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**Cypher-xv**

It's almost the same thing Kevin posted last year. Only main difference I see is he promised 22 books this time. And why keep talking about secret projects and then say that they can't talk about it. He's just trolling at this point.

**JohnHwangDD**

I don't care about any of that stuff. Finish the fething KS, and give me my damn toys!

**Talizvar**

JohnHwangDD wrote:
I don't care about any of that stuff. Finish the fething KS, and give me my damn toys!

Truer words could not be said.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Forar wrote:
Ugh. There's a giant pile of nothing sitting on the PB site. I half want to quote the whole thing just to show that, and half recognize that doing so regularly could constitute a crime against humanity.

News about Robotech® RPG Tactics™ Wave One shipping to the rest of the world, FAQ, more detailed instruction sheets for building the game pieces, RRT Wave Two, and more will be addressed in the Robotech® Update going out in a day or two.

Well, at least they appear to be aware of the assembly instructions for being the steaming pile of excrement they are since they chose not to number sprues.
The part that bothers me is that I fully expect they will not get this right either.

COMING: A new style of Rifts® Dice Bag
We were never completely happy with the old style dice bag. Well, Alex tracked down a better quality bag, so we’ll be making and releasing a new Rifts® dice bag. The imprint will be a silk screen printing that should last much longer than the old dice bag and looks richer and classier. It is a very different look than the bag of the past, but we love it and think you will too.
Size: About the same as the old bag, but a nicer material.
Note: We may be offering a dice bag for select other game lines as well, like Robotech®.
Why is this included, as it doesn't pertain to Robotech specifically? Because that last line makes me laugh. "Hey guys, we MAY be offering other dice bags.
... they specifically said they were tentatively going to be offering a Robotech dice bag like a page above there.
Some top notch consistency editing right there.

Why? Of all the things to focus resources on?
We REALLY need those dice bags I tell you...
This corner of the market has always been handled by this:

Okay, that bit is in its entirety again, because I am history's greatest monster.
On one hand, I'm a little surprised that they admit to flagging sales like that. It's somewhat out of character from the "EVERYTHING IS AWESOME!!" stance that usually is taken, but on the other hand, there is sense of desperation/begging/calling out to the Fan Friends to buy! Please buy! That one dude who used to buy 3-10+ of each book stopped buying and please just buy buy buy!

Actually, I found this "Buy! please buy!" is fairly normal for them, the tone was different with a kickstarter and trying to get more backers or to buy more with the backer kits.

It's kind of off putting.

Desperation is never pretty.

Oh, and don't forget!
Robotech® RPG Tactics™ – Available now in the USA and Canada – coming to other parts of the world soon
There are going to be some cranky folks out there.

Intent or not, some troll appeared in this quote...

Ah Kevin, we just cannot make this kind of stuff up.
I really need to find better medication, obviously some people get some ace stuff.

**Talizvar**

Wow, no replies.
I think this thread may be dead Jim!
New thread to be made "Robotech Tactics RPG Wave 2"?

**rigeld2**

Not dead, just no reason to reply. It's more of the same from Kevin - a lot of fluff explaining why they fail.

**Forar**

I'm sure we'll have more to talk about when they finally get around to popping out that 'almost ready on Friday but it's getting late and woah now it's not quite ready on Sunday, give it a day or two' update/newsletter on RRT. So that might be today.

Or Thursday. Apparently an almost done document can take nearly a week to release.

Which is kind of this entire project in a nutshell.

**Conrad Turner**

Forar wrote:
I'm sure we'll have more to talk about when they finally get around to popping out that 'almost ready on Friday but it's getting late and woah now it's not quite ready on Sunday, give it a day or two' update/newsletter on RRT. So that might be today.

Or Thursday. Apparently an almost done document can take nearly a MONTH to release.

Which is kind of this entire project in a nutshell.

Fixed that for you, Forar.

Although a lot of people believe in Murphy's Law (What can go wrong, will go wrong!) I am firmly in the camp with O'Brian - who thought that Murphy was overly optimistic.

**JohnHwangDD**

Talizvar wrote:
Wow, no replies.
I think this thread may be dead Jim!
New thread to be made "Robotech Tactics RPG Wave 2"?

No, just nothing to react to. Models are being shipped, and people are heads down building stuff.

