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I'm completely calling bs on this one! Am I the only sane one here that feels this 'suppliment' should be bundled to the new eldar codex? I'm not an eldar player but I feels sorry for the elder player to have to buy TWO books to play their army to the full extent. Don't buy both books? then you don't get the 'awesome' rule to use for your Eldar army.

I would actually fell better if they would make it a standalone codex, like dark eldar.

This codex suppliment has the taint to the dreaded video games DLC or in app purchase format.

If this gains acceptance. I can already see the new Codex: Space Marines will definitly contain suppliments for Black Templars and even other chapters like Imperial Fist, Salamadar etc. I pity the SM player who needs to keep buying 'suppliment' codex to play with slightly different varations of SMs

 alienvalentine wrote:
I don't know, I think that $50 is a pretty fair price for a hard back, full color, 100+ pages worth of Codex. It's actually cheaper than most similarly produced "coffee table" art books. Some of their model kits on the other hand are horribly overpriced.

This. Full colour hardbacks of this quality are expensive. I know I bought enough textbooks during my studies that were nowhere near the production quality of the newer codexes and cost twice as much - ten years ago. Sure they (mostly) had a much higher page count, but were printed on poorer quality paper, in smaller dimensions (LxW) and in monotone.

The kits; maybe, I'm not so sure anymore. When I was gaming two to three times a week and I was speedpainting my armies, sure, but now I have more time to paint and play fewer games (and thus put more effort in to the paintwork), I'm not so bothered.

But this is a thread about Codex Iyanden - I'll be getting this as I've been a fan of Iyanden since Doom of the Eldar at least. Actually, probably since the very first painting article for them in WD all those years ago.

5 spiritseers as a single choice? Interesting. Wonder if there's rules for the angel and if we'll get a mini?

Iyanden eldar can battlebrother with normal eldar ?

 dangermouse425 wrote:

Spiritseer Psychic Powers - Any Iyanden Spiritseer that generates his psychic powers from the Runes of Battle discipline treats Voice of Twilight (see below) as their Primaris Power, rather than Conceal/Reveal
.

...Voice of Twilight...
*sigh* I've watched to much MLPFIM....

So do we have to buy both or can you just buy one.

Apparently 50$ wasn't enough so instead their going to split the codexs into multiple books for 50$ each. Where's a good face palm when you need it

There isn't a curse in the tongues of men foul enough for this treachery.

If this is the first of a series of supplements, then no, Iyanden's background and additional rules probably couldn't have been bundled into the main Codex because there would be the other 4 main craftworlds.

I don't mind though since it is possible to run an Iyanden list even without this supplement (of which a good chunk is background), and because it allows some fleshing out of factions beyond their little paragraph blurbs in the main Codex (of which most is copy/paste from the previous Codex).

wufai wrote:
I pity the SM player who needs to keep buying 'suppliment' codex to play with slightly different varations of SMs

Oh dear ...

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440270a&prodId=prod1550002
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1060199
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440278a&prodId=prod170003a
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440190a&prodId=prod680010a
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat860006a&prodId=prod1830070a

 Manchu wrote:

wufai wrote:
I pity the SM player who needs to keep buying 'suppliment' codex to play with slightly different varations of SMs

Oh dear ...

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440270a&prodId=prod1550002
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1060199
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440278a&prodId=prod170003a
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440190a&prodId=prod680010a
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat860006a&prodId=prod1830070a

Well played. Alright gents, Gw has been doing this for years. Honestly, i am doing Iyenden style, so of course i need this supplement.

Cypher226 wrote:

 alienvalentine wrote:
I don't know, I think that $50 is a pretty fair price for a hard back, full color, 100+ pages worth of Codex. It's actually cheaper than most similarly produced "coffee table" art books. Some of their model kits on the other hand are horribly overpriced.

This. Full colour hardbacks of this quality are expensive. I know I bought enough textbooks during my studies that were nowhere near the production quality of the newer codexes and cost twice as much - ten years ago. Sure they (mostly) had a much higher page count, but were printed on poorer quality paper, in smaller dimensions (LxW) and in monotone.

The kits; maybe, I'm not so sure anymore. When I was gaming two to three times a week and I was speedpainting my armies, sure, but now I have more time to paint and play fewer games (and thus put more effort in to the paintwork), I'm not so bothered.

