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 d-usa wrote:
If there is one thing movies have taught me it is that you always rack the slide.

They've also taught me that, because I am the "good guy" I will ALWAYS have to reload at the most inopportune moment, and the guys coming after me will always have unlimited ammo.



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 Jihadin wrote:

Not like your going to knife the guy....

Well yeah, I plan on it... It's why I ONLY buy firearms based on whether I can fix a bayonet onto the front... Yep, 1911 with a bayonet












(Yes, I am only joking, using a bayonet in a gunfight has it's uses, but on a pistol? c'mon now!)

Movies have also taught me however, then when uncertain if weaponry will kill the creature, a good flamethrower is a perfect go to can of whoopass. Plus its cool.

Just make sure your homeowner insurance is paid up.

I'm disappointed that no one has said that movie have taught me to nuke the site from orbit


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Oh and your opponents will be merciless killing machines with laser accuracy, except when they point a weapon at you.

And a grubby old vest is always bullet proof

 Jihadin wrote:
Why not 30 rounds....think of the spring in the mag...how many here besides the vets actually think of magazine upkeep.....not fun having a failure to feed when you really need a live weapon in a situation.

I've been doing some research on this lately, and while I've come across a lot of conflicting anecdotal information on this, it seems like the general consensus that fully loading a magazine won't wear out the spring. Do you have any verifiable evidence that fully loading a magazine contributed significantly to wear on the magazine spring? Not that magazine springs can't wear out, but that the act of fully loading the magazine is actually what caused it?

 Hordini wrote:

 Jihadin wrote:
Why not 30 rounds....think of the spring in the mag...how many here besides the vets actually think of magazine upkeep.....not fun having a failure to feed when you really need a live weapon in a situation.

I've been doing some research on this lately, and while I've come across a lot of conflicting anecdotal information on this, it seems like the general consensus that fully loading a magazine won't wear out the spring. Do you have any verifiable evidence that fully loading a magazine contributed significantly to wear on the magazine spring? Not that magazine springs can't wear out, but that the act of fully loading the magazine is actually what caused it?

I know in basically all the deploying units ive been with, it's the SOP that you remove your ammo and 'clean' the spring every 3 months, especially in a combat zone. I would suppose that the act of fully loading a magazine by itself won't wear out the spring, leaving it that way for too long may cause a permanent compression?

Plus, in most units, you have to realize that your magazines (unless you're in a cool guy unit) have been through probably a dozen different soldiers, and god knows how many deployments, plus ranges and training and everything else. So not taking care of them is just poor on the soldier who currently "owns" them.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 Hordini wrote:

 Jihadin wrote:
Why not 30 rounds....think of the spring in the mag...how many here besides the vets actually think of magazine upkeep.....not fun having a failure to feed when you really need a live weapon in a situation.

I've been doing some research on this lately, and while I've come across a lot of conflicting anecdotal information on this, it seems like the general consensus that fully loading a magazine won't wear out the spring. Do you have any verifiable evidence that fully loading a magazine contributed significantly to wear on the magazine spring? Not that magazine springs can't wear out, but that the act of fully loading the magazine is actually what caused it?

I know in basically all the deploying units ive been with, it's the SOP that you remove your ammo and 'clean' the spring every 3 months, especially in a combat zone. I would suppose that the act of fully loading a magazine by itself won't wear out the spring, leaving it that way for too long may cause a permanent compression?

Plus, in most units, you have to realize that your magazines (unless you're in a cool guy unit) have been through probably a dozen different soldiers, and god knows how many deployments, plus ranges and training and everything else. So not taking care of them is just poor on the soldier who currently "owns" them.

Do you guys ever replace magazine springs? Talking to people who have stored fully loaded magazines long-term, it seems like keeping a magazine loaded or unloaded doesn't damage or permanently compress the spring, but rather the action of repeatedly loading and unloading (either from firing the weapon or unloading the magazine by hand) is what causes wear to the spring. It might depend on the type of magazine and/or weapon, but a number I've heard floated is that magazine springs should be replaced every 5,000 rounds or so.

I appreciate you sharing your experience and I'm not trying to call it into question. I just wish there was some kind of study on this, because with magazines going through a dozen different soldiers, it seems like it'd be really hard to tell if the spring is worn out because some of the soldiers kept it fully loaded, or simply because the magazine has been loaded and reloaded a million times.