Also, let's not create new threads. Wave 2 belongs here.

**Forar**

Conrad Turner wrote:
Fixed that for you, Forar.

Although a lot of people believe in Murphy's Law (What can go wrong, will go wrong!) I am firmly in the camp with O'Brian - who thought that Murphy was overly optimistic.

Well, only if they actually release a proper Update 'update', and not just an 'update in the form of a newsletter on our site that's like 70% copy/pasted advertisements for unrelated stuff'.

That said... has anyone actually heard from Wayne lately? Other than getting a bit defensive on Mike's page when people got huffy with him a week or two back?

I wonder if he's on an 'informing people is for the birds' run for the time being? Hell, the last KS update (Dec 2nd) was Kevin. The last KS update that presumably was by Wayne was Nov 3rd, two and a half months ago.

Not trying to concern troll/drum up controversy. I'm sure he was bal... neck deep in shipping and boxes and begging international shippers for a better rate, but he's been awfully quiet of late.

**Jihadin**

Well I'm at touch up painting on Robotech
Need to strip some Blood Angels Termies to repaint as Ghost Bear...
A team of Wrack was brought...
Four squads of Space Marines to paint.
Storm Raven needs repair. Has the dynamic flight profile of a brick.
Still debating rather to make "X's" instead of "Crosses" on both my Valk squads.

Plenty to do till Wave Two hits retail..
but saving money in the oh Helmet jar for Harlequins sometime in the future but I think wife be all over that..

**efarrer**

Down to the last 12 or so mechs in wave one for assembly and looking at re-purposing some of the spare bitz.

Thinking with the right paint jobs those Gu11s could become plasma rifles for my Guard

**Jihadin**

Thinking Lascannon myself for SM

**Forar**

Well holy gak, they actually posted a KS update.

Update #167 Jan 13 2015

Shipping Update and a Few Other Things

Hey guys, it’s Wayne from Palladium. Here’s the latest.

Europe, Australia, and Rest of World Shipping

Europe: As we have mentioned previously, European packages are headed to Battle Foam’s UK warehouse, from whence they will be shipped to European backers from within the EU. It is our understanding this should save those backers VAT, which is why we are shipping by this method. The Wave One packages for all European backers were shipped from our warehouse to Battle Foam on Thursday, December 4. They arrived at Battle Foam’s Arizona warehouse on Thursday, December 11. Battle Foam was expecting to receive the ocean shipping container soon after that, but it didn't arrive until a week and a half later. The container, with a combination of our backers’ packages and Battle Foam’s own goods, left their warehouse on December 22, headed for the port in Los Angeles.

The ship that will take our container to the UK has experienced delays. It docked in Oakland yesterday after sitting off the coast waiting for almost a week. I know, because I've been watching it sit there for the last several days, apparently because the ports are congested (and we understand there’s a strike going on). After Oakland, Los Angeles is its next stop, where it will pick up Battle Foam’s container with the European packages, and head for the Panama Canal.

That ship is NYK Meteor. It just left Oakland today (January 13). As of yesterday, it was scheduled to arrive in LA on January 17, and eventually reach the UK on February 11. This was already a week or two behind schedule. However, I refreshed the shipping line’s web page right before posting this update, and the dates just changed dramatically. Now it shows it being scheduled to reach LA on January 26, a whopping nine days later than it what showed just yesterday.

Here is NYK’s page where you can see the ship’s schedule: http://www2.nykline.com/vesselsearch/displaySchedule.nyk?vesselName=NYK+METEOR

And here’s a story from earlier today that paints a pretty bleak picture of the current situation at the ports: http://www.ihsmaritime360.com/article/16133/war-of-words-escalates-in-us-dockworkers-dispute

I’m sorry, guys. We had no idea it would take this long for your stuff to reach you. When we shipped it out over a month ago, we thought it would be aboard ship and nearly to the UK or even there and shipping by now. Unfortunately, there’s nothing we can do about it at this point. Your rewards are in a sealed container sitting at the port in LA, waiting for the ship to arrive.

