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 Perkustin wrote:

 Ovion wrote:
Actually, everything I've seen has said tied to the account as in: "Individual games will be tied to Xbox Live accounts, Microsoft said,"

If you can find something explicitly stating otherwise, but till then, I'll go with what little solid info we've got atm.

That's largely irrelevant, even if it's true that means that the only people that could play used games are those without an xbox live account who are offline. This is using the 360 system as an example, who says you will even be able to create an offline profile on the 1box?

as far as I understand, that is not true either.... what I read about the release notes said that the system will not require always online (ie Diablo 3) but will require an internet connection every 24 hours to be operational... and then you will have to have a code for the used game in order to play it at all..


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 SilverMK2 wrote:
With game installs and disc-less gaming i wonder if the disks will have some unique identifier on them the machine can recognise to prevent people just splitting the cost of a new game between them and then buying a play code for much less than the cost new...

As far as this goes, the that may not affect it, but the cost of the "play" fee may... I read an article on forbes.com that says the play fee for a "used" game might be the cost of the game brand new!

Update: There seems to be some indication that this unlock fee might actually be the full retail price of the game. That’s certainly what it sounds like from what Phil Harrison is saying here. If that’s the case, then how exactly do “used games” even exist at that point? This is only making things more opaque-- Forbes.com

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2013/05/22/microsoft-answers-xbox-one-questions-used-games-always-on-and-more/

 caledoneus wrote:

 Perkustin wrote:

 Ovion wrote:
Actually, everything I've seen has said tied to the account as in: "Individual games will be tied to Xbox Live accounts, Microsoft said,"

If you can find something explicitly stating otherwise, but till then, I'll go with what little solid info we've got atm.

That's largely irrelevant, even if it's true that means that the only people that could play used games are those without an xbox live account who are offline. This is using the 360 system as an example, who says you will even be able to create an offline profile on the 1box?

as far as I understand, that is not true either.... what I read about the release notes said that the system will not require always online (ie Diablo 3) but will require an internet connection every 24 hours to be operational... and then you will have to have a code for the used game in order to play it at all..


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 SilverMK2 wrote:
With game installs and disc-less gaming i wonder if the disks will have some unique identifier on them the machine can recognise to prevent people just splitting the cost of a new game between them and then buying a play code for much less than the cost new...

As far as this goes, the that may not affect it, but the cost of the "play" fee may... I read an article on forbes.com that says the play fee for a "used" game might be the cost of the game brand new!

Update: There seems to be some indication that this unlock fee might actually be the full retail price of the game. That’s certainly what it sounds like from what Phil Harrison is saying here. If that’s the case, then how exactly do “used games” even exist at that point? This is only making things more opaque-- Forbes.com

http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2013/05/22/microsoft-answers-xbox-one-questions-used-games-always-on-and-more/

All in the OP dude.

So... the Xbox One is always connected to the internet, and the Kinect is always on (even when the console is off)? That's not dodgy at all.

So in short, both Nintendo and Microsoft managed to sabotage themselves. If the PS4 gets the same game coverage as the Xbox, Sony swipes the ground with its competitors.

I've refrained from posting on here for a while now because I'm so damned angry. First off I'd like to make it clear that I have no loyalties to any one console or their manufacturer. I currently have a PS3 and a Wii, and have owned several 360's over the years (mostly because they kept blowing up). But from all I've read and all I've seen about about the Xbox 'Next' (I'm not calling it the One, that's a fething stupid name), I hope it crashes and burns horribly. It's such a shame, it really is. I'd love to see some genuine competition amongst the new gen of consoles I really would. But that is just not going to happen now is it? Because no matter if the PS4 is a hunk of junk, all Sony have to do is to ensure that it's as good as the PS3 and the Xbox is finished. I'm afraid I can't include the Wii U here because it's not a 'proper' console. Oh it has it's good points I'm sure, but it just seems a little gimmicky to me.

Speaking of gimmicky, Kinect 2... Oh my fething good god and all his little angels. That thing is freaky, with it's 'always on' function and it's beady little Red Eye staring at you and yours the whole time. Never mind the actual Xbox Next. Did it ever cross the designers minds that that thing is fething ugly? It looks like a metal Battenburg cake FFS..And that's before we get to the real killers for me. Playing games from the HDD and that fething fee to unlock preowned games

First things first, the HDD is 500gb, correct? Well, throw in a few games, themes, game saves, music and movies and that thing will fill up damn quickly. And Microsoft want it to be a jack of all trades Home Entertainment System? Do me a quaver..What Microsoft have done is throw away the one advantage they had over PS3-4 and that was that the 360 was, above all else, a GAMES CONSOLE. It didnt try to replace your DVD/Blu Ray player, it didn't pretend to become your smart TV. All it did was play games. Well now, it looks like the 'Next' won't even be able to do that very well.