Like Ensis said...like every three months to pop the spring out and stretch it...say 4-5 inches...that is if you constantly have it loaded to max rounds. Sometimes less then 90 days on the condition of the magazine. I had a couple mags I relegated to "last resort" placement on my vest due to the noticeable wear and tear visible on them. I am not going to risk my life depending on a questionable magazine when most my time is dealing with failure to feed or overfeed. Good way to test your spring though is to rack a complete mag through it. Remove the firing pin but still treat the weapon as "Live" and aim it down range or a clearing barrel or something close to a clearing barrel....straight out dirt will do

Failure to feed = stretch your spring a bit
Over Feed = really compress your spring though I rarely seen this happen.

We talking 30 round mags right?

Yeah, I was referring to 30 round magazines.

So I take it the springs are never actually replaced, just cleaned and stretched or compressed? I'm just wondering if it's primarily ancient springs with thousands and thousands of rounds cycled through them that are the real problem, rather than whether or not the mag has been kept fully-loaded.

I just keep my mags unloaded, but Pmags and the Chip McCormick power mags I feed my 1911 all report their suitability for long term loaded storage.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:
They've also taught me that, because I am the "good guy" I will ALWAYS have to reload at the most inopportune moment, and the guys coming after me will always have unlimited ammo.

But its okay, because the bad guys never hit. Well, unless you bring along a uniformed policeman with you, in which case the bad guys will drill that unfortunate loser in the first 30 seconds.

Mag springs are perishable, guys, but they're also cheap. Just buy more.

 Seaward wrote:
Mag springs are perishable, guys, but they're also cheap. Just buy more.

That's probably the best solution to the magazine question.

True...but then might as well just buy new mag's. I am tempted though to "test" a Magpul mag. We had a NG unit from Arkansas...whoever has that Razorback hog of a patch to get selected to test a new version of the mag in 2010. They did the arm escort convoy runs for whoever need what run where...especially when the new MATV version for the "Darkside" units started arriving in KAF.

I used to (and still occasionally) run an HK. The mag bodies'll last forever, so I'd much rather just pick up five springs for ten bucks through Wolff's than spend $35 per pop on a new mag.

Also, I could've sworn Big Army banned PMags last year.

Corps banned Pmags back in... 08 or 09 I think... I seem to recall it being right around then. Because using the issued garbage is so much better for everyone involved.

 Seaward wrote:

Also, I could've sworn Big Army banned PMags last year.

They did, or it was a couple years ago.. They reasoned that the issued junk worked better than any magazine on the market.... Yeah... RIIIIIGHT


Still doesnt stop my unit issuing Pmags.

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 Seaward wrote:

Also, I could've sworn Big Army banned PMags last year.

They did, or it was a couple years ago.. They reasoned that the issued junk worked better than any magazine on the market.... Yeah... RIIIIIGHT


Still doesnt stop my unit issuing Pmags.

I thought it had to do with them separating at the seams when in hot environments, though my memory of the blurb is admittedly very hazy.

 Seaward wrote:

 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

 Seaward wrote:

Also, I could've sworn Big Army banned PMags last year.

They did, or it was a couple years ago.. They reasoned that the issued junk worked better than any magazine on the market.... Yeah... RIIIIIGHT


Still doesnt stop my unit issuing Pmags.

I thought it had to do with them separating at the seams when in hot environments, though my memory of the blurb is admittedly very hazy.

The word we got at the time, was that the government 'tests' showed that the pmags and basically ALL magazines other than the crappy basic issue ones had "feeding" and other "reliability" issues where the basic ones didnt.... Reading between the lines, some congressman was losing money in his district (the one that makes crappy military magazines), and wanted to make sure that the money kept flowing.

I'll buy that, I have never seen a Pmag have any problem of any kind.

Mags and clips are for sissies, all good weapons are belt fed.

I did some (very) mild digging, and there's a lot of differing explanations. Don't work well with the HK416, Magpul won't give up the technical data rights, whatever.

An SME over on M4Carbine did say he's seen cracking issues before, though.

Oh well. Doesn't really matter I guess. I'd imagine Ensis' between-the-lines interpretation is as good as any.