Australia: We packed up all of the Australian rewards over the next couple weeks after we shipped the European ones. I've been getting quote requests for a container to take them all to Australia, but the holidays interfered with that a lot, so they’re only now coming in. We’re hoping to schedule a container this week, which might take a week or two to be delivered. Then we’ll pack it and ship it out, and hope we don’t run into the kinds of delays the European container’s ship is hitting. Even so, travel time for a container from here to Australia is about a month, and that’s without any possible delays caused by the congestion and strike at the ports. I’m afraid we’re looking at late February or early March as a realistic delivery estimate for Australia. When we know more, we’ll report it here.

Rest of the World: When Australia’s packages have left the warehouse, we’ll begin shipping out the rest of the world. The good news for you guys is that we’ll send these packages directly to you, and you’ll likely receive them much faster, barring any delays in your country. Of course, that also means you’ll need to pay any applicable taxes, customs, fees and duty as normal.

We realize that no one is going to be happy with this news. We’re not either. And that brings me to something I wonder if I should have addressed sooner. Some people seem to believe we don’t care about our backers or fans, and that we have been taking our sweet time sending out product. Nothing could be further from the truth. Outcries of “lies” and “Palladium doesn't care,” are untrue. I say that as one of the people who has given up a big part of his life the past two years working on every aspect of Robotech® RPG Tactics™. I can assure you that creating a good product and getting it shipped out to our backers, worldwide, have always been our two top priorities.

Every new problem and delay is, as Kevin would say, “a dagger in our hearts.” If it upsets you, it kills us and hurts our reputation. If any of the delays could have been avoided, we most certainly would have done so. This is a big project with many partners and pieces. Palladium simply does not have absolute control over every aspect, as you can see from the long delay with the ship booked to carry EU backer rewards to the warehouse in the UK.

2014 has been a shipping nightmare for everyone. Our experienced broker told us he has never seen anything like the last year in regard to port congestion and work slowdowns due to the threat of a strike by dock workers. 2015 is not starting out any better. We could scream at our broker all day long via emails and telephone calls, but it wouldn't change a thing. We have to tough it out and wait, just like you.

From the start, we have given you release dates and ship dates as we knew them and as we ourselves believed them to be. As things change, we try to adapt to them as best we can and pass the often unpleasant news to you. Despite the problems and many delays, we choose to try to focus on the positive: that this is a game most of you will be pleased with, and it is just the beginning of something bigger.

Our plan for the future of Robotech® RPG Tactics™ is to make it everything you want it to be. We listen. We learn. And as we do, we get wiser, more efficient and have a greater understanding of what you need and want. We aim to kill with this game and want to make Robotech® RPG Tactics™ everything it can be.

Status of Wave Two Items

Wave Two is coming in 2015. We have not speculated as to when, because we get torn apart when we have to push back release dates. When we feel more comfortable with a projected release schedule, you will be the first to know. It will be this year. I can tell you that three weeks ago, Jeff Burke and I sent China changes and corrections to many of the 3D engineering models used for mold making and we are waiting for a progress report from them. I will try to post images of the 3D renders here as they are finalized and approved.

New and Improved Assembly Instructions

Jeff Burke is working on creating more detailed, clear and user friendly assembly instructions for the Wave One game pieces. This is also something we will probably be posting in small batches as he gets them finished. I will put links to them here in Kickstarter Updates as well as on Palladium’s website under The Cutting Room Floor and on DriveThruRPG.com as free downloads. The first ones should be available by the end of this week.

Adepticon – March 19-22, 2015

Palladium Books will be attending AdeptiCon this year. As it is our first time attending, we will only have two tables and a limited selection of products for sale. We are participating in the swag program, and there will be at least one Robotech® RPG Tactics™ tournament. There should also be some demos, too. We’re trying to organize more demo teams. Kevin, Jeff and I should all be present to chat.

FAQ

We have been working on an FAQ and will probably start posting a small selection and add to it over time. At this point, Megaversal Ambassador coordinator Patrick “Jake” Jakubowski will be running point on this, with input from the Palladium staff, Carmen Bellaire, Thomas Roach, Michael Arnold and others. Meanwhile, Carmen Bellaire, the co-author of the rules, has been discussing and working on advanced rules for the game.

