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I've heard of using no rifles to hunt for deer in some states but never actually been in a state where it was a law. Granted I've no desire to hunt animals due to prior real world experience. My wife hunts deer so I'm willing to watch her back while she waits for a deer. She's from deep south Missouri. Sebster though did bring up a RL issue on the deer meat density. Seen deer in MD...NC...SC...southern states. Now the deer in WI, WA, and Michigan...there's quite a bit of height difference. Body mass to. I will never shoot a deer with a 5.56mm being that the chance of the deer surviving the hit un-nerves me. Before someone jumps that the deer is not trying to "opt me out" either.


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Page seven and its a normal debate...well done my minions 8)

Talizvar wrote:Say if any people were armed in those movie theaters when a crazy stated shooting, there would be a whole lot less dead people.[/b]

I would like to see some sort of peer-reviewed study or trials on this. Can you provide anything to back up this claim? Or is this just an appeal to what you think might sound correct?

Well considering that was a "maybe" statement as opposed to a definitive claim it'd be hard to research a supposition Azazel. We have danced this before however. Private citizens and off duty/retired LEOs have intervened in numerous potential "mass shooting" situations, ending them before the "mass" part could have occurred. A recent excellent example would be the Clackamas Mall shootings, where a private citizen's intervention caused the shooter withdraw and suicide.

So theoretically could a private citizen or armed off duty LEO have changed things at the Aurora Theater shootings? John Holmes (the shooter) apparently thought so, he picked the theater that was not most convenient to his place of residence, but the one that was a gun free zone. Crazy though he may be, the man was extremely methodical in his planning of the shooting, as evidenced by the explosive device rigged at his apartment complex that he left behind.

5.56/.223 is a pretty popular deer round to my knowledge. The deer here in Colorado are bigger then the East Coast though, so .30 caliber weapons seem to be more of a standard. Antelope, coyote, some fur bearing animals and of course the western shooting sport of choice, prairie dog smacking (really a form of pest control) all are excellent to handle with 5.56 ammunition. Of course round selection can change how the bullet performs on impact. Ballistic tips, hotter powder loads, that type of thing. Everything comes together for a combined effect on target. I'll stick to my old lever action .30-30 for deer though.

KalashnikovMarine wrote:Well considering that was a "maybe" statement as opposed to a definitive claim it'd be hard to research a supposition Azazel. We have danced this before however.

We have danced to this tune, yes. And just as before, I shall end it with Hume's guillotine

 Jihadin wrote:
I always use a rifle in self defense...mainly M4 .....used my 9mm once....it was a big freaking camel spider

Hey if it was a camel spider, I can understand. Some big creepy spider? I'm calling in an air strike if I can, or the Wife.
"Baby there's a big scary spider in the bathroom, can you kill it? PLease... "

 Hordini wrote:
As far as hunting goes, certain people in the news media in America love to come on and claim that AR-15s and the like are useless for hunting, but it's really not true at all. A more truthful statement would be that it's not the best for hunting everything, something which is true of many guns. The 5.56/.223 round is an excellent varmint hunting round for things like coyotes and groundhogs. It also would be good for wild boar, and it is legal to hunt all these things with an AR-15 in my state. Somewhat strangely, outside of with a property destruction permit, my state doesn't allow deer hunting with any kind of rifle (you have to use a shotgun with a rifled slug, a high-caliber handgun at .357 or above, or a bow or crossbow). Most states do allow for taking deer with a rifle, however, and while an AR-15 would not be the most ideal rifle for deer, it is certainly possible to take a deer with one, and people do. I think part of the problem is many of the people who criticize the AR-15 most vigorously also don't really understand the difference between semi-automatic and fully automatic, and imagine someone hunting with an AR-15 would be machine-gunning game animals by dumping 30 rounds into them on one go, when really you'd be taking slow, well-aimed single shots, and depending on state laws, would likely be using a much smaller magazine anyway.

Sounds a lot like the problem with attempts at gun control, and the mythical "assault rifles" that everyone wants to clamp down on without being able to define them outside of being black and looking tacticool.

