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The Iyanden supplement does write them as being responsible for why Chaos never established a major stronghold on the eastern rim of the galaxy. Though admittedly most of these victories against nameless Chaos foes happens "off camera".

I agree with other previous posters that GW writers either don't seem to get the Eldar or their story plots end up favoring the kind of head on "fair fights" of brute force that the Eldar are not meant to do. The Eldar are not supposed to "fight fair" and should be all about massing force against the enemy's weaknesses, rather than against their strengths.

A 40K game about the Eldar fighting in their style should be like 2000 points of Eldar versus 200 points of the enemy because the rest of the enemy has been lured out chasing phantoms or defending other places they thought the Eldar were going to attack.

Eldar are meant to be a dying/doomed race, it's their motif that has helped branch them out from just being Space Elves.

Anyway, in the new codex there's:

12 Eldar victories (Lugganath, Kraken, 12 Outcasts, Moon of Nightmares, Malaxis, Maedrax, Gnosis Prime, Killfist, Zandros, Eldrtich Raiders , Black Library, Bio-Purge)

1 Eldar defeat (Malan'tai)

I dont mind them dying a lot, I really dont like elves in space or in fantasy. Luck or skill I usually do not have a problem crushing the elves be they fantasy or 40k.

However, I wouldnt be too concerned about the fluff if I did like the race because most BL and codex writing is subpar on a good day and deserves to be ignored.

You think Eldar lose a lot?
Try being a Sisters of Battle player. Their fluff is nothing but them getting flat out slaughtered.

It's fun seeing the Sisters of Battle get slaughtered though- it's heartbreaking watching the dying race suffer so. : (

Don't Sisters of Battle not lose in their Codex, though? ...mainly cause they don't have a real codex, IIRC.

Sisters did win a few times in the (Very small) fluff portion of the most recent white dwarf codex, including repelling a Chaos Space Marine attack on the shrineworld where they originated.

They very briefly (one sentence) mention the Sanctuary 101 massacre at the hands of the necrons.

 Madcat87 wrote:
They very briefly (one sentence) mention the Sanctuary 101 massacre at the hands of the necrons.

The whole Sanctuary 101 massacre is actually a canonization of an old WD battle report when Necrons first came out in 2nd edition as raiders. Their first set of rules was horrendously broken and the battle report was horribly one sided resulting in the complete wiping out of the Sisters of Battle force with only a few token Necron casualties.

Frankly, Eldar don't fare even half as bad as Abaddon and not even 1/10th as bad as Tyranids

 Zweischneid wrote:
Frankly, Eldar don't fare even half as bad as Abaddon and not even 1/10th as bad as Tyranids

Now that night be true, one can't help to feel sorry for the poor guy.
But there's a very real reason as why they can't win: if they did then that particular faction would win the entire game of 40k.
And time and time again we read about hive- and splinterfleets laying waste to entire planets and sub sectors. Not to mention all the planets that have fallen to chaos or, the planetkiller or the captured blackstone fortresses. They win a lot of battles, but never the war. Just as eldar also should It's just that the writers wont even let them win battles...

Eldar players are well aware that their faction of choice probably is destinied to fall, but atleast give them some wins to encourage them to continue playing. How often do we read of space marine or necron losses?

 Enigma wrote:

 Zweischneid wrote:
Frankly, Eldar don't fare even half as bad as Abaddon and not even 1/10th as bad as Tyranids

Now that night be true, one can't help to feel sorry for the poor guy.
But there's a very real reason as why they can't win: if they did then that particular faction would win the entire game of 40k

Well, the could at least take a planet or something once in a while. Tyranids in particular.

Talking about Eldar triumphs / Tyranid failures, Tyranids - in the Tyranid Codex - lose an entire splinter fleet (!) to Maugan Ra defending a planet.... by himself.... literally.... one man (or Eldar) with (presumably) a lot of ammunition.

 Zweischneid wrote:

 Enigma wrote:

 Zweischneid wrote:
Frankly, Eldar don't fare even half as bad as Abaddon and not even 1/10th as bad as Tyranids

Now that night be true, one can't help to feel sorry for the poor guy.
But there's a very real reason as why they can't win: if they did then that particular faction would win the entire game of 40k

Well, the could at least take a planet or something once in a while. Tyranids in particular.