Robotech® RPG Tactics™ should not be available in stores in Europe and Australia

We have heard the reports that one or more stores in Australia and Europe are selling Robotech® RPG Tactics™. What I can tell you is that Palladium has not shipped product to distributors or retailers overseas. We have no intention of shipping them Robotech® RPG Tactics™ product until our overseas backers’ rewards have been shipped. Likewise, we have not authorized a street date for sale overseas by the North American distributors who have been shipped product. We are looking into the matter, and hope it is very isolated. We apologize if these reports have caused our overseas backers more frustration.

So, in brief; a more honest recognition of the shipping situation (and that it is, in fact, really bad) was nice, though I'm sure it's of little solace to the people who still have weeks or months to wait for their first round of boxes.

They keep playing lip service to this FAQ/Errata thing. Stop talking about it and do it. Just... start the page and put up the 2 things that have been declared (GU-11 clarification, missile numbers and points costs adjustments). Well, unless those changes aren't "official" official. Which is why they need to be on the site.

And Wave Two this year, eh? There are 50 weeks left in the year, and let's be frank, you guys want (if not need) it to be ready by Gencon. So that's 6 months away. Considering the number of molds alone, I sure hope there is just a metric ton to show off shortly, because considering how long the first dozen models took, I have a hard time believing the next two dozen will go swiftly, even with lessons learned that first time around.

As has been pointed out by a comrade in arms, is that said with the same definitive tone as when they told me that RRT WOULD be at Gencon 2014? (Close only counting in horseshoes and hand grenades)

Edit: but let's not forget:

Wayne from Palladium, Jan 17 2014 on Update #125 wrote:@Forar: Robotech RPG Tactics, the game, will be at Gen Con. For sale. In quantity. There's not much question about that. (I realize some folks on here are questioning it, but there's no doubt in my mind.) We hope to have it well in advance of that, but the particulars of just how well in advance are what we're still sorting out.

So I know I feel reassured.

**Morgan Vening**

So, good news, PB have released an Update.

Bad news, EU date is unknown (but at least it's in progress, and even has URL's to ship tracking), Australian shipment hasn't left yet, and RoW is waiting on the Australian shipment to leave.

Also, they're stating as fact (twice) that Wave 2 will be this year. So I put the odds of it not being delayed to 2016 at about 3:1 against.

But yeah, most of it is the standard "We're doing stuff, but we're not gonna be specific in any meaningful way, just trust us!". And the usual "It hurts us more than it hurts you" pablum, though it didn't hit it's usual heights of martyrdom. So that's an improvement.

I do find it entertaining that THIS was the best they could come up with, given that it was apparently mostly written prior to Friday's Update, got pushed back twice (then, and again on Sunday), and the result is still pretty bland. Seems like standard practice from what I've seen of PB production.

**Joyboozer**

I'm guessing it took them that long to remember the ship details. Fethwits.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ha, that fethwit bad syntax got a c&d, classic!

**Forar**

Yes, yes he did.

And you might want to feth'ify that first one, JB. Seems the censor missed it.

**rigeld2**

" If any of the delays could have been avoided, we most certainly would have done so."

Why wasn't EU/ROW shipping figured out, I dunno, 6 months ago? Instead of packing boxes, it takes one person to make phone calls and schedule a container.

PB is working serially in a parallel world.

**Morgan Vening**

rigeld2 wrote:
" If any of the delays could have been avoided, we most certainly would have done so."

Why wasn't EU/ROW shipping figured out, I dunno, 6 months ago? Instead of packing boxes, it takes one person to make phone calls and schedule a container.

PB is working serially in a parallel world.

I also like the reiteration of "It is our understanding this should save those backers VAT,". Because it looks like they're further setting themselves up to absolve themselves if the worst should come to pass, and VAT is applied. While I sincerely hope EU backers aren't pinged (for their sake, not PB's), if it does happen, it'd be interesting, what the resolution would be, based on prior assurances.

I do know that the shipment to Australia is going to take a fairly severe whack, moreso if Aus Customs take a scrutinizing look. If it's assessed based on wholesale as a portion of retail (ie, $100US per core box) rather than the commonly used "manufacturing cost" some KS's put down, it's quite possible that shipping by slow boat will work out to be almost as expensive as just shipping it USPS would have been.

