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phatonic wrote:

trentblack201 wrote:
hoping for killa kans to become troops. that'd be killa. (of course, you have to bring a big mek)

*Cough* dreadmob *cough* (it'z bettah!)

The dreadmob has kanz as fast attack. Which is pretty neat, too.

If Lootas get nerfed....
Let's just say... Someone gon die!

if they get nerfed at all i'd see it in points not effectiveness. They weaken the strength, no point in taking it as we have tons of S5-6 options, the AP doesnt matter as it is (i think ive denied any save with them once? theres always a cover save since we are a hordy army and give our opponents Intervening Model cover), and if you give them Gets Hot or cut their shots down we will ignore them because now theyre pointless.

Actually if they made it straight up Heavy 2 instead of Heavy D3, theyd be used. Now its decent dakka and no chances of "Daaaaamn...i really needed more than 10 shots right now" at the cost of "OOOO LOTSA DAKKA!" lol.
Even if they were reduced to 10pts but were Heavy 1, i wouldnt use them. With ork BS, youre going to hit 3 of those 10 hits on average and you never pen armor with it.

After everyone and their squig bought 45 of them (which equals 12 Boxes of Lootaz/Burnaz), you can bet your bosspole that they are going to be overcosted and/or worse in our next codex.
Despite the impression you get from the high amount of talented converters and kitbashers here, most people actually just buy lootaz instead of building their own, GW probably already made as much money from them as possible.

If in doubt look at fire dragons, razorbacks, flamers of tzeench or broadsides.

-Waaagh! Needs to be reworked
-Lootas will probably get nerfed, and I think it will probably be a matter of points
-A way to buff Dreads without making them MCs
-A few options to take the sting out of overwatch--I think a trukk/bw upgrade that allows units assaulting out of the transport to ignore overwatch would be nifty
-I personally like the idea of trukks getting junk better then making them AV11, it seems more thematic somehow

And, overall, restoring Orks restoring the assault power of orks

The alien Codices have lately been giving out some rather powerful and characterful army wide abilities like Supporting Fire and Ethereal buffs for Tau and Battle Focus for Eldar. For Orks, I would nominate Mobbing Up. Considering the poor armour saves of Orks, and how assaulting is riskier in this edition, it makes sense that there should be a means for them to absorb casualties. They should also be able to get an Initiative bonus when charging. It is neither fluffy nor helpful in-game to have a horde of Orks reach a line of Guardsmen then stand there waiting to be hit on the head. Orks swinging at the same time as Necrons and Fire Warriors? Nope, sorry, I just don't buy it.

Make Kanz more survivable. Either give them 3HP or follow the route of FW Grot Tanks and give them an invulnerable save to represent how a shot is more likely to just blast off some random bit of non-essential scrap. I'd also be happy if this was an upgrade that could be bought for any walker.

An Ork-specific psychic discipline and access to rulebook disciplines. Biomancy and Pyromancy would fit particularly well.

More blast weapons. I don't buy the idea that Orks would be satisfied with the bog-standard krak rokkit they're limited to now.

Dare I say it...? Orks to get either STR 4 or I3 as standard (or both ). They should be the melee army.

*Cough* dreadmob *cough* (it'z bettah!)

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1230512a_NEW!_Ork_Datasheet_-_Dred_Mob

Is this the dreadmob build? If it is, looks pretty sweet. Is it 40k approved?

trentblack201 wrote:

*Cough* dreadmob *cough* (it'z bettah!)

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1230512a_NEW!_Ork_Datasheet_-_Dred_Mob

Is this the dreadmob build? If it is, looks pretty sweet. Is it 40k approved?

40k approved indeed. (the one from IA:8)

Speaking of, I would absolutely love being able to take Deff Dreads in mobs of 1-3. I think that would solve all the current problems with them. Killa Kans could be kicked up to 1-5 to compensate for only having 2 Hull Points.

Killa kans need more hull points or a 5+ inv save

 zammerak wrote:
Killa kans need more hull points or a 5+ inv save

Not really comparing it to their price they are pretty good. Sure they could be buffed but if so the point price would be too.

This is true but without a KFF they just get glanced to death

trentblack201 wrote:

*Cough* dreadmob *cough* (it'z bettah!)

