Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So going by Robotech Battles ...

VF-1 Jet Mode

Speed (movement): 12
Gunnery (accuracy): 2
Defense (damage resistance): 6
Piloting (performance): 2

VF-1 Guardian Mode

Speed (movement): 10
Gunnery (accuracy): 2
Defense (damage resistance): 6
Piloting (performance): 3

Battroid Mode:

Speed (movement): 5
Gunnery (accuracy): 3
Defense (damage resistance): 5
Piloting (performance): 2

 Manchu wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:
Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.

Thanks. Any idea why Harmony Gold only got upset about the Veritechs? BT seems to use the destroid designs (or at least a few of them). Also, am I misremembering my childhood or wasn't Jetfire from Transformers a VF-1?

Jetfire was also changed from that in both future toys AND in his initial appearance in the cartoon to specifically not look like the original macros looking toy. Apparently there were some lawsuits flinged around regarding who could and couldn't use the design and the fight stretched into the 90's.

UN Test Pilot wrote:
@Manchu
The back ground of Robotech is ...

Thanks ... but I have seen RoboTech! (Okay, not in a few years but you know what I mean.) I was asking about the legal history between Harmony Gold and FASA.

 Manchu wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:
Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.

Thanks. Any idea why Harmony Gold only got upset about the Veritechs? BT seems to use the destroid designs (or at least a few of them). Also, am I misremembering my childhood or wasn't Jetfire from Transformers a VF-1?

they got upset about ALL macross designs. that's why there's no more warhammer (tomahawk), rifleman (defender), archer (spartan), longbow (phalanx), wasp/stinger/phoenix hawk/crusader (veritech valkyrie), marauder (glaug) ost-mechs (regult), etc etc.

and Jetfire was a Super VF-1S because they licensed specifically the Takatoku/Bandai toy of the Super VF-1S from Japan.
Harmony Gold therefore was never able to release a transforming Veritech toy.

Yeah misread your post edited my last one after I saw that.

 judgedoug wrote:
Harmony Gold therefore was never able to release a transforming Veritech toy.

That explains why I can only remember owning a diecast Defender ... I think I had Chibi veritechs, though, which could transform into Chibi battroids.

My apologies!

I was simply being honest about my satisfaction in the stretch goal, and what I intended to use the product for.

I used the Battletech names because that's what they are to me, and I thought it might be helpful to others like me who are seeking Unseen to see those names in a post.

All of my colorful characterizations of my low contributions were intended for nothing more than a laugh, and again to illustrate that I am not their target audience.


I am unreservedly thrilled to see both the quality and quantity of the models displayed, and will restrict myself to discussion of such in the future in this thread.

 Manchu wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:
Here's the best I could do for a TL;DR version of all the histories.

Thanks. Any idea why Harmony Gold only got upset about the Veritechs? BT seems to use the destroid designs (or at least a few of them). Also, am I misremembering my childhood or wasn't Jetfire from Transformers a VF-1?

It's my understanding that HG was pretty peeved about the whole thing. There are a good dozen+ crossovers in one of the first Battletech novels I ever read, with handy images in the back that make it clear exactly what is being referenced. Officers Pod = Marauder, Raider-X/Defender = Rifleman, Battloid = Stinger, Super Battloid (I believe) = Phoenix Hawk. Warhammer, Archer, there's a giant list that sadly covers most of the mechs I loved in both series, so I'm always annoyed when there's a Battletech game and it lacks those favourites (for good reason, of course).

As I recall, the Jetfire toy was literally a modified (in the production process) Veritech Fighter. Changed some of the colours, etc.

I always wanted one of those when I was a kid, and when someone pointed out the crossover years ago it blew my mind. Wish I could find one, but even a reasonable condition one on ebay is usually around "$Texas" by the time the auction ends.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Related to the KS campaign, I'll say this much; I'm honestly a little worried that the reports from Adepticon will be that the game is quick, easy to learn, hard to master and fun as all get out.

I'm not sure my wallet or I would survive the encounter if that's the case. I'm trying to avoid buying into extras, especially early (I'm lazy and don't feel like adjusting my pledge up and down every few days as stretch goals are hit), but by the end I know I'll probably be in for at least a 'booster pack' or two. Beef up the Destroid numbers, maybe enhance what the Zentraedi can field a little, keep things interesting without breaking the bank (much more than it already will, yeesh, $160 in, probably end up around 200+? Let's keep this between us, fellas, eh?)