**warboss**

For anyone going to adepticon, it looks like you WILL be bringing your own painted minis.

http://www.adepticon.org/wpfiles/2015/2015robotech.pdf

A friend emailed the link above as he is going to the event and signed up for robotech. I'm not sure why (other than pulling numbers and sunshine out of a hat or rear end) they chose 400pts as the set army size when so many folks have trouble getting extra minis locally and the most common KS pledge will strain to get to 400pts whereas it isn't even possible for folks who just buy the boxed set to get there. While I understand that a tourney isn't the best event for someone not willing to invest more than just a starter's worth of minis into the game, it seems like the frequently lauded and plugged 300pt army that is more realistic (both in $$ and painting) would have been a better choice IMO for the first ever organized competitive play event. Also, they'll be using custom rpg characters as allowable.

**rigeld2**

warboss wrote:
Also, they'll be using custom rpg characters as allowable.

wat

**Forar**

400 points, Custom characters, WYSIWYG (but not for upgrades?) and painting requirements on a game that only North America is supposed to have direct retail access to. I mean, I doubt Adepticon brings in a big international crowd, but wow... just wow.

Especially since this is presumably the beta test for any tournament or larger event they run at Gencon later this year.

Wait, not just custom characters; enforced custom characters.

**warboss**

rigeld2 wrote:
warboss wrote:
Also, they'll be using custom rpg characters as allowable.

wat

It's not a complete free for all but they are allowing folks to customize their own special characters via the RPG rules in tactics to a limited degree. Without having ever played, I won't hazard a guess as to whether they're appropriately costed in that chapter of the book. It's all in the link provided.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Forar wrote:
400 points, Custom characters, WYSIWYG (but not for upgrades?) and painting requirements on a game that only North America is supposed to have direct retail access to. I mean, I doubt Adepticon brings in a big international crowd, but wow... just wow.

Especially since this is presumably the beta test for any tournament or larger event they run at Gencon later this year.

Wait, not just custom characters; enforced custom characters.

Where does it say enforced? I saw that you "MAY" create your own character but not that you must. I don't have the rules with me at the moment but do squadron leaders count as characters? If not, a special would certainly do the trick to be your army commander.

**dalsiandon**

Those rules look a lot like 40K rules to me. Hum..I wonder where they got the idea from.

Clearly the 400 points is meant as a way to up-sell product to the Battlecry crowd. Heck you can't even run a zentradi artillery squad without picking up 2 boxes since they run in squads of 6 but only 4 come in a pack.

But I can't fault the other tourny rules. Like I said look grabbed from 40k and they seem to do alright at 'Con tournies.

**Morgan Vening**

warboss wrote:
rigeld2 wrote:
warboss wrote:
Also, they'll be using custom rpg characters as allowable.

wat

It's not a complete free for all but they are allowing folks to customize their own special characters via the RPG rules in tactics to a limited degree. Without having ever played, I won't hazard a guess as to whether they're appropriately costed in that chapter of the book. It's all in the link provided.

Forar (among others) has mentioned that custom characters are heavily overpriced, so I'm not concerned about that being an issue.

The 400pts thing seems like it may be. That's 100 over what was advertised as "standard", and going off previous formation costs, could be 4 Valkyrie Squadrons (48+ models, with some upgrades), or a crapload of Battlepods. That's a lot of stuff to get done to Adepticon standard in 8 weeks. Heck, according to some reports it's a lot of stuff to get ASSEMBLED in 8 weeks.

And not one to do on a cheap budget. It's the elements of two core boxes for UEDF (2 Valk, 2 Dest), and if I'm not mistaken, a minimum of more than 3 core boxes to field a Zentradi force (cause the core box only really gives one Z Formation). Less so (obviously) for KS backers (cause of the extras in a BattleCry pledge).

There's also no mention of the "imminent" FAQ/Errata, so the "based on the RRPGT rule book" might conflict with some of the changes allegedly coming down the pipe. Cost and quantity of a certain Valkyrie missile package being one.

EDIT: And yeah, Forar appears to have conflated the two character specific rules. You must take a character, and you may take your own. Two separate restrictions.

**stanman**

Joyboozer wrote:
Ha, that fethwit bad syntax got a c&d, classic!

His melt down was pretty funny. Considering that there's employees of both PB and HG on the page maybe shouting from the mountains that you are selling knock off minis isn't the best of ideas? His understanding of IP laws is pretty bad too, he doesn't need to sell a single item they can still go after him for reproduction and distribution even if he doesn't make a dime on it.

