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 Mannahnin wrote:

Then you didn't read the quotes from the people who run them.

No... I read them.

I just question it. Maybe that's their political response (hey, I don't blame them).

The bill sought to make Texas the 12th state to bar most abortions at 20 weeks after fertilization and later — a step that has been blocked in three states so far as unconstitutional. The more pressing concern for clinic managers and advocates for women’s rights was the requirement that all 42 abortion clinics in the state be licensed as ambulatory surgery centers.

Five clinics performing late-term abortions already meet that standard. But for most of the remaining 37, the new restriction would require costly renovations or relocation to meet architectural and equipment requirements. The five clinics are located in large cities – Austin, San Antonio and Dallas each have one, and Houston has two. The burden on those five clinics to provide women’s health services will be extreme, and women in rural areas and small towns far from those cities will be underserved, advocates for abortion rights said.

Two clinics in McAllen and Harlingen in South Texas – the only abortion providers in the area – would close if the bill had passed, they said, forcing women seeking abortions to travel a few miles across the border into Mexico rather than drive four hours to San Antonio, both for surgical procedures and abortion-inducing drugs.

“We know that it would shut down dozens of clinics in the state of Texas, a state of 26 million people, and there will be women who cannot reach a health care provider to get reproductive health care for hundreds of miles,” said Cecile Richards, the president of the Planned Parenthood Action Fund and a daughter of Ann W. Richards, the former Texas governor.

In related news, Wendy Davis seems to be kind of a badass.

 Mannahnin wrote:

In related news, Wendy Davis seems to be kind of a badass.

I thought the cause was lost when she was taken down by the trumped up shady moves from the house president.

I should not have doubted, 10 hours talking without peeing, pooping, eating, sitting, leaning...

Badass indeed!

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 Mannahnin wrote:

Spoiler:

In related news, Wendy Davis seems to be kind of a badass.

I thought the cause was lost when she was taken down by the trumped up shady moves from the house president.

I should not have doubted, 10 hours talking without peeing, pooping, eating, sitting, leaning...

Badass indeed!

 whembly wrote:

She's going to need a porta-potty next week. They're determined to pass this bill.

It's interesting the amount of instant coverage this ordeal is generating, but it took a mammoth public outcry to get the media to pay attention to the Gosnell Trial (If squeamish, don't read that link).

Where did I read before she started she put on pink running shoes.......

Wow. Personally I'm pro-choice, so this just hurts my perception of this state even more. This state is quite archaic with a lot of its policies and philosophies, isn't it?

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
Wow. Personally I'm pro-choice, so this just hurts my perception of this state even more. This state is quite archaic with a lot of its policies and philosophies, isn't it?

Every state/country does things that others would would find archaic/stupid.

Texas is just incredibly brazen about it.

 whembly wrote:

 Fafnir wrote:
It's not the 20 week ban that people are upset about, it's the proposed closing of almost every abortion facility in Texas that is the problem.

No... it's forcing them to the same standards that current outpatient surgery facilities must follow.

If the clinic would follow that, they'd be fine.

Yes but why do they need to?

Abortion clinics have been operating for decades. Is there a record of medical problems?

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
So let me get this straight.

When "Republicans" use delaying tactics, that's a horrible affront to freedom. But when "Democrats" do it, its a victory.

When "conservatives" complain that introducing more restrictive laws are designed to snuff out a right over time, they're called paranoid. But when "liberals" say it, they're justified.

Does anyone not see the irony here? We all want the government to mind its own business and leave us alone.

Thats about right. To be truly neutral, switch the party names above and you get the full effect. In essence both parties want to tell me what to do and will do what they can legally to do so.
Neither party particularly cares about freedom or individual liberties. The Bill of Rights is an inconvenience when they are in power.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
You know this is all showy theatrics with the Plan B available to everyone now.

Interesting hypothetical: Could a man be charged with murder if he slipped a Plan B into a gal's drink?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
Wow. Personally I'm pro-choice, so this just hurts my perception of this state even more. This state is quite archaic with a lot of its policies and philosophies, isn't it?

Yes I know. Its best you not come here. We're just a bunch of neaderthals with our space exploration and deep sea exploration.



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 Kilkrazy wrote:

 whembly wrote:

 Fafnir wrote:
It's not the 20 week ban that people are upset about, it's the proposed closing of almost every abortion facility in Texas that is the problem.

No... it's forcing them to the same standards that current outpatient surgery facilities must follow.

If the clinic would follow that, they'd be fine.

Yes but why do they need to?

Abortion clinics have been operating for decades. Is there a record of medical problems?

cough Gosnell trial cough

 Frazzled wrote:

 Kilkrazy wrote:

Abortion clinics have been operating for decades. Is there a record of medical problems?

cough Gosnell trial cough

Don't be daft, what does a guy who willingly murders people have to do with the legal and lawful operation of a clinic? Thats like saying that all gun stores should be regulated differently because a gun store owner murders somebody.

I wonder if the Democrats will flee to Oklahoma again for the special session?