A couple years ago, I came across a toy that appeared to have been made from the Jetfire molds, in a dark grey color. I have it in a storage bin somewhere in my garage, right now.

Just thinking about it from a robotech perspective... getting two core sets is still a better "value" than getting the $140 early bird set currently if you're building forces (assuming you don't put much value on the art print and single Rick Hunter sculpt). This is of course assuming that their offer of additional core set add ons at $70 still applies (which I can't find at the moment).

Two core sets for $150: 10 full Valkyries including two officers, 4 destroids, 24 battle pods, 2 glaugs (plus two rulebooks and double the dice).

Battlecry Level for $140: 8 full valkyries including two officers, 2 destroids, 21 battle pods, 1 glaug (plus art print, VF-1J Rick Hunter Battloid only, and bits for a VF-1S variant)

You make a good point, Warboss, but I suspect by the end of the campaign the Battlecry will be at least equal after accounting for all the stretch goals/rewards/bonuses/whatevers.

Also also, I think that breaks down the moment you go international (bloody US campaigns, grumble grumble). Battlecry for $170 versus 2 x First Contact for $220. I got in on the Blitzkrieg, so the lucky ones who got there it's actually $160 vs 220.

$50-60 for 12 extra models, and if they keep up the "paid/free/paid/free" pattern, the goal after 220 should be another free boost to the higher tiers. And of those extra models, most of them are more Veritechs and Battlepods, which I'm guessing would mainly be important if you wanted to try to run multiple games off one box (as I might) or have larger scale games. Otherwise, assuming you'd normally use a Battlecry box's worth of battlepods/veritechs at a time, it's really just $50-60 for 2 more destroids and an Officer's Pod, which you can buy for $40 directly and save a little cash if you really want them. Becomes even better at 220k, since you'd get an Officer's Pod and 4 Destroids (2 and 6 total, respectively) for that amount.

Shouldn't take too many of those to eat up the difference, especially if it's something like adding the 2 recently added destroids to those tiers outright, or something along those lines.

Edited out pedantry.

 warboss wrote:
This is of course assuming that their offer of additional core set add ons at $70 still applies (which I can't find at the moment).

I can't find this, either.

Oh, I missed that comment regarding cheaper extra boxes, but it strikes me as odd that they'd have a "buy as many as you like for the Early Bird price past the first box" as an option. Maybe hidden in the comments or the comments on one of the updates? I've been staying on top of this one, but I don't recall seeing that along the way.

Any chance you're misconstruing the notes on the two art tiers (that apparently also applies to the Rick LE battloid) where you can just add that much to your game box pledge and get them as well, as though they were add ons? (tiers as add ons.. that one took a bit to wrap my mind around; tierception!)

 Manchu wrote:

 judgedoug wrote:
Harmony Gold therefore was never able to release a transforming Veritech toy.

That explains why I can only remember owning a diecast Defender ... I think I had Chibi veritechs, though, which could transform into Chibi battroids.

Yup but they were chibi so didn't really count. They made a non-transforming Veritech that the Rick figure could pilot.

Forar wrote:
Oh, I missed that comment regarding cheaper extra boxes, but it strikes me as odd that they'd have a "buy as many as you like for the Early Bird price past the first box" as an option. Maybe hidden in the comments or the comments on one of the updates? I've been staying on top of this one, but I don't recall seeing that along the way.

Any chance you're misconstruing the notes on the two art tiers (that apparently also applies to the Rick LE battloid) where you can just add that much to your game box pledge and get them as well, as though they were add ons? (tiers as add ons.. that one took a bit to wrap my mind around; tierception!)

I tried finding it and cant seem to. The only thing I can find is a comment about getting two from a poster. Maybe I confused or imagined it but I could have sworn that it was there as my initial choice on the front page as I was hedging between the two (getting two core versus getting the $130 early bird). Eh, maybe the minmei attack threw me for a loop...

I guess I'll redo it from the perspective of someone pledging twice at First Contact Versus Battlecry.


Two core sets for $160: 10 full Valkyries including two officers, 4 destroids, 24 battle pods, 2 glaugs (plus two rulebooks and double the dice).

Battlecry Level for $140: 8 full valkyries including two officers, 2 destroids, 21 battle pods, 1 glaug (plus art print, VF-1J Rick Hunter Battloid only, and bits for a VF-1S variant).


