:09:45
n'oublie jamais - It appears I now have to highlight this again.
It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion. By the juice of the brew my thoughts aquire speed, my mind becomes strained, the strain becomes a warning. It is by tea alone I set my mind in motion.
2016/09/19 23:30:03
Subject: Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
Anime Wars:
That maybe a job for B4H!! will pass it on
Hawk Wargames Urban Battle field battle board.
The grass area will be recessed 1mm-2mm approx so you can add water feature, grass feature, rubble features or else. As for everything else we will pass it on to Hawk Wargames
This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2013/11/19 23:38:48
Regarding the Hellscape boards connecting together, this has been a concern for a number of folks. Is there no way to make the cracks go all the way to the edge, G&G? They don't have to line up with the next tile- they're cracks. But it would suck to have a gap with no cracks near the edges of each tile.
Hope that can be addressed
2013/11/19 23:34:52
Subject: Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
RiTides wrote: Regarding the Hellscape boards connecting together, this has been a concern for a number of folks. Is there no way to make the cracks go all the way to the edge, G&G? They don't have to line up with the next tile- they're cracks. But it would suck to have a gap with no cracks near the edges of each tile.
Kroothawk wrote:2.) Funny how projects from UK always distringuish between UK and EU (UK is part of EU and Europe).
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:Well projects from the UK can ship to the UK a lot more cheaply than the rest of the EU.....
GamesNGears wrote:Correct, there is no USPS version in the EU. So shipping to the Continent is different Thant the UK in terms of services available to us. When and if an EUPS is formed or a more harmonized postal service for the EU then no problem, but each nation has there own rules and customs.
Your kickstarter text says otherwise: EU and every part of EU incl UK have same shipping cost:
FREE SHIPPING to: USA, UK, EU, CANADA, AUSTRALIA, NEW ZEALAND, JAPAN & SINGAPORE.
And believe it or not: UK is indeed part of the European continent
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/20 00:30:47
Continent [ˈkɒntɪnənt]
n
(Placename) the mainland of Europe as distinguished from the British Isles
And by your logic, apparently it costs the same to ship to "USA, CANADA, AUSTRALIA, NEW ZEALAND, JAPAN & SINGAPORE" as well as every nation in the EU. Clearly, they're subsidizing the shipping, which is very nice of them.
I do the same thing when I ship Dakka Dice to Dakkanauts worldwide. Shipping is "free" for everybody, but it by no means costs me the same to ship to everybody! Really not sure where you're going with this, but the fact that the actual cost is different should be pretty obvious.
Most shipping services in the US make the same distinction here with shipping to the "non-continental" United States- such as Hawaii. Part of the US, but not part of the same continent... just like Britain
This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2013/11/20 00:49:59
2013/11/20 00:48:26
Subject: Re:Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
Kroothawk wrote:2.) Funny how projects from UK always distringuish between UK and EU (UK is part of EU and Europe).
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:Well projects from the UK can ship to the UK a lot more cheaply than the rest of the EU.....
GamesNGears wrote:Correct, there is no USPS version in the EU. So shipping to the Continent is different Thant the UK in terms of services available to us. When and if an EUPS is formed or a more harmonized postal service for the EU then no problem, but each nation has there own rules and customs.
Your kickstarter text says otherwise: EU and every part of EU incl UK have same shipping cost:
FREE SHIPPING to: USA, UK, EU, CANADA, AUSTRALIA, NEW ZEALAND, JAPAN & SINGAPORE.
And believe it or not: UK is indeed part of the European continent
Yes but we have a warehouse in the UK to service the UK and one in Germany to service the EU. ....Make sense? so it is separate... We have a dedicated UK service because our shipping dept is based in the UK. We would do the same if we were in any other country in the EU. So if we were based in France we would service France separately than the rest of the EU. If you want more explanation of why it is like this. PM us and our shipping manager who is into this will be happy to talk about it
This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2013/11/20 01:02:08
"Yes but we have a warehouse in the UK to service the UK and one in Germany to service the EU. ....Make sense? so it is separate... We have a dedicated UK service because our shipping dept is based in the UK. We would do the same if we were in any other country in the EU. So if we were based in France we would service France separately than the rest of the EU. If you want more explanation of why it is like this. PM us and our shipping manager who is into this will be happy to talk about it "
I defy this logic!!! Raaaa! Actually it makes sense... :p. Enjoying this thread.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/20 01:12:03
2013/11/20 01:14:29
Subject: Re:Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
I think this picture more emphasises other points than dismissed it. if you look at the picture there is a strip in the middle of the 4x2 bit - presumably where the 2 boards meet - that has no cracked effect at all. Gives the whole thing the look of 2x2 boards pushed together rather than a complete battlefield.