 Jihadin wrote:
I've heard of using no rifles to hunt for deer in some states but never actually been in a state where it was a law. Granted I've no desire to hunt animals due to prior real world experience. My wife hunts deer so I'm willing to watch her back while she waits for a deer. She's from deep south Missouri. Sebster though did bring up a RL issue on the deer meat density. Seen deer in MD...NC...SC...southern states. Now the deer in WI, WA, and Michigan...there's quite a bit of height difference. Body mass to. I will never shoot a deer with a 5.56mm being that the chance of the deer surviving the hit un-nerves me. Before someone jumps that the deer is not trying to "opt me out" either.


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Page seven and its a normal debate...well done my minions 8)

We have deer here up in Northern Indiana. I wouldn't mind giving hunting a go at some stage.

 Fafnir wrote:
Typically, if someone's going to break into your house, the mere presence of a weapon is enough to scare someone off. Very few people want to even take the risk of getting shot, be it with a high-powered rifle or a pistol. Especially if they're already intruding on someone else's property.

1. You have no proof of that whatsoever. You're literally making that up.
2. How are they going to know you have a weapon unless you use it?


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 HiveFleetPlastic wrote:

 MrMoustaffa wrote:
*You wouldn't call a guy crazy to have a window breaking tool in his car in case it fell into a lake and he was trapped underwater.
*You wouldn't call a person crazy for having a few months worth of non perishable food items in case of an emergency, even though the chances of needing it are astronomically low.

Personally, I wouldn't call you crazy for those because it wouldn't be very tactful. I do think they're pretty bizarre. I might call you crazy if you banged on about how people were conspiring to steal your window-breaking tool and/or beans for years and years and years.

Frankly, if crime is such a huge issue in your country that you're seriously worried about people invading your home to kill you or killing you in the street for your car then I think you should stop worrying about gun control and start worrying about how to bring the crime rate down.

Bizarre? Both the federal and state government here says you should have such supplies in case of a major hurricane coming in.
The Wife, when living in Illinois, was told to have a window breaker in her car when she was taking her driver's ed.

 Dreadclaw69 wrote:
We have deer here up in Northern Indiana. I wouldn't mind giving hunting a go at some stage.

Good hunting up there, and venison is oh so good. If your ever serious on getting set up to hunt, shoot me a PM.

 Slarg232 wrote:

 MrDwhitey wrote:
Slarg's just making a stupid argument badly. Ignore it.

Why can you always find the British people in American Political threads?

They are attracted by our Chicago style pizza, and stay for the conversation. Cheese and tomatoes bridging barriers since 1492...


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Also, this isn't an American only forum, grow up.

Having officially "grown up" I can safely say that its highly over rated...


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 Slarg232 wrote:

 MrDwhitey wrote:
I apologise for the testiness of my reaction, but if you look at OT any time a "foreign" issue comes up there's almost always American posters in it.

I think that it's a stupid, Frazzled-esque "counter", and I didn't expect it.

I agree, I don't think Americans should be telling the British how to run their country, and I don't think British people should be telling Americans how to run their country. I try to actively avoid the other country threads


It's K Dwhitey, I still loves you

As a Texan, I clearly should be telling both of you how to run your countries. After all, in order to converse with his equal a Texan is forced to talk to Dog.

 djones520 wrote:
Good hunting up there, and venison is oh so good. If your ever serious on getting set up to hunt, shoot me a PM.

Will do. Might be a wee while though, I think I need my citizenship (or at least Permanent Residence) before I can purchase a firearm, and USCIS are taking their sweet time

Also, if that was meant to be a Frazzled style post, it needs more Weiner dogs.

Exactly. I'll help.
TBone, who pretty much refuses to die out of sheer spite at this point, climbed into the garden, but became trapped by the garden hose. When I picked him up, Rodney became jealou8s so I picked him up too. This was ok until he started licking my nose.


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 CptJake wrote:
Jihadin makes a great point. From experience, there is a LOT of blood in a human body, and the cops and paramedics don't clean up for you.

Thats what the wiener dogs are for. Snacktime!

Yes I went there.

To be fair, I do love chicago style pizza.

 Frazzled wrote:
Thats what the wiener dogs are for. Snacktime!

Yes I went there.

You could have a side business using the Weiner dogs to clean up crime scenes

Frazzled's Big Truck O Wiener Dogs. If you have a badgers, or an unsightly critical incident, just give us a call.

 Frazzled wrote:
Frazzled's Big Truck O Wiener Dogs. If you have a badgers, or an unsightly critical incident, just give us a call.

