Australian College Baseball player gunned down

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**d-usa**

Hate crime, I'm sure of it.

But don't worry, there is already a call in that thread to get some rednecks to catch the black teens and give them the justice that they deserve.

**Dreadclaw69**

Let's turn the tables just a minute - had a white person gunned down a black person, and tweeted that "90% of black people (people) are nasty. #HATE THEM" would we even be having a debate over whether or not the crime was motivated by racism?

**djones520**

d-usa wrote:
Hate crime, I'm sure of it.

But don't worry, there is already a call in that thread to get some rednecks to catch the black teens and give them the justice that they deserve.

I can't really argue with the sentiment. Anyone who'd curb stomp an 88 year old man for no reason deserves whatever happens to them. But our justice system will prevail, as it should.

**Alfndrate**

d-usa wrote:
djones520 wrote:
d-usa wrote:
A certain crowd has been waiting on a high profile black-on-white killing to somehow prove that they are right. Not surprised with the development of this case.

Don't really need a high profile one. They happen at a rate of 14:1 for white on black killings. They're all over the place. Like the WW2 Vet who was just murdered yesterday.

Should have included "...that they could spin into a hate-crime", sorry for the omission.

Which is why I've been saying that the color of their skin or their race shouldn't come into play. These are three kids that did a horrible crime and should be punished appropriately.

**whembly**

Good read... check out the video in the article.

Chris Lane shooting a gang initiation, says father who called police

Duncan, Oklahoma: Chris Lane was murdered as a part of a gang initiation, according to James Johnson, the father of a boy who was also allegedly targeted by the three youths accused of killing Mr Lane.

Police have not commented on the claim, though court documents confirm the accused were eventually arrested in front of the boy's home.

In their car, police say they found a shotgun and the .22-calibre revolver they believe was used to kill Mr Lane, and a cache of ammunition.

Mr Johnson told Fairfax Media that the three youths had been trying to recruit his 17-year-old son, Chris, into a gang, and that Chris had refused.

On Friday afternoon, two hours after Mr Lane's murder, Mr Johnson was working on his truck in the Immanuel Church car park opposite the home where Chris lives with his mother, Sheila Haynes.

From inside the home, Chris rang Mr Johnson and said he had received a death threat from the accused boys, who he knew from school, via Facebook. As he put his mobile phone away, Mr Johnson saw the three youths, whom he has known all their lives, in a black car in the middle of the car park.

Mr Johnson was unaware of the earlier shooting, or that police were already scouring the town for the car after it had been described at the scene of the earlier shooting.

According to Mr Johnson, one of the boys, James Edwards, got out of the car and appeared to either stretch or reach down for something.

Pretending to still be on the phone to Chris, Mr Johnson called police, who were on the scene within minutes.

Court documents filed by police confirm that Mr Johnson called police to tell them three armed youths were in front of the home at 7.05pm, some four hours after Mr Lane was shot dead, and that officers were dispatched to the car park where they arrested the three accused.

But the documents also show that police found ammunition for a .22-calibre revolver like the one they allege was used to kill Mr Lane was by then hidden in the car's air intake, while a second weapon, a shotgun, was disassembled.

"I don't think it was an initiation – I know it was an initiation, my son told me it was an initiation," Mr Johnson told Fairfax Media.

Since the murder and the arrests, Mr Johnson has sent Chris away for safety to a youth program.

If Mr Johnson is correct, the revelation could go some way to providing a motive for the killing. Duncan residents — and people around the world — have struggled to accept that the youths would have committed the murder out of boredom, as one of the accused has told police.

"I just thank God I was there, and that Chris was not outside, they could have just driven past and shot him, I don't even like to contemplate that," Mr Johnson said.

"To be quite honest, if they were smarter, they could have come up behind me and shot me in the head."

He described the three youths - James Edwards, Michael Jones and the accused shooter, Chancey Luna - as good boys who had gone off the rails.

"They don't have proper fathers in their lives. You can't be a friend to your son, you got to be the father," he said.

"I feel very sorry for them, they have ruined their whole lives, but they did the crime, they have to do the time. Perhaps they can make a life inside, get God in their lives," he said.

"That Edwards was some talent, wrestling, football, he was an athlete. Satan has taken a lot of lives here."

He said a gang operating in nearby cities, such as Oklahoma City and Dallas, has been recruiting in Duncan. He said he believed the gang was responsible for the theft of guns in the area.