It's not really a be all and end all thing for me, particularly as I'm reasonable good at DIY and can probably cut out some "cracks" myself, but I think it is these bland strips that might be putting people off.
2013/11/20 21:17:10
Subject: Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
Oh man, I got so worked up about continents that I missed that pic
That actually looks better than I expected when put together. There is a gap, though... in the end it wasn't a board I was interested in so it doesn't really matter to me, but if the cracks could go all the way to the edge, at least at a few points, it would really help break up that bare section (which might look like a line down the middle of the table once you've got 6 boards together).
2013/11/20 23:53:25
Subject: Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
This is something we suggested in the early stages. The empty areas do have a fine sand feel to them. We will pass it on though. That said there is a rough fine sand feel to the clean sand areas. The new GW brown technical paint also adds more to those areas, just thought I should mention that as we have been messing around with those.
That said let us get all the four hell scape boards together for when you see it in full hellish glory. It looks quite neat. Should be done by Friday.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/20 23:54:27
The DZC board I saw at GenCon was not to my liking, but I will admit that perhaps I am not their target audience for that board as RiTides, whom I consider a reasonably level headed fellow disagreed with me on that board, but the brick work and the cobblestone on the fantasy board could have easily been fixed with a few minor changes and been 10 times better, the space Anime Wars board was okay, if a little bland (in my opinion), but the hellscape board was a bit of a misstep and boring (I believe RiTides said that a cracked earth would have been a better choice/idea and I agree with that assessment, regardless of who said it)
I agree with you on the urban fantasy board, as we were both making the same points to G&G earlier - and I agree it could have been fixed relatively easily. But having said that, I'm just not going to ever buy it (when I probably would have). Ultimately, it's their loss. Pretty sure we're in agreement on the Hellscape board as well - and again a simple texturing of it would fix 90% of the issue - cracked earth would have been even better.
There has only been one Kickstarter that I've seen that I honestly wished was not successful, this is not it. My problem with this kickstarter being successful is that G&G is putting out what I think is an inferior product to what they could (see my suggestions earlier in the thread) and having people being okay with an inferior product simply because of the price/"deals" (also that GW mat doesn't exist anymore, sadly), thus why I compared it to how I feel whenever I walk into an Apple store. They have put out a good product, and they're very good with their image, but they try to sell you an inferior product and people lap it up because of some reason or another.
Being quite blunt, the whole hobby is filled with "almost were" and "might have been" and "so close buy missed it" -level products, from Workshop on down. I'm just willing to ignore (and not buy) their sub-par products and pick up the better ones, just as I am with anyone else.
GamesNGears wrote: wow what happened here.
If you are really passionate and really want to have a good discussion about certain aspects and help us constructively then send us a PM. As we have not received any from those few same posters who may have issue... and received a lot from those who are interested and want to see us do more and improve here since the inception of the this thread which has been here for a long time . We understand trying to sway and change perceptions for the better or worse. The best we can do is make good products and give good value to our backers .
The messages are right here, loud and clear in a public discussion forum. "Send us a PM" is a bs cop-out. It's up to you as the creator to actually engage with the customers, and if you're actually able to read the posts that are written here you're just as capable of pressing the bloody PM button. If you're too lazy to do so, then it's on you. I've made pertinent points on Kickstarter campaigns before and gotten direct feedback from creators and reps who've read the posts and been proactive enough to press the PM button themselves. I hardly think I'm a unique special snowflake in that regard.
Besides, when I asked about adding a third board, you politely suggested to me that I should just buy four instead.
@RT - regardless, they skip over any criticisms- constructive or not, refuse to address concerns, and generally just pick up on the "we LOVE it" aspects of posts. They did it yet again to your post.