Talking about Eldar triumphs / Tyranid failures, Tyranids - in the Tyranid Codex - lose an entire splinter fleet (!) to Maugan Ra defending a planet.... by himself.... literally.... one man (or Eldar) with (presumably) a lot of ammunition.

Actually it never ever says it was an entire splinter fleet. That is classic misreading that has been passed on from one reader to the next.

The actual direct quote is:

The Phoenix Lord Maugan-Ra stands alone against the Tyanid swarm, and triumphs.

p.28, 5th edition Tyranid Codex

Swarm is a generic vague term used by GW and doesn't necessarily denote a fleet. It has been also used in reference to ground forces. While still improbable, it isn't as hyperbolic as detractors have tried to claim.

Iracundus wrote:

 Zweischneid wrote:

 Enigma wrote:

 Zweischneid wrote:
Frankly, Eldar don't fare even half as bad as Abaddon and not even 1/10th as bad as Tyranids

Now that night be true, one can't help to feel sorry for the poor guy.
But there's a very real reason as why they can't win: if they did then that particular faction would win the entire game of 40k

Well, the could at least take a planet or something once in a while. Tyranids in particular.

Talking about Eldar triumphs / Tyranid failures, Tyranids - in the Tyranid Codex - lose an entire splinter fleet (!) to Maugan Ra defending a planet.... by himself.... literally.... one man (or Eldar) with (presumably) a lot of ammunition.

Actually it never ever says it was an entire splinter fleet. That is classic misreading that has been passed on from one reader to the next.

The actual direct quote is:

The Phoenix Lord Maugan-Ra stands alone against the Tyanid swarm, and triumphs.

p.28, 5th edition Tyranid Codex

Swarm is a generic vague term used by GW and doesn't necessarily denote a fleet. It has been also used in reference to ground forces. While still improbable, it isn't as hyperbolic as detractors have tried to claim.

Yeah, it could have just been a bunch of rippers for all we know. If that's the case, I'm sure Maugen Ra had to get a new pair of tap dancing shoes afterwards.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:


Yeah, it could have just been a bunch of rippers for all we know. If that's the case, I'm sure Maugen Ra had to get a new pair of tap dancing shoes afterwards.

Well, those few rippers make up a pretty damn big arrow on a map of a major slice of the galaxy (!) sent to invade a whole planetary system (!).

Since when do Tyranids launch full-scale planetary invasions with a few rippers. And it couldn't have been "only ground forces", as it clearly shows them traversing hundreds of lightyears across that galactic map before running head-on into the bloody dead-end that is Maugan Ra.

Don't forget, Maugan-Ra also went into the eye of terror and got his craftworld back.

I do not believe that there is an upper limit for what Maugan-Ra can accomplish after that.

Next, he kills the emperor just so chaos can manifest in realspace, so he can kill them too.

The Eldar lose. Maugan-Ra has transcended losing.

 Zweischneid wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:


Yeah, it could have just been a bunch of rippers for all we know. If that's the case, I'm sure Maugen Ra had to get a new pair of tap dancing shoes afterwards.

Well, those few rippers make up a pretty damn big arrow on a map of the entire galaxy (!) sent to invade a whole planetary system (!).

Since when do Tyranids launch full-scale planetary invasions with a few rippers. And it couldn't have been "only ground forces", as it clearly shows them traversing hundreds of lightyears across that galactic map before running head-on into the bloody dead-end that is Maugan Ra.

It doesn't show the tendril necessarily dead-ending or being destroyed. Remember the timeline is stopped. It just shows the tendril has reached as far as there at that point in time. Maugan-Ra defeating a particular ground swarm on that world doesn't allow anything in particular to be concluded about the fate of that tendril of Leviathan, just that it has reached as far as that world. In much the same way, the tendril ending at Octaria (seems to be reference to the Ork Empire of Octarius) doesn't mean the Tyranid fleet has been destroyed, when all the latest information shows the Tyranids and Orks still busy fighting there.

PredaKhaine wrote:
Don't forget, Maugan-Ra also went into the eye of terror and got his craftworld back.

It said Maugan Ra "guided what was left of his craftworld out of the Eye of Terror". In the Eye of Terror campaign, Altansar forces were shown intervening in favor of the Eldar in the crone world warzones, so Altansar was still intact, but unable to find the way out somehow due to the effects of the Eye or Chaos warp magic. Guiding the way out is a believable achievement for one individual to make. However in this case, Maugan-Ra was not alone, and was accompanied by disciples.