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1230512a_NEW!_Ork_Datasheet_-_Dred_Mob

Is this the dreadmob build? If it is, looks pretty sweet. Is it 40k approved?

Thats an Apocalypse formation. Dread Mob is completely different. PM me and I'll chuck you a copy of GW's free, legal Dread Mob army list.

 Jidmah wrote:
After everyone and their squig bought 45 of them (which equals 12 Boxes of Lootaz/Burnaz), you can bet your bosspole that they are going to be overcosted and/or worse in our next codex.
Despite the impression you get from the high amount of talented converters and kitbashers here, most people actually just buy lootaz instead of building their own, GW probably already made as much money from them as possible.

If in doubt look at fire dragons, razorbacks, flamers of tzeench or broadsides.

The thing is though all of those examples were CRAZY good, not just good.
Lootas lack that level of presence. Theyre probably a notch above Good unit quality, which is nowhere near "You are a total idiot for not taking as many as you can" type good.

What tau, allied or straight, didnt have 3 broadsides? None. For 260 or so points they clobbered EVERYTHING except sheer numbers. They needed a nerf, but i think they went too far on it personally.

If they nerf the Loota to the same level so noone takes them (Broadsides atleast they gave an alternative role they do fine in), they better buff the rest of the codex like crazy. I can easily believe Lootas are the reason orks are even playable right now.

lots of stuff is needed, maybe a slightly less random wierdboy for one... but there is one thing that orcs really really need. and that's some sort of I buff when they charge again. 30 orks could charge a normal unit of GH and i'd be surprised if they came out of it alive. that ain't right.

but ya i'll +1 to the MC squig

 Vineheart01 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
After everyone and their squig bought 45 of them (which equals 12 Boxes of Lootaz/Burnaz), you can bet your bosspole that they are going to be overcosted and/or worse in our next codex.
Despite the impression you get from the high amount of talented converters and kitbashers here, most people actually just buy lootaz instead of building their own, GW probably already made as much money from them as possible.

If in doubt look at fire dragons, razorbacks, flamers of tzeench or broadsides.

The thing is though all of those examples were CRAZY good, not just good.
Lootas lack that level of presence. Theyre probably a notch above Good unit quality, which is nowhere near "You are a total idiot for not taking as many as you can" type good.

What tau, allied or straight, didnt have 3 broadsides? None. For 260 or so points they clobbered EVERYTHING except sheer numbers. They needed a nerf, but i think they went too far on it personally.

If they nerf the Loota to the same level so noone takes them (Broadsides atleast they gave an alternative role they do fine in), they better buff the rest of the codex like crazy. I can easily believe Lootas are the reason orks are even playable right now.

I sort of disagree here, I never take lootas instead I choose Deffkoptas with twin-linked rokkits and put them in reserve to outflank and my army is doing just fine tbh .

On a side note I would rather have a bigger mega dredd plastic kit instaed that would be a MC than a big squig imo.

What actually works is heavily influenced by who you play and what army they are playing. If I'd go to one of my stores around 3 pm I could pretty much toss up whatever units I feel like and beat a kid playing one of the store armies into the dust. If I play my friends or some store veterans on saturday/veterans night, I better bring the most competitive army I can muster.

I could list all the advantages of lootaz over deff koptaz, but that would bore us both, and I don't want to force something on you that you don't like to play anyways.
Just think about this:
What other unit besides lootaz is able to reliably score first blood during turn one without the cooperation of your opponent? If you can't do that, you are giving a whole VP away for free.

I think if they want to readjust Lootas it'll end up being a strength reduction and a shift to Heavy Support. And then give them Lascannon equivalents, potentially with Gets Hot!, as an optional upgrade for free or 5pts a model.

Which would pretty much be the same as flash gits

 Jidmah wrote:
Which would pretty much be the same as flash gits

Speaking of, I was thinking, it might not be a bad idea idea to make Da Kaptin an HQ, and give him a Flash Git bodyguard. Either that or give gits a dedicated transport of some kind, or the ability to take a battlewagon.

As for lootas, I'd say keep them as is, except maybe give them an option to be skyfire/interceptor for a reduction to D2 shots? We need something for anti flyer besides the ADL and snap firing lol's.

