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So we all know when the followers of chaos die there souls become apart of there chosen god or if they were chaos undivided, all the gods fight for there soul. We also know if a Eldar dies, there soul either goes into a spirit stone or is consumed by Slannesh (Although there are some exceptions with the Dark Eldar). My question is, what is the fate of human souls? Do they become apart of the Emperors presence in the warp in a similar way as a follower of chaos with there god? Are they devoured by entities of the warp or do they simply get subsumed by the warp? If they do become apart of the Emperor then what happened to Pre Imperial, Great Crusade and Horus Heresy era souls? Does this mean that the souls of the slain loyalist Primarchs are somewhere within the warp? Opinions?
GW dances around this a bit and probably are smart to do so. But mostly in the 40k world your soul gets sucked into the warp and consumed or obliterated.
If you read the first good background material about the emperor, the whole reason he was created was because the powerful shamans were getting their souls obliterated by the the strengthening chaos gods. So they all made a suicide pact to die at once and re-emerge as the emperor.
Well if you consider the book Imperial Glory canon...
Spoiler:
it is implied at the end that all the dead Guardsmen from it meet up after they're dead and maybe even get to see the Emperor. But this might have been a hallucination.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/05/08 12:25:00
Driven away from WH40K by rules bloat and the expense of keeping up, now interested in smaller model count games and anything with nifty mechanics.
Personally, I think Human souls just dissolve peacefully into the Warp, though it takes time to do so. Before the Imperium, the pre-Imperial Human gods (the Emperor did stamp out pre-Imperial religions - some or most probably weren't connected to Chaos - during the Unification Wars) kept them safe until they dissolve. Those gods 'died' when the Emperor took away their followers, or were destroyed when the Emperor began actively laying waste to entire regions of the Warp with his psychic might during the Great Crusade (which also removed the need to watch over dead Human souls).
After the Horus Heresy, the Emperor could no longer simply scour the Warp, so he took over the job of keeping an eye out for dead Human souls.
"In every age, in every place, the deeds of men remain the same"
i'd say that the soul matte gravitates towards the warp diety that its linked to. which means any anger will be taken by khrone and any lust by slaanesh. And the part that believes in the emperor will go to him and become one with him.
Like most things dealing with religions, there's lots of ideas and beliefs, but no proof of anything either way. There's a bunch of psyker stuff that can happen, though whether that's true or just a conceptualized way of interpreting a mundane event (as mundane as psychic material gets, anyway) is unknown.
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
I believe that unless your soul is claimed by a dark god such as in the case of the CSM, you just die. Simple as that. The chaos god's are not actually god's in the sense of the word that we know it, merely the most powerfull being's in the warp, which is a kind of alternate dimension, not the afterlife.
If you read the 5th Edition Chaos Demons codex for 40k (I have no idea if it's in 6th ed), the part about the Furies states that they prey on souls journeying through the warp, so I assume they just end up there and are absorbed by Chaos
Funny thing is that all those religious zealots of Imperium is worshiping something in the warp and as you know, humans are psychic race meaning, that they are like orks in one aspect. If they belief there is a god, then it will be in time. And this god will not have a random personality, it will be an exactly same thing as worshipers imagined (on global).
I believe, that W42k will end with galaxy wide realisation of humanity's upcoming doom which would send even more humans to fanatical religious frenzy, which in turn will give life to many more saints and most importantly, will work as catalysts for fifth chaos god to be born. His main mass is already in the warp, all that it's needed now is some significant event to force his consciousness to come into reality.
Btw: I believe that demons and eldar speak truth. Emperor is dead in soul and body, he will not come into reality any more. I think that his devise functions on his soul to serve as conduct for psychic energies of those who are sacrificed every day. Malfunctioning is due to Emperor's soul finally breaking down due to long, long overuse. As he finally will be disintegrated then I think that another alpha psyker might serve in his place just as well thus continuing astronomican's usage. It's shame, that demons couldn't to barter his soul among themselves. I would imagine that a chance to have him as their plaything would have a value which equals a free passage to deamonhood (mortal equivalent) and that would be still considered as bargain price.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/05/09 20:43:57
"If the path to salvation leads through the halls of purgatory, then so be it."
Death Guard = 728 (PL 41) and Space Marines = 831 (PL 50)
Slaanesh demons = 460
Khorne demons = 420
Nighthaunts = 840 points Stormcast Eternals = 880 points.
Evileyes wrote: I believe that unless your soul is claimed by a dark god such as in the case of the CSM, you just die. Simple as that. The chaos god's are not actually god's in the sense of the word that we know it, merely the most powerfull being's in the warp, which is a kind of alternate dimension, not the afterlife.
Except they have realms in the Warp in which they reside, and where their portfolios and areas of influence are hyper-personified and ever-present. The immortal souls of daemons and their servants supposedly spend eternity in these realms doing whatever it is their god does best. Death is the cessation of biological life, it has nothing to do with the concept of the soul, other than being generally considered the trigger that sends it on to some form of afterlife.
We would also need to define what a "god" is to say whether or not the Chaos Gods are or are not, in fact, gods.
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
Much of Chaos seems to be based on the Greek Pantheon, so my guess is a few worthy souls dwell with the Gods(Demon Princes) the unfavored are tortured for all eternity by demons, and the rest just walk around hades in a state of semi slumber.