Sheila Haynes, who has three children with Mr Johnson, was not at home during the incident, which occurred on her birthday. Chris was at home with their youngest daughter, Shanelle, who is 15.

"I am just thankful that I did not have to lose a son on my birthday," she said. "But I am so sad that someone else did."

Asked if Chris had been scared by the incident, she said: "Well, if he is, he is not going to tell me, as his mom.

"He just said to me, 'Mom if it is my time, it is my time'."

**Monster Rain**

Alfndrate wrote:
d-usa wrote:
djones520 wrote:
d-usa wrote:
A certain crowd has been waiting on a high profile black-on-white killing to somehow prove that they are right. Not surprised with the development of this case.

Don't really need a high profile one. They happen at a rate of 14:1 for white on black killings. They're all over the place. Like the WW2 Vet who was just murdered yesterday.

Should have included "...that they could spin into a hate-crime", sorry for the omission.

Which is why I've been saying that the color of their skin or their race shouldn't come into play. These are three kids that did a horrible crime and should be punished appropriately.

This has always been my issue with hate crime legislation.

Why not punish all crimes as harshly as we would a "hate crime"?

**d-usa**

whembly wrote:
Good read... check out the video in the article.

Chris Lane shooting a gang initiation, says father who called police

Duncan, Oklahoma: Chris Lane was murdered as a part of a gang initiation, according to James Johnson, the father of a boy who was also allegedly targeted by the three youths accused of killing Mr Lane.

Police have not commented on the claim, though court documents confirm the accused were eventually arrested in front of the boy's home.

In their car, police say they found a shotgun and the .22-calibre revolver they believe was used to kill Mr Lane, and a cache of ammunition.

Mr Johnson told Fairfax Media that the three youths had been trying to recruit his 17-year-old son, Chris, into a gang, and that Chris had refused.

On Friday afternoon, two hours after Mr Lane's murder, Mr Johnson was working on his truck in the Immanuel Church car park opposite the home where Chris lives with his mother, Sheila Haynes.

From inside the home, Chris rang Mr Johnson and said he had received a death threat from the accused boys, who he knew from school, via Facebook. As he put his mobile phone away, Mr Johnson saw the three youths, whom he has known all their lives, in a black car in the middle of the car park.

Mr Johnson was unaware of the earlier shooting, or that police were already scouring the town for the car after it had been described at the scene of the earlier shooting.

According to Mr Johnson, one of the boys, James Edwards, got out of the car and appeared to either stretch or reach down for something.

Pretending to still be on the phone to Chris, Mr Johnson called police, who were on the scene within minutes.

Court documents filed by police confirm that Mr Johnson called police to tell them three armed youths were in front of the home at 7.05pm, some four hours after Mr Lane was shot dead, and that officers were dispatched to the car park where they arrested the three accused.

But the documents also show that police found ammunition for a .22-calibre revolver like the one they allege was used to kill Mr Lane was by then hidden in the car's air intake, while a second weapon, a shotgun, was disassembled.

"I don't think it was an initiation – I know it was an initiation, my son told me it was an initiation," Mr Johnson told Fairfax Media.

Since the murder and the arrests, Mr Johnson has sent Chris away for safety to a youth program.

If Mr Johnson is correct, the revelation could go some way to providing a motive for the killing. Duncan residents — and people around the world — have struggled to accept that the youths would have committed the murder out of boredom, as one of the accused has told police.

"I just thank God I was there, and that Chris was not outside, they could have just driven past and shot him, I don't even like to contemplate that," Mr Johnson said.

"To be quite honest, if they were smarter, they could have come up behind me and shot me in the head."

He described the three youths - James Edwards, Michael Jones and the accused shooter, Chancey Luna - as good boys who had gone off the rails.

"They don't have proper fathers in their lives. You can't be a friend to your son, you got to be the father," he said.

"I feel very sorry for them, they have ruined their whole lives, but they did the crime, they have to do the time. Perhaps they can make a life inside, get God in their lives," he said.

"That Edwards was some talent, wrestling, football, he was an athlete. Satan has taken a lot of lives here."

He said a gang operating in nearby cities, such as Oklahoma City and Dallas, has been recruiting in Duncan. He said he believed the gang was responsible for the theft of guns in the area.

Sheila Haynes, who has three children with Mr Johnson, was not at home during the incident, which occurred on her birthday. Chris was at home with their youngest daughter, Shanelle, who is 15.

"I am just thankful that I did not have to lose a son on my birthday," she said. "But I am so sad that someone else did."

