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So say I have a destroyer lord in a challenge with the doom o malantai. And say a squad of termagants wants to charge in can they?

I would imagine so but you wouldn't get to attack.

But you could charge to give the get'im boss rerolls?

Chancetragedy wrote:
But you could charge to give the get'im boss rerolls?

Yes, you could do that. I didn't see anything excluding further units from charging someone in this situation, and the moral support section makes note of "one or more units".

 Kevin949 wrote:

Chancetragedy wrote:
But you could charge to give the get'im boss rerolls?

Yes, you could do that. I didn't see anything excluding further units from charging someone in this situation, and the moral support section makes note of "one or more units".

But since the people in a challenge only count as being in base to base with each other, does the initial charger count as having made base to base?

 Kevin949 wrote:
...and the moral support section makes note of "one or more units".

I don't really think that's any sort of wholesale permission to skip the rest of the rules. After all, the fact that other units won't be able to reach base contact and therefore won't be able to charge or pile-in, doesn't completely prevent the possibility of two units providing moral support (although it certainly makes it less common).

Well if unit A charges into the OP's situation and just makes it into b2b with one model only and unit B makes it in in a similar manner you could have a 3rd unit try to do the same.

If the doom was replaced by a dreadknight or daemon prince you could end up with quite a few units charging in to give moral support .

Pyrian wrote:

 Kevin949 wrote:
...and the moral support section makes note of "one or more units".

I don't really think that's any sort of wholesale permission to skip the rest of the rules. After all, the fact that other units won't be able to reach base contact and therefore won't be able to charge or pile-in, doesn't completely prevent the possibility of two units providing moral support (although it certainly makes it less common).

What rest of the rules am I skipping? If there are two characters involved in a challenge (which is really the only situation that would cause this) and another unit wanted to charge, what is stopping them? The assaulting unit CAN make it into base to base contact, but it just does nothing for them. The characters are "considered to be in base to base contact with only each other" but that is ONLY for the purposes of determining who can strike who and where wounds can get allocated.

More to the point, if the outside unit couldn't assault then a third unit involved in a combat that devolves to only 2 characters in a challenge with a third unit (not attached to either character) there would that third unit then be considered not to be engaged in combat and would consolidate?

 Kevin949 wrote:

Pyrian wrote:

 Kevin949 wrote:
...and the moral support section makes note of "one or more units".

I don't really think that's any sort of wholesale permission to skip the rest of the rules. After all, the fact that other units won't be able to reach base contact and therefore won't be able to charge or pile-in, doesn't completely prevent the possibility of two units providing moral support (although it certainly makes it less common).

What rest of the rules am I skipping? If there are two characters involved in a challenge (which is really the only situation that would cause this) and another unit wanted to charge, what is stopping them? The assaulting unit CAN make it into base to base contact, but it just does nothing for them. The characters are "considered to be in base to base contact with only each other" but that is ONLY for the purposes of determining who can strike who and where wounds can get allocated.

More to the point, if the outside unit couldn't assault then a third unit involved in a combat that devolves to only 2 characters in a challenge with a third unit (not attached to either character) there would that third unit then be considered not to be engaged in combat and would consolidate?

No they cannot consolidate.
"my units are involved in a multiple combat against an enemy unit that has been reduced to a single character. If that character is currently fighting in a challenge with a character from one of my two units, is it possible for my unengaged unit to consolidate and leave the combat? (p27)
A: No, though they do count for Moral Support re-rolls."

Chancetragedy wrote:

 Kevin949 wrote:

Pyrian wrote:

 Kevin949 wrote:
...and the moral support section makes note of "one or more units".

I don't really think that's any sort of wholesale permission to skip the rest of the rules. After all, the fact that other units won't be able to reach base contact and therefore won't be able to charge or pile-in, doesn't completely prevent the possibility of two units providing moral support (although it certainly makes it less common).

What rest of the rules am I skipping? If there are two characters involved in a challenge (which is really the only situation that would cause this) and another unit wanted to charge, what is stopping them? The assaulting unit CAN make it into base to base contact, but it just does nothing for them. The characters are "considered to be in base to base contact with only each other" but that is ONLY for the purposes of determining who can strike who and where wounds can get allocated.

More to the point, if the outside unit couldn't assault then a third unit involved in a combat that devolves to only 2 characters in a challenge with a third unit (not attached to either character) there would that third unit then be considered not to be engaged in combat and would consolidate?

No they cannot consolidate.
"my units are involved in a multiple combat against an enemy unit that has been reduced to a single character. If that character is currently fighting in a challenge with a character from one of my two units, is it possible for my unengaged unit to consolidate and leave the combat? (p27)
A: No, though they do count for Moral Support re-rolls."

I knew the answer, it was more of a rhetorical question, but thank you for including the FAQ on that as well as it kind of furthering my point that attaining B2B contact is possible but it does nothing for the assaulting unit other than get them engaged.

EDIT: I have been FAQ-trumped.

 Kevin949 wrote:
The characters are "considered to be in base to base contact with only each other" but that is ONLY for the purposes of determining who can strike who and where wounds can get allocated.

That caveat is not in the rules. Are you saying that rules like Mindshackle Scarabs can penetrate the "wall of challenge"? Sure would make challenging a Necron lord a lot easier, if all the models in physical base contact are eligible.

Page 64 BRB
"For the duration of the challenge, these two models
are considered to be in base contact only with each other."

Wouldn't that mean you could not charge a character who is locked in a challenge because you can't make base to base with the model because he is only in base to base with the challengee.

IXLoiero95XI

Challenges happen after charging.

 liturgies of blood wrote:
Challenges happen after charging.

This topic is about charging a model engaged in an ongoing challenge. So will already be in the challenge when charges are resolved.

@loiero95 That's the question ;p. I can see both sides personally and don't have a vested interest in either interpretation.

For being able to charge: the FAQ showing how a separate unit can't leave combat, so why can't a second unit charge into combat?
-The rule you quoted being the exception to only considered in base to base with... Being only for wound allocation and special ability allocation.

Against being able to charge a challenge: the rule you quoted saying that they can't be In base to base with anything but the challengee. So you can't charge anything you can't get in base to base with.

Chancetragedy wrote:
@loiero95 That's the question ;p. I can see both sides personally and don't have a vested interest in either interpretation.

For being able to charge: the FAQ showing how a separate unit can't leave combat, so why can't a second unit charge into combat?
-The rule you quoted being the exception to only considered in base to base with... Being only for wound allocation and special ability allocation.

Against being able to charge a challenge: the rule you quoted saying that they can't be In base to base with anything but the challengee. So you can't charge anything you can't get in base to base with.

Yes but as Kevin949 has already pointed out, the two models involved in the challenge are considered to be in B2B with each other only for the purpose of who can hit who. This would not prevent models from successfully charging, because they can be considered in B2B contact during the Charge sub-phase, but not during the Fight sub-phase once people actually start punching each other. This does lead to interesting implications as to what happens at the end of the Fight sub-phase when the 3rd unit is no longer in B2B with any enemy models, but does nothing to prevent the charge from succeeding.