And perhaps the biggest bug bear is the fee to be able to play a preowned fething game! That is without doubt the most boneheaded, fethed up move I've ever seen perpetrated by a console company. So what Microsoft are saying is that if want to borrow a friends disc to play a game before I buy it that I'd have to pay the full RRP?!
Now normally I rent a game before I decide to make a purchase. It's something I've done for nearly 20 years. But should I buy an Xbox Next would this be even possible? Or would I have to pay the rental fee plus an extra fee on top of having to pay to be able to play the fething thing online?!

No, fething no Microsoft. I may have bought one of your butt ugly machines had these not been issues, but you know what? Sony gets my money this generation. And that makes me very sad indeed. I won't even look at your bumpf from E3, because for me, it's already ruined.

I just have to hope that the PS4 isn't a complete pile of cack....

I say it as one who works for them (SCEE) but the PS4 is looking pretty good.

It's as if Sony took a hard look at everything that was done wrong on PS3 -- weird architecture, crappy network facilities, complex interface, etc. -- and decided to fix it by getting a load of US and Euro people to lead the design and make it all better.

The raw specs are better than the XBox Wun, though I don't know how much difference that will make to the games.

 Kilkrazy wrote:
I say it as one who works for them (SCEE) but the PS4 is looking pretty good.

It's as if Sony took a hard look at everything that was done wrong on PS3 -- weird architecture, crappy network facilities, complex interface, etc. -- and decided to fix it by getting a load of US and Euro people to lead the design and make it all better.

The raw specs are better than the XBox Wun, though I don't know how much difference that will make to the games.

As someone who doesn't work at SCEE...I am under the very same impression

 Kilkrazy wrote:
I say it as one who works for them (SCEE) but the PS4 is looking pretty good.

It's as if Sony took a hard look at everything that was done wrong on PS3 -- weird architecture, crappy network facilities, complex interface, etc. -- and decided to fix it by getting a load of US and Euro people to lead the design and make it all better.

The raw specs are better than the XBox Wun, though I don't know how much difference that will make to the games.

I cannot tell you how glad that makes me Kilkrazy... Even though it may be a little biased

The PS3 wasn't perfect, but if Sony can improve upon it I will be a little poorer come the release..

I don't know, I for one am pretty happy the unit will just be 'sleeping' and turn on almost instantly when I say "Xbox on", considering it takes about a minute to boot right now.

This is basically exactly how all of our other devices function now...

All of the TV garbage is totally useless to me though, as long as it has netflix and Hulu I'm fine, but I'd never be searching the internet on my screen while watching TV; that's what I have a tablet for.

 LordofHats wrote:
No Red ring here either. And I have a launch 360. There was an article awhile back saying that less than 100 launch 360's still functioned. It made me giddy

I'm also running a launch 360. never had issue with it which is surprising considering that I left it on for a week straight once.

Oof, not looking so hot for the XBox One at this point. The only thing that has me interested is Halo TV series. And if XBL goes up any more in price, you can count me out for sure. Have they mentioned anything about possibly having internal rechargeable batteries like the PS3 controllers?

OT - I like the 360 controller, but I've always prefered the PS controllers. Everything is just uniform and I prefer the stick design/placement more. And the 360 controller has a tendency to make my carpal tunnel flare up for some reason haha.

There was a study a couple years ago about how gamers hand adjust themselves to controllers. As in their finger muscles actually alter slightly to suit the controller. It's why some people who started with one controller find the other uncomfortable.

 LordofHats wrote:
There was a study a couple years ago about how gamers hand adjust themselves to controllers. As in their finger muscles actually alter slightly to suit the controller. It's why some people who started with one controller find the other uncomfortable.

That honestly wouldn't surprise me. I've never owned an Xbox until I picked up my 360 last fall; just always stuck with my PS/Gamecube systems.

I use both a ps3 and an xbox controller daily.

Please don't try to get around the word filter.

So much hyperbole.

Ye, but I am pretty darn pissed. The info Microsoft released was the worst thing that could happen to gamers - the removal of the second hand market alone killed pretty much any interest in buying a console with such a system for me. 90% of my console games are pre-owned (bar Rockband due to the instruments) as I sure as hell won't pay 60-70€ for a video game any more.

 Sigvatr wrote:
Ye, but I am pretty darn pissed. The info Microsoft released was the worst thing that could happen to gamers - the removal of the second hand market alone killed pretty much any interest in buying a console with such a system for me. 90% of my console games are pre-owned (bar Rockband due to the instruments) as I sure as hell won't pay 60-70€ for a video game any more.

Why? Will you only be able to buy games electronically? Cause if not I don't see how they can stop the second-hand market.

 Cheesecat wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
Ye, but I am pretty darn pissed. The info Microsoft released was the worst thing that could happen to gamers - the removal of the second hand market alone killed pretty much any interest in buying a console with such a system for me. 90% of my console games are pre-owned (bar Rockband due to the instruments) as I sure as hell won't pay 60-70€ for a video game any more.