But this is a thread about Codex Iyanden - I'll be getting this as I've been a fan of Iyanden since Doom of the Eldar at least. Actually, probably since the very first painting article for them in WD all those years ago.

5 spiritseers as a single choice? Interesting. Wonder if there's rules for the angel and if we'll get a mini?

Sorry, but this is a pair of nonsense arguments.

Firstly, full colour hard backs of this quality are NOT expensive! There is next to nothing in terms of size and production quality between the codexes and any number of annuals they trot out for Xmas every year for everything from Family Guy to the latest boy band, for less than a tenner, even double the price because of development and they're still overpriced by half.

Secondly, comparing the cost of textbooks, which may have a print run in only the tens or hundreds, depending how specialist the topic, to a book that's produced in the thousands, if not tens of thousands, is a fallacy. Also, when was the last time a text book barely broke 100 pages? That's either an incredibly specific, or very easy, subject you're studying!

Out of curiosity, would you be able to do a custom paint scheme on your army but say it counts as Iyanden (so you would obey their rules) or would events hold you to having to paint them that way too?

It seems obvious it would apply to SM, since they have chapter specific models. Just curious, since I just play for fun.

 Carthuun wrote:
Out of curiosity, would you be able to do a custom paint scheme on your army but say it counts as Iyanden (so you would obey their rules) or would events hold you to having to paint them that way too?

It seems obvious it would apply to SM, since they have chapter specific models. Just curious, since I just play for fun.

You can paint them like green with pink polka dots for all it matters, as long as the list is legal and the models are wysiwyg then you're free and clear.

Death Watch suppliment for either Grey Knight or Space Marines.

Do eeet!!!

It's good to get confirmation that there are some actual rules in it. I'm hoping for some truly heinous crap like Alaitoc Disruption Tables and free stuff for nothing upgrades, just to bring a new good army or two into the metagame. The vanilla codex Eldar armies don't seem all that impressive currently.

Well, I'm kind of excited this is happening honestly. Kind of surprised Eldar are the test army for it though.

Here's to hoping that it sells enough that GW goes back and makes some CSM Legion books...

We all know what will happen when Codex: Alaitoc with its Ragner Table will reappear.

I mostly just think it's absurd you have to pay so much to get the rules to play an army. If they wanted to release a separate colourful fluff book with pictures and background, sure, whatever, but having to pay so much to get the rules is just crazy.

When it comes to the actual rules required to play the game I'd be more than happy if they came in a black and white soft cover pamphlet, easier to navigate than a hardback anyway.

But that would go against GW's policy of fleecing customers until they leave and then fleecing remaining customers even more to compensate.

One concern I have is whether GW will suffer from changes in its policy and design vision. It had supplemental Codices and WD army lists previously, then decided to fold them back into the main Codex. Now it seems Iyanden is going to be the first in a new series of supplements, showing a change back to the old vision of many variations. However it could be in a few years they will change yet again and swing back to 1 Codex per race. GW can't seem to make up its mind and changes before they have gone through one cycle of the whole range of Codices.

Here's hoping that future supplements also come with new models. Even a single unit that needs updating (Looking at you, Saim-Hann, and your jetbikes) would be a very nice boost to the production schedule.

As far as rule supplements, and with Eldar in mind, I hope Ulthwe isn't too far away.

I hope they release more books like this. Maybe I'll finally get my CSM Legions book.

I'd rather actual suppliments that were charged for than doctrines/special rules that were crammed into codexes simply because the fanbase wanted them. If these things can return decent money then they'll get more care and development, and therefore be fun.

That and I would happily pay £30 for a Codex: Mordian Iron Guard suppliment

Actually it just occurred to me, this is quite possibly the answer to GW's recent rapid fire release schedule. I was wondering if they were planning on maintaining this release rate and what they'd do when they started to run out of armies to update. Perhaps they intend to start releasing supplements for all armies so they can maintain the fast release rate without running out of things to release.

This kind of stuff would be awesome if it were half the price. Even when GW does something right, prices prevent it from working.

 azreal13 wrote:

Cypher226 wrote:

 alienvalentine wrote:
I don't know, I think that $50 is a pretty fair price for a hard back, full color, 100+ pages worth of Codex. It's actually cheaper than most similarly produced "coffee table" art books. Some of their model kits on the other hand are horribly overpriced.