Or Zombies that need dealt with, if I recall Weiner dogs featured in the 'World War Z' book

Yes, yes they did!

Frazzled wrote:

 Fafnir wrote:
Typically, if someone's going to break into your house, the mere presence of a weapon is enough to scare someone off. Very few people want to even take the risk of getting shot, be it with a high-powered rifle or a pistol. Especially if they're already intruding on someone else's property.

1. You have no proof of that whatsoever. You're literally making that up.
2. How are they going to know you have a weapon unless you use it?

Fafnir is paraphrasing the entire line of reasoning behind the "criminals don't commit crimes where they think a gun will be; that's why they target gun-free zones". So it's nice to see you argue against that idiotic line, Frazz.

1. You have no proof of that whatsoever. You're literally making that up.
2. How are they going to know you have a weapon unless you use it?

Alright people...not thinking ahead on this.....the "suspect" has fair warning you are armed....when you rack a round into the chamber. Its pretty loud when both parties are trying to be quiet..then when the home owner notice how loud it is....and the "suspect" freezes or bolts out the door. My advice..and dead serious on this...announce you are now armed.

Criminals don't target gun free zones. Psycho killers however, do.


Pyscho killer ques ques que!


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 Jihadin wrote:

1. You have no proof of that whatsoever. You're literally making that up.
2. How are they going to know you have a weapon unless you use it?

Alright people...not thinking ahead on this.....the "suspect" has fair warning you are armed....when you rack a round into the chamber. Its pretty loud when both parties are trying to be quiet..then when the home owner notice how loud it is....and the "suspect" freezes or bolts out the door. My advice..and dead serious on this...announce you are now armed.

This is advised by the PoPo and NRA videos as well. Thou shalt not goeth ninja like after yon prey. Instead thouest shalt hold up in thine secured position, with thine phone and thine SAW, and whilst calling thine Shire reeves that shalt illuminate the villain and pierce his navery, that thouest be armed and that if heeth approacheth whether beist by stealthy foot or thundering colossus, that he shalt snuff it, and verily.

Does thy count to three, but not four? Five is right out!

 Jihadin wrote:

1. You have no proof of that whatsoever. You're literally making that up.
2. How are they going to know you have a weapon unless you use it?

Alright people...not thinking ahead on this.....the "suspect" has fair warning you are armed....when you rack a round into the chamber. Its pretty loud when both parties are trying to be quiet..then when the home owner notice how loud it is....and the "suspect" freezes or bolts out the door. My advice..and dead serious on this...announce you are now armed.

No sense in racking the slide if you already carry with a round in the chamber though.

If there is one thing movies have taught me it is that you always rack the slide.

If there is one thing movies have taught me, it's that movies are all wrong.

Wait..

 d-usa wrote:
If there is one thing movies have taught me it is that you always rack the slide.

It's the only way to tactically tacticooly subdue your enemies.

 d-usa wrote:
Does thy count to three, but not four? Five is right out!

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 d-usa wrote:
If there is one thing movies have taught me it is that you always rack the slide.

Just as long as you aren't racked BY the slide...

 d-usa wrote:
If there is one thing movies have taught me it is that you always rack the slide.

It is just cinematic semiotics, not meant to reflect reality. If you want things to be more realistic than there are options, such as cinema verite, the extension of French Realism, or things like mumblecore and Dogme 95. I wouldn't recommend the latter that much to be honest.

If your packing a AR15/M4....you have 25 rounds to rack through besides...nothing more golden then hearing "Oh CRAP"
Pump action shotgun
9mm pistol racking a round..hey you have at least a full mag in the grip...
Hammer on a cylinder weapon
Hammers on a double barrel..
Hammer on a old school shotgun....looking at you UK

Not like your going to knife the guy....

Why not 30 rounds....think of the spring in the mag...how many here besides the vets actually think of magazine upkeep.....not fun having a failure to feed when you really need a live weapon in a situation.

Wo Wo WO BACK THE FREIGHT TRAIN UP!

Where's film noir?

 Frazzled wrote:
Where's film noir?

It is somewhere out there but nowhere near any of the schools focused on the idea of realism in mechanically reproduced image and sound.

 Ahtman wrote:

 Frazzled wrote:
Where's film noir?

It is somewhere out there but nowhere near any of the schools focused on the idea of realism in mechanically reproduced image and sound.

But its kewl daddy O, real kewl.