Asked if Chris had been scared by the incident, she said: "Well, if he is, he is not going to tell me, as his mom.

"He just said to me, 'Mom if it is my time, it is my time'."

There really is no real gang activity in that town.

And the whole "kill some random stranger gang initiation" is mostly an urban myth.

Now I wouldn't be surprised if these three were going around pretending to be some sort of gang because they wanted to pretend to be street-wise gang-bangers.

The story itself doesn't make much sense. These three were already in a gang and tried to recruit his son, but then they killed somebody so that they could be in a gang. It doesn't really flow.

**Seaward**

Dreadclaw69 wrote:
Let's turn the tables just a minute - had a white person gunned down a black person, and tweeted that "90% of black people (people) are nasty. #HATE THEM" would we even be having a debate over whether or not the crime was motivated by racism?

Nope.

Ain't no standards like double standards.

**whembly**

d-usa wrote:

There really is no real gang activity in that town.

And the whole "kill some random stranger gang initiation" is mostly an urban myth.

Now I wouldn't be surprised if these three were going around pretending to be some sort of gang because they wanted to pretend to be street-wise gang-bangers.

The story itself doesn't make much sense. These three were already in a gang and tried to recruit his son, but then they killed somebody so that they could be in a gang. It doesn't really flow.

I was kinda hoping for something more than "we were bored".

Thanks for your input.

**d-usa**

whembly wrote:
d-usa wrote:

There really is no real gang activity in that town.

And the whole "kill some random stranger gang initiation" is mostly an urban myth.

Now I wouldn't be surprised if these three were going around pretending to be some sort of gang because they wanted to pretend to be street-wise gang-bangers.

The story itself doesn't make much sense. These three were already in a gang and tried to recruit his son, but then they killed somebody so that they could be in a gang. It doesn't really flow.

I was kinda hoping for something more than "we were bored".

Thanks for your input.

I think everyone hopes that there is a "better" reason (as if there is ever a good reason), and it could still be gang related. But the history isn't really there in that town.

Oklahoma City if filled with gangs, and we don't ever have anything like that here. So it would be very weird for something like that to happen in Duncan.

But a bunch of wanna-be gangsters doing something that comes straight out of the gang-banger urban legend journal, that seems more likely.

**hotsauceman1**

My black Uncle said this "Sometimes our race does it to ourselves. Our Steadfast defense of any black person accused of a crime is what gives our race a bad rep. As if we ur race is perfect. Sometimes people do bad things. White people do not tands by murderers and theives. Neither do Hispanics. but black people will automatically say 'He didnt do it, they where framed/threatened' leading to the idea we think crime is ok, or we are ignorant"
It got me thinking. Recently with black crimes in which there was TOO much evidence(This, The Stubenville rape case, the martin shoot) they stood by them, despite overwhelming evidence.

**Alfndrate**

hotsauceman1 wrote:
My black Uncle said this "Sometimes our race does it to ourselves. Our Steadfast defense of any black person accused of a crime is what gives our race a bad rep. As if we ur race is perfect. Sometimes people do bad things. White people do not tands by murderers and theives. Neither do Hispanics. but black people will automatically say 'He didnt do it, they where framed/threatened' leading to the idea we think crime is ok, or we are ignorant"
It got me thinking. Recently with black crimes in which there was TOO much evidence(This, The Stubenville rape case, the martin shoot) they stood by them, despite overwhelming evidence.

You've obviously never been to Steubanville... It's mostly white, and only 1/2 of the crew involved in that case was black. The other guy was white, and both races in the town were saying they were innocent...

**MrDwhitey**

Frazzled wrote:
This is what happens when you live in a state as flat as a pool table. We need hills people. Won't someone think of the children!

I saw this and immediately thought, "Why aren't the Dutch murdering each other at a much higher rate?"

**Frazzled**

They live near the beach. That mellows you out. Have you ever met an up tight Tahitian?

**MrDwhitey**

I do my best not to meet anyone, so no.

Although during my visit to Germany (That's the full name of Holland btw), I find the Germandutchs to be very uptight.

**xole**

MrDwhitey wrote:
I do my best not to meet anyone, so no.

Although during my visit to Germany (That's the full name of Holland btw), I find the Germandutchs to be very uptight.

That's sort of a cultural thing.

Now, back to whether or not this crime was racist. it makes it a bit more confusing since one of the kids was white(assuming they have the right photos for all 3 of them) while at least one of the others seemed to hate white people..