I have reproduced the relevant section here:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/531298.page

Iracundus wrote:
in particular to be concluded about the fate of that tendril of Leviathan, just that it has reached as far as that world. In much the same way, the tendril ending at Octaria (seems to be reference to the Ork Empire of Octarius) doesn't mean the Tyranid fleet has been destroyed, when all the latest information shows the Tyranids and Orks still busy fighting there.

I disagree. In particular, because the arrow leading to Octarius doesn't end in a tidy little text-box saying "X stands (alone) against the Tyranid swarm, and triumphs."

Sounds like a fairly incisive event too me. Perhaps not the last thing we've ever hear from that tendril of Leviathan, but certainly more than a few dead rippers and most definitely a major, astonishing and all-out incredible feat of warfare (or, rather, single-combat) by Maugan Ra, who (last I checked) is an Eldar. It is, presumably, at least on par with other conflicts that "get text-boxes", such as the Ultramarines successfully defending Macragge.

 Zweischneid wrote:

Iracundus wrote:
in particular to be concluded about the fate of that tendril of Leviathan, just that it has reached as far as that world. In much the same way, the tendril ending at Octaria (seems to be reference to the Ork Empire of Octarius) doesn't mean the Tyranid fleet has been destroyed, when all the latest information shows the Tyranids and Orks still busy fighting there.

I disagree. In particular, because the arrow leading to Octarius doesn't end in a tidy little text-box saying "X stands (alone) against the Tyanid swarm, and triumphs."

Sounds like a fairly incisive event too me. Perhaps not the last thing we've ever hear from that tendril of Leviathan, but certainly more than a few dead rippers and most definitely a major, astonishing and all-out incredible feat of warfare (or, rather, single-combat) by Maugan Ra, who (last I checked) is an Eldar.

I never said it was just a band of rippers. To be mentioned in a box is to be notable in the first place, but it isn't the same as defeating a fleet single-handedly. A single-handed defeat of a force led by a Hive Tyrant would be notable enough, or like the tale of Maugan-Ra and that big synapse creature during the attack on Iyanden, but it doesn't allow anything to be concluded about the fleet itself.

Again see:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/531298.page

Maugan-Ra accomplishes a major feat of combat by killing a creature that in game terms would be roughly equivalent to a Trygon Prime and gains a tactical victory on Iyanden against the Tyranids. However, it didn't change the strategic situation and that was still left up to Yriel's intervention in the end.

Iracundus wrote:


It said Maugan Ra "guided what was left of his craftworld out of the Eye of Terror". In the Eye of Terror campaign, Altansar forces were shown intervening in favor of the Eldar in the crone world warzones, so Altansar was still intact, but unable to find the way out somehow due to the effects of the Eye or Chaos warp magic. Guiding the way out is a believable achievement for one individual to make. However in this case, Maugan-Ra was not alone, and was accompanied by disciples.

I have reproduced the relevant section here:

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/531298.page

I've always found that to be interesting as the eye of terror = the warp/realspace overlap. Eldar in the warp get munched by slaanesh. Unless Maugan-Ra decides to come and get you out of the warp. Maugan-Ra being alone or having a retinue doesn't change the fact that his craftworld spent about 40,000 years in the warp (I may not have the dates right - fall of the eldar/end of warps storms to the present)

But that wasn't why I brought this up - it was just to show another eldar victory. The eldar don't always lose, especially when the phoenix lords are involved

That is an excellent post you've linked - exalted

The Phoenix Lords are my favourite characters in the whole of 40k. Do you have any more fluff exploits for the rest of them?
I know Karandras went up against Ahra (codexs)
Jain Zar fought against the Night Lords (ADB's night Lords trilogy)

 MWHistorian wrote:
You think Eldar lose a lot?
Try being a Sisters of Battle player. Their fluff is nothing but them getting flat out slaughtered.

So who are these Sisters of Battle I keep reading about here? I cant seem to find a codex for them on the GW website?

JWhex wrote:

 MWHistorian wrote:
You think Eldar lose a lot?
Try being a Sisters of Battle player. Their fluff is nothing but them getting flat out slaughtered.

So who are these Sisters of Battle I keep reading about here? I cant seem to find a codex for them on the GW website?

Look harder:

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/landingArmy.jsp?catId=cat660002a&rootCatGameStyle=wh40k

The reason why you can't find a codex for them is because it hasn't been written. The only update they have received was in a White Dwarf that's no longer in circulation.
Before the WD, they were in Codex: Witchhunters.