I look forward to seeing how this campaign goes once the EBs run out and what happens if the 5th and 6th boards for the existing designs don't unlock...
I agree with you on the urban fantasy board, as we were both making the same points to G&G earlier - and I agree it could have been fixed relatively easily. But having said that, I'm just not going to ever buy it (when I probably would have). Ultimately, it's their loss. Pretty sure we're in agreement on the Hellscape board as well - and again a simple texturing of it would fix 90% of the issue - cracked earth would have been even better.
Azazelx, sometimes I really wonder if you skip reading some posts; earlier in this thread GamesNGears responded to Orlanth saying the Anima fantasy boards are being revamped and they have said as much on their Kickstarter. Actual quotes in spoiler below or you can scroll to the top of page 23.
Besides, when I asked about adding a third board, you politely suggested to me that I should just buy four instead.
I actually thought you were a bit ridiculous asking to add another board at early bird price after you already grabbed an early bird for a lower amount of tables. When you snagged your early bird, the early bird with one more board was still open which you could of grabbed. It smacked of entitlement/laziness to me. Heck, even now you can create a second account and snag a single board early bird; a bit underhanded, but...
@RT - regardless, they skip over any criticisms- constructive or not, refuse to address concerns, and generally just pick up on the "we LOVE it" aspects of posts. They did it yet again to your post.
Actually, they have responded to criticisms and are making changes to the Anima Fantasy Board, they are doing the "wait and see it all together" tactic with the Hellscape board and actually doing suggestions from backers like doing the Deadzone overlays. So to me it looks like they are trying to address some concerns. Perhaps I'm willing to give them some leeway since their brushes kickstarter was the only one to deliver on time of the eight I should of received stuff for.
I look forward to seeing how this campaign goes once the EBs run out and what happens if the 5th and 6th boards for the existing designs don't unlock...
As do I; be interesting to see how they react and how the backers react. See what they do to make it all work to their benefit.
2013/11/21 18:54:36
Subject: Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
RiTides wrote: Oh man, I got so worked up about continents that I missed that pic .
BTW first entry when googling Europe:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe Somehow, they call the whole of Europe a continent.
It is only the Brits, that claim not being part of the continent and the EU and UK warehouses not being in the EU or on the European continent. Just saying
If it looked something like that, it could be useful to a lot of people, since it could pass for any generic old European town.
And now that we can see the layout for the 28mm urban boards, those are a little disappointing as well. With the selection of road pieces (one 4-way, one straight, and two t-junctions), there really aren't very many ways to lay out the roads without abrupt dead ends. I think those board layouts were very poorly planned.
2013/11/21 20:12:19
Subject: Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
Azazelx, sometimes I really wonder if you skip reading some posts; earlier in this thread GamesNGears responded to Orlanth saying the Anima fantasy boards are being revamped and they have said as much on their Kickstarter. Actual quotes in spoiler below or you can scroll to the top of page 23.
Posting as I read through the thread, darling. This means I don't read through the entire thread before replying to individual posts. For example, I'm not reading the last post in this thread before replying to you right now. So on the Anima tactics board -
1) that's great that they're finally listening to the feedback, and
2) like a lot of other people in this thread, I had no idea they were doing it, since
3) I didn't see it mentioned in the updates, possibly
4) because I don't really read KS comments sections, so many of us miss whatever KS creators have to say in those unless others repeat them later.
I actually thought you were a bit ridiculous asking to add another board at early bird price after you already grabbed an early bird for a lower amount of tables. When you snagged your early bird, the early bird with one more board was still open which you could of grabbed. It smacked of entitlement/laziness to me. Heck, even now you can create a second account and snag a single board early bird; a bit underhanded, but...
Entitlement? Really? It's a business transaction. They're not my friends and they're not doing me a favour by letting me spend money with them any more than any of us are doing them a favour by supplying the seed money to fund their products. Adding another is actually standard in a lot of KS campaigns in the miniatures/wargaming space - people pick up an early bird moogle, and later on decide that they would like/can afford an additional moogle but not lose their EB slot. Given that this campaign ends on Christmas Day, throwing an additional $100 at them isn't anything I want to commit to. Also, do you think I'm the only person backing this Kickstarter that might want to add an additional board down the line? Do you think many people with an EB slot are going to be happy to add an extra board for +50% or almost double their EB amount? That's called leaving money on the table.