Texas Abortion Opponents To Cheer Selves Up With Execution

 d-usa wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:

 Kilkrazy wrote:

Abortion clinics have been operating for decades. Is there a record of medical problems?

cough Gosnell trial cough

Don't be daft, what does a guy who willingly murders people have to do with the legal and lawful operation of a clinic?

Does the same thing.

Texas Abortion Opponents To Cheer Selves Up With Execution

Indeed, I think a nice mojito is in order. 500th baby!

Frazzled wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 PrehistoricUFO wrote:
Wow. Personally I'm pro-choice, so this just hurts my perception of this state even more. This state is quite archaic with a lot of its policies and philosophies, isn't it?

Yes I know. Its best you not come here. We're just a bunch of neaderthals with our space exploration and deep sea exploration.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kilkrazy wrote:

 whembly wrote:

 Fafnir wrote:
It's not the 20 week ban that people are upset about, it's the proposed closing of almost every abortion facility in Texas that is the problem.

No... it's forcing them to the same standards that current outpatient surgery facilities must follow.

If the clinic would follow that, they'd be fine.

Yes but why do they need to?

Abortion clinics have been operating for decades. Is there a record of medical problems?

cough Gosnell trial cough

I know you oppose abortion. When you support a prohibition on the grounds of a reason for which you have no factual basis, it cheapens you, your cause and the whole concept of debate and the democratic process.

I love how we he is pretending he would not have been a psychotic mass murderer if only his abortion clinic would have been regulated like a surgical clinic...

I know you oppose abortion. When you support a prohibition on the grounds of a reason for which you have no factual basis, it cheapens you, your cause and the whole concept of debate and the democratic process.

You "know" wrong. I am against late term abortion as most sane people are. Other then that, as long as I don't have to pay for it, do what you want. Heck they can have two for one specials for all I care. Again PLan B should take care of this.

I just don't want government telling me what to do.


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 d-usa wrote:
I love how we he is pretending he would not have been a psychotic mass murderer if only his abortion clinic would have been regulated like a surgical clinic...

he was not a psychotic mass murderer. He was just a poor business person who cut costs at any opportunity.

 Frazzled wrote:

 d-usa wrote:
I love how we he is pretending he would not have been a psychotic mass murderer if only his abortion clinic would have been regulated like a surgical clinic...

he was not a psychotic mass murderer. He was just a poor business person who cut costs at any opportunity.

Oh look, a baby that came out alive. If only I could cut costs, I wonder if I can just stick a pair of scisors in its neck and cut the spinal cord. Oh look, I saved money!



This is the dumbest argument I have ever seen you make on here.

 d-usa wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:

 d-usa wrote:
I love how we he is pretending he would not have been a psychotic mass murderer if only his abortion clinic would have been regulated like a surgical clinic...

he was not a psychotic mass murderer. He was just a poor business person who cut costs at any opportunity.

Oh look, a baby that came out alive. If only I could cut costs, I wonder if I can just stick a pair of scisors in its neck and cut the spinal cord. Oh look, I saved money!



This is the dumbest argument I have ever seen you make on here.

Hold the horses. Thats bad -agreed.
But thats what abortion is boyo. If you can't handle it, maybe you should rethink your own fething position!!!

How else are we supposed to stop them from masturbating ?

 reds8n wrote:
How else are we supposed to stop them from masturbating ?

Mandatory donations to the sperm bank?

 Ahtman wrote:
Texas Abortion Opponents To Cheer Selves Up With Execution

What is the relevance of this?

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Cant we just let texas secede from the union?

Nah, there's some pretty hot chicks here.

 Frazzled wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:

 d-usa wrote:
I love how we he is pretending he would not have been a psychotic mass murderer if only his abortion clinic would have been regulated like a surgical clinic...

he was not a psychotic mass murderer. He was just a poor business person who cut costs at any opportunity.

Oh look, a baby that came out alive. If only I could cut costs, I wonder if I can just stick a pair of scisors in its neck and cut the spinal cord. Oh look, I saved money!



This is the dumbest argument I have ever seen you make on here.

Hold the horses. Thats bad -agreed.

Good.

But thats what abortion is boyo. If you can't handle it, maybe you should rethink your own fething position!!!

You mean to tell me that abortion = third trimester delivery of viable fetuses that are still alive and then have their spinal court severed? Abortion = a procedure specifically banned by federal law?

I thought that abortion covers a whole many other procedures than the illegal partial birth abortion.

But maybe the answer to people breaking laws is just to make more laws.

What do you think abortion is? Its killing babies/fetuses/blobs of cells.

Its legal. People who are supporting it are supporting that. Live up to it.

 Frazzled wrote:
What do you think abortion is? Its killing babies/fetuses/blobs of cells.

Its legal. People who are supporting it are supporting that. Live up to it.

So just not going to answer that are you then.

According to your statements you believe that abortion is the delivery of an alive and viable third trimester fetus and then severing the spinal cord with scissors, a procedure that is specifically banned by federal law.

the article says abortions past 20 weeks, not all abortions, outside of rape/special circumstances, you shouldn't be having an abortion past 8 weeks, let alone 20... the baby is very much a person by that point, and any responsible human being can tell that they are pregnant within two months, let alone 4.5 months.