I think by now GW has made quite clear by now that nothing besides fortifications will ever get Skyfire/Interceptor as combination ever again. Both tau and eldar were prime candidates for that, and neither got it. However, I can see lootaz gaining skyfire permanently, which would murder most planes, but reduce their effectiveness against ground.

 Jidmah wrote:
I think by now GW has made quite clear by now that nothing besides fortifications will ever get Skyfire/Interceptor as combination ever again. Both tau and eldar were prime candidates for that, and neither got it. However, I can see lootaz gaining skyfire permanently, which would murder most planes, but reduce their effectiveness against ground.

Riptides can have both Interceptor and Skyfire, as can Crisis Battlesuits.

 Jidmah wrote:
What actually works is heavily influenced by who you play and what army they are playing. If I'd go to one of my stores around 3 pm I could pretty much toss up whatever units I feel like and beat a kid playing one of the store armies into the dust. If I play my friends or some store veterans on saturday/veterans night, I better bring the most competitive army I can muster.

I could list all the advantages of lootaz over deff koptaz, but that would bore us both, and I don't want to force something on you that you don't like to play anyways.
Just think about this:
What other unit besides lootaz is able to reliably score first blood during turn one without the cooperation of your opponent? If you can't do that, you are giving a whole VP away for free.

Grot Bomms can do it. They have pros and cons as compared to Lootas but they can do it. Notably, because of the bogus barrage rules theres no way for the other guy to hide his fragile transport short of keeping it off the board

 Juvieus Kaine wrote:
I think if they want to readjust Lootas it'll end up being a strength reduction and a shift to Heavy Support. And then give them Lascannon equivalents, potentially with Gets Hot!, as an optional upgrade for free or 5pts a model.

I really don't want this. Call me old fashioned but I like the game better when the various army lists have strengths and weaknesses. I suppose the recent OP nonsense and allies shenanigans craps all over that anyway though...

 Jidmah wrote:
After everyone and their squig bought 45 of them (which equals 12 Boxes of Lootaz/Burnaz), you can bet your bosspole that they are going to be overcosted and/or worse in our next codex.
Despite the impression you get from the high amount of talented converters and kitbashers here, most people actually just buy lootaz instead of building their own, GW probably already made as much money from them as possible.

If in doubt look at fire dragons, razorbacks, flamers of tzeench or broadsides.

I bought lootaz as the actual GW kit...

Like, four boxes of them...

A squiggoth would be badass.
With lots of dakka options.
Some kind of deathroller style charge.
A large troop capacity up on the howda.
Some kind of crazy once a game charge accross the board move.
ridiculously hard to kill
Hilariously unpredictable (as orks should be)

Oh gods, I had a horrific thought.

Orks are, as one poster said, one of the most weird, unpredictable armies out there.

And the core 6e rules have a metric fethload of random tables.

H... How many random tables will the Ork codex have?

 Pouncey wrote:
Oh gods, I had a horrific thought.

Orks are, as one poster said, one of the most weird, unpredictable armies out there.

And the core 6e rules have a metric fethload of random tables.

H... How many random tables will the Ork codex have?

LOADSAH RANDOM! I TOSS TEEF ATH ME SCREEN BUT NATHING 'APPENS!

phatonic wrote:

 Pouncey wrote:
Oh gods, I had a horrific thought.

Orks are, as one poster said, one of the most weird, unpredictable armies out there.

And the core 6e rules have a metric fethload of random tables.

H... How many random tables will the Ork codex have?

LOADSAH RANDOM! I TOSS TEEF ATH ME SCREEN BUT NATHING 'APPENS!

So much random, if random were a molecule, we'd all be drowning in it.

So much random, you'll need to roll dice to see if you need to roll dice and then roll dice to see how many of those dice you need to roll.

So much random, that yo dawg we heard you like ran- :: splortch ::

 Pouncey wrote:
Oh gods, I had a horrific thought.

Orks are, as one poster said, one of the most weird, unpredictable armies out there.

And the core 6e rules have a metric fethload of random tables.

H... How many random tables will the Ork codex have?

Every unit will have per-model weapon tables to roll, as well as what their special rules are, because this will reflect the fickleness of orks, may be today they will fight with a choppa/big shoota, but tomorrow they might go with an umbrella/shoe lace, there is just no telling.

Also the preparation stage will take hours just watching the ork player rolls dice and writing stuffs down, better yet with orks vs orks.