Now, given that they very much appear to want to increase the average spend per backer, and that I (and presumably some other people) have no interest in trays or resin scenery, a pretty simple way of bumping that number is to allow people to add more boards if they're not interested in any of the other extraneous junk they're selling. Now, I have indeed gotten my wife to pledge for a single additional board with her account - don't you read the posts you're actually replying to? - and assuming we both stay in, G&G get to pay postage for two separate packages instead of combining the two. Same deal with anyone who managed to snag two singles rather than the double set. If we drop, an EB slot will open up in the final hour, which means we're squatting on what could potentially be another backer who might be interested in their scenery or trays.
Yep, perfect solution.
See, I'm actually in the I'm Alright Jack position on this and have been since 10 minutes after they sent me their rather shortsighted reply. I can keep both pledges and have three boards, or drop either and have one or two - or even drop both if money is tight for Christmas. Whether they change their silly restrictions or not, it won't affect me. It doesn't stop me from feeding back to G&G that it's a bloody stupid idea.
Actually, they have responded to criticisms and are making changes to the Anima Fantasy Board, they are doing the "wait and see it all together" tactic with the Hellscape board and actually doing suggestions from backers like doing the Deadzone overlays. So to me it looks like they are trying to address some concerns. Perhaps I'm willing to give them some leeway since their brushes kickstarter was the only one to deliver on time of the eight I should of received stuff for.
Well, if you read through the earlier parts of this very thread, you can see where they simply skip over the issues people highlighted with the Anima Tactics board, without even a token "we'll look into it". Instead, they chose to pick up on the comments from others saying that they liked the design, and simply parroted that back in their reply about HOW AMAZING EVERYTHING IS. Kickstarter comments sections are generally spam-filled shitholes, that are incredibly difficult to wade through since it's like one long painful twitter conversation thread - so I don't find them at all useful for following or interacting...
I'll be blunt - I'm less likely to give them leeway on anything since they refuse to engage with anything (here at least) besides cheerleading. Compare that to someone like Mark from DFG who takes time to address people's concerns and therefore retains an enormous amount of goodwill despite his KS being over a year late now.
I look forward to seeing how this campaign goes once the EBs run out and what happens if the 5th and 6th boards for the existing designs don't unlock...
As do I; be interesting to see how they react and how the backers react. See what they do to make it all work to their benefit.
If they can. I think the long, long campaign and choice to end it on Christmas Day is going to hurt them a lot more than it helps...
edit - fixed quote tags
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/21 20:21:24
RiTides wrote: Oh man, I got so worked up about continents that I missed that pic .
BTW first entry when googling Europe:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe Somehow, they call the whole of Europe a continent.
It is only the Brits, that claim not being part of the continent and the EU and UK warehouses not being in the EU or on the European continent. Just saying
UK is in Europe has been for 1000s of years!!! I think you mean European Union (the political governing union) which not everyone (Euro Country) is in the E.U. The KS is non political. It's really because our Forwarders class UK and EU separately. That is pretty much it!
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2013/11/21 21:24:45
Azazelx, sometimes I really wonder if you skip reading some posts; earlier in this thread GamesNGears responded to Orlanth saying the Anima fantasy boards are being revamped and they have said as much on their Kickstarter. Actual quotes in spoiler below or you can scroll to the top of page 23.
Posting as I read through the thread, darling. This means I don't read through the entire thread before replying to individual posts. For example, I'm not reading the last post in this thread before replying to you right now.
That's probably not for the best, and something you might want to revise going forward.
2013/11/21 21:27:56
Subject: Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
3) I didn't see it mentioned in the updates, possibly
Well doll, it was mentioned in update #4 and I quote
Update #4 Nov 18, 2013
Table of Contents for this Update:
-Anima Revamp, how long?
The revamp is under way. We should have a target date for release of the revamp picture designs on the 19th of Novemeber 2013. Ninja Division have had a Ninja G5 Summit and are ready to show you awesome. It's really cool. Thank you for your patience it will certainly be worth it.
I will not lie and say I am not disappointed that it's two days past the supposed share date of the revamp, but honestly I'm not in it for that board.