That it would actually close down so many clinics, just means that its pretty dangerous right now, you really SHOULD be close to a hospital, and the performing doctor really should have the ability to admit you into a hospital.

that abortions are taking place outside of surgical centers with close hospital access is actually pretty scary, especially if they are past 12 weeks.

Abortions are just fine if done RESPONSIBLY and QUICKLY, in a safe environment.

If you cant figure out you are pregnant before 20 weeks, that is completely inexcusable/irresponsible.

OFC I will be labeled an anti abortion christian wing nut, mainly due to lazy-ness on the lie-berals part and not actually reading my post.

 d-usa wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
What do you think abortion is? Its killing babies/fetuses/blobs of cells.

Its legal. People who are supporting it are supporting that. Live up to it.

So just not going to answer that are you then.

According to your statements you believe that abortion is the delivery of an alive and viable third trimester fetus and then severing the spinal cord with scissors, a procedure that is specifically banned by federal law.

How is it not? Whats the difference? Killing is killing. Accept it and move on.

 whembly wrote:

 Ahtman wrote:
Texas Abortion Opponents To Cheer Selves Up With Execution

What is the relevance of this?

You really don't understand how an article (satire or otherwise) about Texas attitudes about abortion are relevant in a thread about Texas abortion legal shenanigans?

So here is a wonderful post that is 100% emotion, and 0% facts.

 easysauce wrote:
the article says abortions past 20 weeks, not all abortions, outside of rape/special circumstances, you shouldn't be having an abortion past 8 weeks, let alone 20... the baby is very much a person by that point, and any responsible human being can tell that they are pregnant within two months, let alone 4.5 months.

There is no proof that a baby is very much a person, has a consciousness, or the ability to be alive outside of the body at 20 weeks.

That it would actually close down so many clinics, just means that its pretty dangerous right now, you really SHOULD be close to a hospital, and the performing doctor really should have the ability to admit you into a hospital.

Here we have zero proof that it is actually dangerous. Texas surely has the vital statistics to show how many women were gravely injured and/or died from these dangerous procedures. But there aren't any cases that they can point to. So we get a generic "it's dangerous people!"

that abortions are taking place outside of surgical centers with close hospital access is actually pretty scary, especially if they are past 12 weeks.

"I have zero evidence to back any of this up. But if it feels scary to me, then surely it must be scary.

Abortions are just fine if done RESPONSIBLY and QUICKLY, in a safe environment.

"Abortions are just fine if done within an arbitrary time frame and in an arbitrary environment that we determine based on what feels scary without providing any data"

If you cant figure out you are pregnant before 20 weeks, that is completely inexcusable/irresponsible.

"I am going to ignore the fact that there are many reasons why people choose not to have an abortion until closer to 20 weeks and pretend that they are just irresponsible to figure out that they are pregnant. Never mind that women on birth control might not have a period and wouldn't know that they missed a period until they are a few months into the pregnancy. Or that they might not have the money and/or transportation to get to a surgical center earlier in a pregnancy (especially if you shut down most of them). Or that they have to work up the courage to even tell their family that they are pregnant. "

OFC I will be labeled an anti abortion christian wing nut, mainly due to lazy-ness on the lie-berals part and not actually reading my post.

"Of course I will just make up some excuses when somebody counters my argument because I didn't actually provide any actual facts other than 'this feels scary'".


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 Frazzled wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
What do you think abortion is? Its killing babies/fetuses/blobs of cells.

Its legal. People who are supporting it are supporting that. Live up to it.

So just not going to answer that are you then.

According to your statements you believe that abortion is the delivery of an alive and viable third trimester fetus and then severing the spinal cord with scissors, a procedure that is specifically banned by federal law.

How is it not? Whats the difference? Killing is killing. Accept it and move on.

So you are saying that there is zero difference between an abortion at 8 weeks, and the delivery of a 31 week old fetus that is alive and viable and then killing it? None at all?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ahtman wrote:

 whembly wrote:

 Ahtman wrote:
Texas Abortion Opponents To Cheer Selves Up With Execution

What is the relevance of this?

You really don't understand how an article (satire or otherwise) about Texas attitudes about abortion are relevant in a thread about Texas abortion legal shenanigans?

Or the delicious irony of "live is sacred, let's kill someone!"

 Frazzled wrote:

 d-usa wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
What do you think abortion is? Its killing babies/fetuses/blobs of cells.

Its legal. People who are supporting it are supporting that. Live up to it.

So just not going to answer that are you then.

According to your statements you believe that abortion is the delivery of an alive and viable third trimester fetus and then severing the spinal cord with scissors, a procedure that is specifically banned by federal law.

How is it not? Whats the difference? Killing is killing. Accept it and move on.

Except it isn't, as we make differentiations on what is ok to kill and not ok to kill all the time. Only a few small groups, such as Jainists make a hard line approach to life. In this case the question of whether a zygote should be considered the same as a full on human is the question, and one there is no easy answer to. If there were we still wouldn't be having this discussion.