Like the great storm of the Horus Heresy, the forces of the True Gods will descend upon the Emperor's minions. The stars will tremble at their passage and the mighty armadas of the Warmaster Abaddon will bring annihilation to a hundred worlds. Know this, for these things will come to pass.
The bad thing about Eldar souls after death is that they are STILL SELF AWARE, and are essentially eaten "alive" by Slaanesh unless they wear the soul-capturing stones.
They say these morsels taste so much better than the human "tofudebeest" souls.
I'm OVER 50 (and so far over everyone's BS, too).
Old enough to know better, young enough to not give a ****.
That is not dead which can eternal lie ...
... and yet, with strange aeons, even death may die.
Chaos worshippers are absorbed into their chosen patrons, their souls sustained forever. All other mortals spirits slowly fade into nothingness in the Warp.
- Page 6 Codex Chaos Daemons (perhaps a bias source).
Well, there's some contrdictions - courtesy of BL of course.
First - Eldars of the Fall - actually SoulStones ARE eldar souls bein' transformed by something in EoT (see Path of Outcast). Catch is - they're STILL conscious until turned to SS. Ten millenia after they died.
Second - resurrection of Cyrene gives some insight to fate of human soul. She remembers that something chased and then tortured her. But she remembers it barely and subconsciously. This means that while not self-aware, humans souls do NOT immediately fall apart in Warp after death. As she's surely not in Emperor's Grace, nor (as Cabal tries to recruit her) is real follower of Chaos(see The Betrayer).
There's strong possibility that "torture your soul for eternity" is not just a fancy speech of demons, so number of souls who were catched by them are still whole , but broken and warped...
"Life in the hive cities are tough and indeed thousands die everyday from starvation and disease. Often times, daemons come to areas of the warp close to cities and claim these unfortunate souls, regardless of their religious affiliation, to take them back to their region of the warp and torture them forever. Indeed is the life of a pathetic human in the 41st Millennium"
GW have never gave a solid answer from all the fluff I have read, do they ever?
For myself, I think that surely if emotion actually really does have a manifestable power (kinky gak gives slaanesh power, scrapping give Khorne power, plotting gives Tzeentch power etc) and so does belief (Gork and Mork are super nails because the Orks believe in them) then the trillions of humans that re indoctrinated to have utter and unquestioning faith in the big E means that
1. He is also hard as fething nails.
2. Some gak must happen if a true believer dies.
If that belief is what gives all of the Gods their power, then it is entirely contradictory to suggest that all of that palpable belief in the Emperor does nothing. The Orks belief in their Gods makes them tough, so too must the enormous amount of psychic energy generated by the literally trillions of human beings who spend all day praising the emperor.
We are arming Syrian rebels who support ISIS, who is fighting Iran, who is fighting Iraq who we also support against ISIS, while fighting Kurds who we support while they are fighting Syrian rebels.
resurrection of Cyrene gives some insight to fate of human soul. She remembers that something chased and then tortured her. But she remembers it barely and subconsciously. This means that while not self-aware, humans souls do NOT immediately fall apart in Warp after death. As she's surely not in Emperor's Grace, nor (as Cabal tries to recruit her) is real follower of Chaos(see The Betrayer).
What ever happened to her, I assumed she became some sort of Chaos saint or something?
Like the great storm of the Horus Heresy, the forces of the True Gods will descend upon the Emperor's minions. The stars will tremble at their passage and the mighty armadas of the Warmaster Abaddon will bring annihilation to a hundred worlds. Know this, for these things will come to pass.
resurrection of Cyrene gives some insight to fate of human soul. She remembers that something chased and then tortured her. But she remembers it barely and subconsciously. This means that while not self-aware, humans souls do NOT immediately fall apart in Warp after death. As she's surely not in Emperor's Grace, nor (as Cabal tries to recruit her) is real follower of Chaos(see The Betrayer).
What ever happened to her, I assumed she became some sort of Chaos saint or something?
So you didn't read "Betrayer" yet?
First of all, she'd got WB battleship named after her
Spoiler:
Guilt-ridden Argel Tal made "a pact with the devil" to ressurect her. Then Cabal agent spirited her away from dying WB flagship while Ultras , WB and WE slugged it out over Angron's "homeworld"...And that now she's no longer blind is a very simple and powerful metaphore.
I was always under the belief that the "average" human soul merely melted into the fabric of the warp as it is too "puny" to remain self aware. "Stronger" human souls (people like cyrene) may be able to retain some higher level of consciousness for a while before eventually being consumed/absorbed.
Psykers however (this includes ALL eldar) do remain "conscious" (though not to the same degree I imagine) after death, their souls string enough to not be instantly absorbed. They get to enjoy an eternity of torture or being incorporated into a larger warp being via consumption. "Before" the warp became so violent, psykers were able to force their essence into new bodies at birth.
Inquisitor_Syphonious wrote:All I can say is... thank you vodo40k...
Zweischneid wrote:No way man. A Space Marine in itself is scary. But a Marine WITHOUT helmet wears at least 3-times as much plot-armour as a Marine with helmet. And heaven forbid if the Marine would also happen to have an intimidating looking, vertical scar. Then you're surly boned. Those guys are the worst. Not a chance I'd say.
You have to be joking, weren't those guys bad enough in Legion?
Like the great storm of the Horus Heresy, the forces of the True Gods will descend upon the Emperor's minions. The stars will tremble at their passage and the mighty armadas of the Warmaster Abaddon will bring annihilation to a hundred worlds. Know this, for these things will come to pass.
is a very simple and powerful metaphore.