**JohnHwangDD**

I don't see what EU / Oz is whining about.

PB did what people asked, which was to find a way to keep the fees and taxes down.

PB could have mailed them from the US a month ago, with accurate and current MSRP values on the manifests, rather than containerizing them to save on VAT / Import / Customs charges.

So you have to wait? Guess what, everyone has waited for this, and we've got even more waiting yet again. I'm just thankful that PB is committed to actually delivering. I see way too many KS fail to deliver (e.g. Imbrian Arts). Getting the toys we paid for restores a little faith.

**Albertorius**

test removed.

Reds8n

**Sining**

So if they're just getting container quotes for AU/NZ, wtf aren't they shipping out the ROW stuff while waiting for quotes? According to them, AU/NZ has been all packed up. I mean, how on earth do these people work? This is how much PB cares.

As for the rest of the world retailers that should not be able to get the goods, I'm not sure PB understands how modern commercialism works.

**Albertorius**

Also, I don't really understand why the hell aren't they shipping (or better yet, why haven't they shipped already) the stuff to ROW backers not from the EU/Australia.

What is the excuse in that case, exactly, seeing as they don't ship first to a central location?

**Morgan Vening**

JohnHwangDD wrote:
I don't see what EU / Oz is whining about.

PB did what people asked, which was to find a way to keep the fees and taxes down.

PB could have mailed them from the US a month ago, with accurate and current MSRP values on the manifests, rather than containerizing them to save on VAT / Import / Customs charges.

So you have to wait? Guess what, everyone has waited for this, and we've got even more waiting yet again. I'm just thankful that PB is committed to actually delivering. I see way too many KS fail to deliver (e.g. Imbrian Arts). Getting the toys we paid for restores a little faith.

Seriously? Four months past when it was released to the US, with in all likelihood two more months to go, before AU/EU get theirs, and you don't know what they're whining about? Everyone has to wait? That's kind of Orwellian. "But some people have to wait more equal times than others". If you don't think a similar percentage of North American backers (which would far outstrip what we've seen) would be furious waiting 6+ months after release, but it being available in their local LGS, then I'm at a loss.

Sorry, this is all on Palladium. Based on the last two large orders I've had shipped from the US of similar size (Fantasy Flight and WarStore), the amount I paid for shipping, taking into account the actual fee charged, and the amount on each base game that was already included (it wasn't free to send to US customers, just comparatively not much), I more than paid for the shipping on what I ordered. That Palladium decided to split into waves because they were that far behind, and so requiring two shipments, is completely their responsibility. And they weren't being altruistic when they split waves. They wanted to go retail, and it's the only way they could do it without having American backers angry at them.

Even if you dismiss that, the fact that they waited at least THREE MONTHS to get quotes for shipping (they should have been able to get accurate estimates 6 months ago), got stung an extra month because they waited until just before the holidays, and still haven't sorted it out as of today's Update. Though it's hoped it'll be later this week if you take their word for it. The likelihood is, it wasn't done because it wasn't important. Because RoW backers had already paid (and don't have a whole lot of recourse), and they wanted to go retail.

As for the costs, to save on VAT/Import/Customs? For the EU that's particularly relevant. On my order? If they'd listed what I'd paid (not MSRP*), It'd have been nothing. Zero. Zilch. Nada. Nil. Big fat O. They're doing it that way because THEY screwed up, but aren't willing to pay the price (higher shipping only because of split orders). They've distanced themselves on the VAT thing ("it should", "we hope", no longer "you won't"), and they also haven't answered the question on whether Australian orders won't have Customs charges passed on to them. It's likely ~20% of whatever AUSCustoms calculates the value of the entire shipment as (including the shipment costs and brokerage fees), whereas most backers (those spending less than $1000AUS, at the time about parity with the US dollar), wouldn't pay anything. So it's not "saving" us anything. It's saving them. And quite possibly, COSTING us.

* Using the MSRP value on the manifests is a strawman. We weren't charged that, and PB aren't going to claim that on the KS pledges. It might get evaluated at that before factoring in wholesale (now that it's been palletized), but it was a misleading argument to put forth.

You might not think it's a big deal. But then again, you've gotten your stuff from Wave 1, and are looking forward to the next bits. Not everyone is in that position.