This. Full colour hardbacks of this quality are expensive. I know I bought enough textbooks during my studies that were nowhere near the production quality of the newer codexes and cost twice as much - ten years ago. Sure they (mostly) had a much higher page count, but were printed on poorer quality paper, in smaller dimensions (LxW) and in monotone.

The kits; maybe, I'm not so sure anymore. When I was gaming two to three times a week and I was speedpainting my armies, sure, but now I have more time to paint and play fewer games (and thus put more effort in to the paintwork), I'm not so bothered.

But this is a thread about Codex Iyanden - I'll be getting this as I've been a fan of Iyanden since Doom of the Eldar at least. Actually, probably since the very first painting article for them in WD all those years ago.

5 spiritseers as a single choice? Interesting. Wonder if there's rules for the angel and if we'll get a mini?

Sorry, but this is a pair of nonsense arguments.

Firstly, full colour hard backs of this quality are NOT expensive! There is next to nothing in terms of size and production quality between the codexes and any number of annuals they trot out for Xmas every year for everything from Family Guy to the latest boy band, for less than a tenner, even double the price because of development and they're still overpriced by half.

Secondly, comparing the cost of textbooks, which may have a print run in only the tens or hundreds, depending how specialist the topic, to a book that's produced in the thousands, if not tens of thousands, is a fallacy. Also, when was the last time a text book barely broke 100 pages? That's either an incredibly specific, or very easy, subject you're studying!

Archaeology and Ancient History.
Here's one, very specialist (so refers to your last point) Greek colony of Miletos - more like £90 at time of release, 192 pages.The Kindle edition is still nearly £20, 11 years after it was published.

second and third examples: Cultural Atlas of Ancient Egypt and Cultural Atlas of Mesopotamia Cover price was $50 each back in 2002. Inflation alone according to http://www.westegg.com/inflation/ would jack these to just shy of $64 apiece now. c. 240 pages apiece, but by no means full colour - maybe about 50/50.

The Iyanden Codex is a niche product with a massively smaller print run than seasonal 'stocking fillers' which are guaranteed to sell quickly. There's a whole raft of different economics at work there than in Codex pricing, where books may sit around for some time before being sold. I also think the paper is a much higher quality than that I've seen in the kids' annuals, it's certainly heavier. The gatefolds and such will also add on additional costs.

Sure, it's overpriced, but I don't think it's as overpriced as some of the responders here seem to think. .

Books are a lot more expensive than they used to be, and that's across the board. Penguin classics (the Bronte's, Dickens, Virgil, Homer etc) used to be £2.99 when I was in uni, they now retail for much closer to £10 each.

Licensed Calendars now, they're a rip off!

I like the idea of supplements, but I think the approach is a bit meh.

I would have prefered a smaller, lower priced rule book for the different Craftworlds, and seperately sold Fluffbooks in the style of "Heraldry of the Skaven", so that I'm not "forced" to pay for the pretty pictures if I don't want to.

Textbooks are a poor comparison. Captive group of consumers, who MUST BUY it (in the latest edition, generally, and revisions come every couple of years) in order to do their class work.

Even my father-in-law, who is a college professor and has written books used in class, will admit it's a racket.

Cypher226 wrote:

Licensed Calendars now, they're a rip off!

A space marine topless calender would probably sell quite well in certain...communities. Especially with sexually suggestive poses with their weapons

I also wonder if this supplement is also meant to be GW's way of testing the water to see if MOAR supplements would be profitable

Well, this does interest me a lot. I'll be taking a good look before I buy it though, to make sure the rules and other content is worth it.

I hope they do one for all CW, again if worth it my FLGS will getting my orders. I REALLY hope they release models with there supplements, we have our wraith units to which we found this codex was coming, so maybe jetbikes for Saim-hann, spiders for Biel-tan(being aspect focused), not really sure what they could do for the others. Maybe a decent storm guardians kit...ah one can dream.

If it plays out that way then one way or another GW will be getting me monies.

This also make me VERY curious with a possible BT supplement codex.

 deathholydeath wrote:
I hope they release more books like this. Maybe I'll finally get my CSM Legions book.

Codex: Legions
Author: Matt Ward

A man can dream

pre-order for this has been up for a few days on iBooks...
i downloaded the sample, which looks nice...
price is $39.99, not $50...

cheers
jah