Why? Will you only be able to buy games electronically? Cause if not I don't see how they can stop the second-hand market.

Licenses along with their, Please don't bypass the language filter like this. Reds8n , forced 24h connect. Buy a game, it's bound to your account. Can't sell. Well, you can. If your friend plays FULL RETAIL for the game. Xbox fanboys then say "loooool steam did this forevear lololol" and that's just returded. Have a look at how Steam reacted to the lack of 2nd hand sales. Check the prices of games at steam. Full retail resale? Nope. Plus: I still have 1 account for each and every of my steam games and still sell old games I don't play anymore. Sold Assassin's Creed 3 two days ago. Paypal, trade data, confirm change etc. Tadaa.

Yeah, that kind of is a bad idea killing off the second hand market but at the same time developers and publishers don't make anything from second hand games.

I'd put money on the fact Sony and Microsoft have had a quiet word and are both intent on killing the second hand games market this generation, or at least bringing into their control/domain.

 Cheesecat wrote:
Yeah, that kind of is a bad idea killing off the second hand market but at the same time developers and publishers don't make anything from second hand games.

DLC.

Plus: it's just foolish to think that people who used to mainly buy used games will now suddenly start buying full retail price. Just unrealistic.

I'm interested in how Sony tackles the issue.

Bonus - Microsoft Stocks:



/e: It's officiall confirmed, EA is returded:

http://www.pcgamer.com/2013/05/23/xbox-one-vs-pc-ea-cto/

Oh yeah. I heard about those comments yesterday. Its funny actually cause its a direct reaction to what many Xbox sites are seeing. Members saying they're gonna skip the new Xbox and just get a PC. SO EA does what EA does; be stupid.

Xbox was boast about their 5 billion transitors like its some feat of daring. That's 5,000,000,000. An Nvidia 690 (just the GPU) has 7,080,000,000 and oh heavens forbid someone dual card that monstrosity. The GPU alone on a high end PC has more transitors than their entire console. The entire idea is just laughable. When someone pays $5000 for a high end gaming PC, they get a $5000 gaming PC and that takes dumps on just about anything else bar a super computer.

Honestly the death of used games is probably one of the best things that can happen for PC. Even if the PC doesn't have a used games market, the fact consoles no longer have one kills one of their market advantages. Game Stop played a huge roll in the console explosion ten years ago and used games were a huge part of that.

First things first, it's the "Xbone", if M$ leave that one open they're gonna get it both barrels (and who doesn't love a dick joke?).

Honestly, RRoD (two dead, third hasn't been switched on in over a year now) was enough to make me think twice about any future console from M$ and after this presentation (this new "TV" thing they're on about sounds good, it might be the next big thing) I'm looking at $ony to see if they can mess up badly enough to lose out, 'cus it'll take a train wreck of truly biblical proportions to lose to M$oft now.

I thought this would be a good place to point out that I'm getting a new computer in a few weeks. I'm going to get a GForce Titan.

No.

I'll get two.

Early reports on the price of the Xbox One are in the realm of $400 USD at launch; and that's with Kinect bundled into each box.


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 Sigvatr wrote:

 Cheesecat wrote:
Yeah, that kind of is a bad idea killing off the second hand market but at the same time developers and publishers don't make anything from second hand games.

DLC.

Developers and publishers do not really "make their money back" on simply DLC purchases from people who buy used games. If it's not critical DLC (like EA's online passes for multiplayer on popular games), there's no guarantee people will buy it.

That's ignoring what it actually takes to get DLC made ready for release; which is around $2000 USD for first round certification, and $2000 each time that it has to go through certification if something was royally boned. That's ignoring the time of the developers and the time needed for a release slot, etc.

That's an expensive TV remote.

Yeah. It's going to come down to the games being a very much deciding factor; with just how much "wow" Microsoft can impress upon people in regards to the Xbox One and its capabilities.

I'm locked in for an Xbox; but most of that comes from the fact that the people I play with regularly are locked in for an Xbox as well.
I'd imagine I am not the only person who is making a similar decision...which is why, IMO, Microsoft announced that your Gamertag would carry over.

I have no desire to get either. I'm coming back to rejoin the PC Master Race after years in the wilderness. My PC stopped being able to play new release games in 2007, so this is a much awaited resurrection.

Besides, I've got like 8 PS3 games (including all the Assassin Creed games) that I've never even played, so it's not like a need another console.

Did anyone else notice how much of a sneaky maneuver EA pulled.

'yeah we're scrapping Online passes................'
[A low murmur of grateful voices, a couple of claps]

The consumer pressure lessens on EA. People start to hope.

May 21:

''Cos microsoft have thought of an even better money grubbing insult to the customers! HAHA EA wins again!''