The battlecry level would have to get another 2 valkyrie set ($25), 2 more destroids ($10 assuming the next stretch goal is met), half a battle pod set ($12.50), and a glaug ($20) for a total of $67.50. The two core boxes would have to get a Rick Hunter Battloid for $15. The art print and VF-1S bits (for me at least) roughly equal the value of extra custom dice and a 2nd rulebook to use at the table for a new relative total of

Two Core: $175
Battlecry: $207.50

for as close to an apples to apples comparison as possible (although this is admittedly a granny smith to macintosh one since you can't buy half a battlepod add on). I suspect we'll see some parity between the two in around another two free stretch goals.


EDIT: As Forar mentions correctly above, the analysis above is only true for US buyers. The comparison flips if you're playing international shipping twice.

Any idea where I can read any gameplay previews or comments. I kinda wanna know how the game plays before me or my friend might jump in on it.

Squad based, d6 + modifier rolling mechanics. Pretty simple and quick.

What I've been able to glean so far:

 Manchu wrote:
Mr. Siembieda confirmed it involves squadron-based activation turns, uses inches for movement measurement (not hex/grid), that there will be character-specific rules, that there is a MDC stat, and that one Veritech is worth about three Regults.

 Manchu wrote:
So going by Robotech Battles ...

VF-1 Jet Mode

Speed (movement): 12
Gunnery (accuracy): 2
Defense (damage resistance): 6
Piloting (performance): 2

VF-1 Guardian Mode

Speed (movement): 10
Gunnery (accuracy): 2
Defense (damage resistance): 6
Piloting (performance): 3

Battroid Mode:

Speed (movement): 5
Gunnery (accuracy): 3
Defense (damage resistance): 5
Piloting (performance): 2

There was a 'command' stat as well, it worked slightly like focus in war machine in that you dole it out to your units, providing them with a bonus to doing stuff.

Sorry that's kinda rambly, only go a quick walk through this morning.

Did you find out anything about the transformation mechanic?

 Manchu wrote:
Did you find out anything about the transformation mechanic?

No, but I'll likely go pester them some more in a bit... Since they are like 5 feet from me.

You have my thanks for any info you can pass along!

These sculpts look a bit unimpressive to me... anyone want to try to change my mind on that? They just don't seem very detailed, and are rather static... old school / nostalgia is cool, but only up to a point.

Well, as to them being static -- I believe they are poseable.

Other than that, I'm not sure how vehicle sculpts can be dynamic. Basing choices maybe?

The detail level seems fine relative to other mecha products:

The sculpts look pretty good to me.
I like that it sounds quick and easy to learn. It will be easier to convince my friend to get in on this to play. Awaiting any more info that sneaks out of Adepticon, hopefully it is good news.

 RiTides wrote:
These sculpts look a bit unimpressive to me... anyone want to try to change my mind on that? They just don't seem very detailed, and are rather static... old school / nostalgia is cool, but only up to a point.

They are indeed VERY static looking but then you get the odd man out that is posed much better despite them being identical sculpts except for heads. I don't know if that's just artistic license on the renders or what but the models shown so far look very static.



Take a look at the 5th battloid veritech who is "flying" with the clear flight stick. He's not the officer as the one next to him with the gun pointed up matches the VF-1J officer picture in the solo art so he's likely a VF-1A... Are they all poseable? Is just one of 4 poseable? One of two poseable since they're sold in groups of two? No idea.



Another good question for Cy to pass on as these appear to be renders photoshopped into a larger picture rather than actual models.

edit: It appears that the VF-1S image is in the "core" set. I don't know if that means that you get his bits there as well or if that's just an artistic short cut.

They are nicely detailed, panel lines are etched in and show accurate.

@warboss: Take a look at the VF-1S's left hand, too.

 Cyporiean wrote:
They are nicely detailed, panel lines are etched in and show accurate.

Does it look to you like (looking at Roy, for example) there are any decals or is it freehand?

I've been waiting for this since it was announced. Looking forward to seeing all the stretch goals.

 Manchu wrote:
@warboss: Take a look at the VF-1S's left hand, too.

 Cyporiean wrote:
They are nicely detailed, panel lines are etched in and show accurate.

Does it look to you like (looking at Roy, for example) there are any decals or is it freehand?

I believe it's freehand.