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With those 300 points he could easily get some hellfire dreads, attack bikes with MM, normal bikes with meltaguns, DP sternguard, termis with TML, stormtalons with any of the upgrade weapons (preferably TML for VoF), more tacs with ML, more scouts with ML another pred with really any loadout, etc.

Point is there are plenty of ways to give him AT I think that this might be the player over the army and he should look into better tactics or better dice

@ Mark1130 thanks its not often you see people commenting on awsome signatures

What's wrong here is, *most* of the anti-tank weapons are tied into units that otherwise are best suited for typical anti-infantry and moving up on objectives. Not only are those bolters wasted when firing at vehicles, but every turn spent moving up means that missile launcher is snap-firing. Meanwhile, the units that are actually causing trouble (Warp Spiders, and no doubt the Guardian Jetbikes) get a free pass while he's concentrating on that Night Spinner.

I'd make a few changes to the layout, but it means a handful of purchases. For starters, take the missile launchers out of the Tactical squads and put them into a new Devastator squad. If the Scouts have sniper rifles or bolters that one could stay there, but if they have bolt pistol and CCW or shotguns, just flat take it out.
I would be tempted to run the Predator with *no* sponsons, which would give a lot of points towards taking a second one. Or better yet - take a las/plas Razorback for each Tactical squad. This gives a little more target saturation and also gives a chance of engaging a second target if the first shot's a really lucky one.

For more general tips - advise your friend that he needs to have a general plan for each unit, and to stick to that plan and make sure they have wargear to suit. I realise Tactical Marines fluff-wise are supposed to be able to fulfil multiple roles but at lower points levels, building for this really hurts.

I would say let him play your Eldar army once or twice and see how it fills to be a winner, jk

That is a lot of very tough armor at a very low points level IMO.

Three lascannons are unlikely to do anything significant to a WS, Fire Prism, or Night Spinner. Let's look at some math:

3x Lascannons = 2 hits, 1.33 pens/glances, 0.66 pens/glances after holofield jink, call it all glances because of Serpent Shield.

Then fire the 2x Missile Launchers - 1.33 hits, 0.66 pens/glances, 0.33 pens/glances after holofield jink, call it a glance because of the Serpent Shield.

So far one glance.

Then the Scout ML (which IIRC is bs3) - .5 hits, .25 pens/glances, 0.125 pens/glances after holofield jink - barely worth talking about.

So against the Wave Serpent, the cumulative amount of antitank in his list inflicts one glance, basically.


That, to me, is more of a problem with Eldar armour and less of a problem with SM AT capabilities.

I've been called a cheese army before fielding one of every unit and absolutely no redundancy (I don't even have the same transport) cept I have 2 HQ's and 3 Heavies which are all different and do different things. I'd hardly call having 4 flamers in the whole army is spam or is it at 1500?

Apparently synergy can be spamming too so I guess it really depends on the attitude of the person.

1000 points is too small for SM. And why doesn't the OP change his list or the way he plays?

The best advice was for you two to switch armies.

 SickSix wrote:
1000 points is too small for SM. And why doesn't the OP change his list or the way he plays?

The best advice was for you two to switch armies.

It might also give OP some understanding of what it's like being the other person. 1000 points puts certain armies at a disadvantage while others shine there.
If OP knows what it feels like being curbstomped game after game, not *only* because you might not be as good at the game but also actually because you're playing at a disadvantage he might be more ready to take a handicap without feeling cheated when he loses.

Thank you for the advice everyone you have all given me plenty to think about. Both with list building for Space Marines, and how they compare to Eldar. I started in 5th and had only heard Eldar players complaining on here about how hard it was to be Eldar so I thought Space marines should have been a lot tougher at a lower points value. We will try bumping up the points. If he is up for it switching armies as well. He and I have slightly different play styles so we both might learn something about our armies.

I will also try from now on if we do play at 1000 to run with all infantry no vehicles other the GJB, and see what happens.

Many space marine players are bitchy right now. They have an old dex and not a lot of good answers for the current meta. I usually spot my space marine playing friends 20% points to help them out.

tgf wrote:
Many space marine players are bitchy right now. They have an old dex and not a lot of good answers for the current meta. I usually spot my space marine playing friends 20% points to help them out.

Wow, you are a generous man. So for a 1500 point game, you're spotting them a robust terminator squad or 2 Storm Talons? Nice. I spot players 20% when I play marines over 2K... that's quite the challenge to overcome.