If they can. I think the long, long campaign and choice to end it on Christmas Day is going to hurt them a lot more than it helps...
I agree wholeheartedly with you on this one. Right now I'm alright with what they have shown but not overall excited for the boards. Depending on how my group reacts to the boards, I may be dropping my pledge and make my own stuff. Well crap, now I sound like you, Azazelx dear.
2013/11/21 22:26:16
Subject: Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
I'm still in for two, wish I could do more. Sci Fi and Anima, especially if it gets a revamp.
"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke
2013/11/21 22:28:24
Subject: Re:Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
The new road for Anima so far is close to this. Still being worked on
Thank you for the update. That is good news. If the stones in the street end up less "pointy" and more rounded with little gaps in between, like the cobblestones in that picture, and the brick paving is staggered like that, I will definitely be interested. Then I could use it for a fantasy urban area, or a European town for Bolt Action games. I will keep my eye out for updates on the Kickstarter page.
I still think the 28mm sci-fi urban board should have something else, maybe a straight street or dead end, instead of the second T-junction, so there are more possible useful layouts.
2013/11/21 22:33:36
Subject: Re:Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
The 2x1 shot for the hellscape board looks promising. There's really only one place to see the bars that come about from tiling, so it's hard to say for sure, but it looks like it might be okay.
If I remember when I'm sitting at my desk and have some photo editing software, I'll grab pictures from the 3 tiles that have been posted and try and mock up a 2x3 pattern with them... see what it looks like then.
2013/11/21 22:36:50
Subject: Re:Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
The new road for Anima so far is close to this. Still being worked on
Thank you for the update. That is good news. If the stones in the street end up less "pointy" and more rounded with little gaps in between, like the cobblestones in that picture, and the brick paving is staggered like that, I will definitely be interested. Then I could use it for a fantasy urban area, or a European town for Bolt Action games. I will keep my eye out for updates on the Kickstarter page.
I still think the 28mm sci-fi urban board should have something else, maybe a straight street or dead end, instead of the second T-junction, so there are more possible useful layouts.
Thank you for your interest Albino Squirrel, we are just waiting for the final proofs to post it up. Ninja's (Ninja Division) are working hard to get it done and approved. From what we have seen, the road is like the picture you showed . We hope to update all as soon as we get the heads up. Would love to see some Bolt Action games on the Anima Battle Boards, Warlord crew are awesome.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Lansirill wrote: The 2x1 shot for the hellscape board looks promising. There's really only one place to see the bars that come about from tiling, so it's hard to say for sure, but it looks like it might be okay.
If I remember when I'm sitting at my desk and have some photo editing software, I'll grab pictures from the 3 tiles that have been posted and try and mock up a 2x3 pattern with them... see what it looks like then.
We are just waiting for the paint to dry on the alt base painted version we worked on this week for Hellscape. Hoping to post something tomorrow or over the weekend . Mock up would be cool
I'll be honest, most of the problems people are having with this Kickstarter are either unconvincing or uninteresting to me. People don't love the product? OK. G&G seem to be responding fine to the criticism for my tastes.
HOWEVER, the business about the end date is compelling. I'm backing, for one board, and I'm even wavering on that a little bit. Ending a week or two after Christmas, even if that meant delaying the launch by a couple weeks, would have made backing this MUCH easier. The last thing I need on Christmas day is an extra $100 disappearing from my checking.
2013/11/21 23:14:36
Subject: Games & Gears Kickstarer Battleboards - NOW ACTIVE!
tomjoad wrote: I'll be honest, most of the problems people are having with this Kickstarter are either unconvincing or uninteresting to me. People don't love the product? OK. G&G seem to be responding fine to the criticism for my tastes.
HOWEVER, the business about the end date is compelling. I'm backing, for one board, and I'm even wavering on that a little bit. Ending a week or two after Christmas, even if that meant delaying the launch by a couple weeks, would have made backing this MUCH easier. The last thing I need on Christmas day is an extra $100 disappearing from my checking.
We completely understand, we do have the KS backers kit to sort this out just in case you do miss something out. But we hope to have much of the options and more out before the 15th-19th of December so backers can add everything they want prior the final date. However your support during the campaign and getting everything you want is very much appreciated and thanks
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/21 23:16:35
as mentioned on the 
. It will happen! 