Oh, stories about phoenix lords? How about Karandras in path of the warrior? Yeah. That was an interesting battle. He got his arse handed to him by a dreadnought, right :p

And don't remind us of Maugan-Ra. Look up his latest fluff in the Maugetar e-book. -_-"

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

JWhex wrote:

 MWHistorian wrote:
You think Eldar lose a lot?
Try being a Sisters of Battle player. Their fluff is nothing but them getting flat out slaughtered.

So who are these Sisters of Battle I keep reading about here? I cant seem to find a codex for them on the GW website?

Look harder:

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/landingArmy.jsp?catId=cat660002a&rootCatGameStyle=wh40k

The reason why you can't find a codex for them is because it hasn't been written. The only update they have received was in a White Dwarf that's no longer in circulation.
Before the WD, they were in Codex: Witchhunters.

But if they always get slaughtered is it a good idea to buy all those really expensive metal models?

 Enigma wrote:
Oh, stories about phoenix lords? How about Karandras in path of the warrior? Yeah. That was an interesting battle. He got his arse handed to him by a dreadnought, right :p

Karandras in that particular book deliberately sacrificed himself to save another character who was a reformed Dark Eldar. That he turned aside from the Dark Eldar ways to adopt the Path system is a symbolic victory for the Craftworld way of life, and Karandras took the hit that was meant for that character. Intentional sacrifices are not the same as losing. Also the ending of the book shows Karandras revived and running back towards the action in order to take revenge.

Didn't Karandras punch his way through a Tomb world?

 Kain wrote:
Didn't Karandras punch his way through a Tomb world?

Not quite. In WD 236, there is a short story by Gav Thorpe depicting a grievously wounded Karandras arriving at a craftworld. An exarch greets him and Karandras uses him to heal himself. In the process, the Exarch briefly experiences snatches of Karandras's memories before being absorbed and losing his sense of self. In one of those brief snatches of memories, Karandras is moving along some sort of shaft or tunnel and vowing that he would prevent the Necrons (presumably of that particular tomb) from awakening. The outcome is unknown as then it jumped to another memory.

Iracundus wrote:

 Enigma wrote:
Oh, stories about phoenix lords? How about Karandras in path of the warrior? Yeah. That was an interesting battle. He got his arse handed to him by a dreadnought, right :p

Karandras in that particular book deliberately sacrificed himself to save another character who was a reformed Dark Eldar. That he turned aside from the Dark Eldar ways to adopt the Path system is a symbolic victory for the Craftworld way of life, and Karandras took the hit that was meant for that character. Intentional sacrifices are not the same as losing. Also the ending of the book shows Karandras revived and running back towards the action in order to take revenge.

Heh, yeah I remember, at the time it just felt sad that he was "killed" by such a "mundane" thing as a simple dreadnought
But yes, saving the dark eldar was very important in its own context.

 Enigma wrote:

Iracundus wrote:

 Enigma wrote:
Oh, stories about phoenix lords? How about Karandras in path of the warrior? Yeah. That was an interesting battle. He got his arse handed to him by a dreadnought, right :p

Karandras in that particular book deliberately sacrificed himself to save another character who was a reformed Dark Eldar. That he turned aside from the Dark Eldar ways to adopt the Path system is a symbolic victory for the Craftworld way of life, and Karandras took the hit that was meant for that character. Intentional sacrifices are not the same as losing. Also the ending of the book shows Karandras revived and running back towards the action in order to take revenge.

Heh, yeah I remember, at the time it just felt sad that he was "killed" by such a "mundane" thing as a simple dreadnought
But yes, saving the dark eldar was very important in its own context.

Jain Zar got stepped on by one against the night lords... Thats more embarrasing...

In that particular book, Jain Zar wiped all the Night Lords in power armor virtually single handedly and demonstrated a technique of whirling her Blade of Destruction in a manner that allowed her to block a good portion of the bolter rounds fired her way. That ability was a nice addition in the same way that the WD article on Maugan Ra showed he had the mystic ability to root himself immovably to the ground at will. Similarly, the Apocalypse formation Shadow Sect of Karandras showed Karandras with the ability to lead squads of Scorpions from one shadowed place to another shadowed place without passing through the intervening space. These more esoteric mystic abilities help the image of the Phoenix Lords as supernatural immortal martial artists.