**Gentleman_Jellyfish**

xole wrote:
MrDwhitey wrote:
I do my best not to meet anyone, so no.

Although during my visit to Germany (That's the full name of Holland btw), I find the Germandutchs to be very uptight.

That's sort of a cultural thing.

Now, back to whether or not this crime was racist. it makes it a bit more confusing since one of the kids was white(assuming they have the right photos for all 3 of them) while at least one of the others seemed to hate white people..

90% of them.

**schadenfreude**

The family thinks it was a gang initiation. The random killings for a gang initiation being ordered by the gang is mostly an urban myth, but calling it an urban myth is a half truth. It's highly unlikely that a gang member would directly tell perspective members that are not yet trusted to commit murder because they have not earned the gangs trust yet and doing so is conspiracy to commit murder. What is very likely is those 3 wanted into a gang, and decided on their own to take a drastic measure as a desperate effort to prove themselves.

The location was near Oklahoma city which has a bad crime problem. It's not South LA, Detroit, Flint, or Oakland bad, but Oklahoma city is more violent than New Orleans and is 9th in the nation in property crimes.

Mug shots of the shitbirds.

It looks more like a gang initiation to me than a hate crime because well I couldn't help but notice one of them was a nearly 6'4" tall white boy and usually when people commit a hate crime they don't ask a member of the ethnic group being attacked to drive the getaway car.

Last but not least Al Sharpton did make a comment on the killing.

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/08/al-sharpton-chris-lane-murder-oklahoma-95834.html

People race baiting this killing are acting like Al Sharpton, are seeing a race issue when a race issue isn't there like Al Sharpton, are using an imaginary race issue to race bait like Al Sharpton, and are forcing me to agree with Al Sharpton on this one particular issue.

**daedalus**

Hypothetically speaking, if I were white, and openly stated that I hate whites, and started killing whites, maybe by virtue of the fact they were white, would that be a hate crime?

I've been against the race card from the beginning, but I am curious.

**motyak**

Following a link from that site you put there (and going a bit off topic, but I really want to know how this is possible)... http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2013/08/whats-the-matter-with-louisiana-171019.html huh? That was before Obama...

**Relapse**

motyak wrote:
Following a link from that site you put there (and going a bit off topic, but I really want to know how this is possible)... http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2013/08/whats-the-matter-with-louisiana-171019.html huh? That was before Obama...

Because some people aren't happy with the way recovery has gone on under Obama, if I read this article right:

http://www.louisianaweekly.com/seven-years-after-katrina-a-divided-new-orleans/

Or the amount of homless now in the city compared to pre Katrina levels:

http://seattletimes.com/html/nationworld/2018844229_katrina05.html

**Ouze**

Truly, Obama is history's greatest monster.

**Relapse**

Ouze wrote:
Truly, Obama is history's greatest monster.

Just giving some possible reasons why people answered that poll the way they did. If there are now roughly 40,000 abandoned homes that are rotting to pieces in that city and being squatted in by 2x the number of homeless as pre Katrina, it would definitely make people think the current administration is dragging it's feet in aid.

**Ouze**

I see - we're claiming Obama is responsible for the poor response to Hurricane Katrina by stretching the definition of "response" to 8 years afterward, is that fair to say, with the idea that to "the administration is dragging it's feet in aid"?

Automatically Appended Next Post:
We should start a new thread for this, it's pretty offtopic.

**d-usa**

Ouze wrote:
I see - we're claiming Obama is responsible for the poor response to Hurricane Katrina by stretching the definition of "response" to 8 years afterward, is that fair to say, with the idea that to "the administration is dragging it's feet in aid"?

Automatically Appended Next Post:
We should start a new thread for this, it's pretty offtopic.

Almost every thread goes full circle and eventually contains "blame the gun" "race-baiting" "Obama's fault" "Everybody hates the ACA" "Liberal Media" "Religion is evil" and "#YOLO".

We are almost there, keep it going!

**Ouze**

Is this a new thing, or has this always happened and I just never really noticed?

**Jihadin**

I never seen Obama connected with Post Katrina response. That's a new one.

**Relapse**

Ouze wrote:
I see - we're claiming Obama is responsible for the poor response to Hurricane Katrina by stretching the definition of "response" to 8 years afterward, is that fair to say, with the idea that to "the administration is dragging it's feet in aid"?

Automatically Appended Next Post:
We should start a new thread for this, it's pretty offtopic.

You don't think 8 years along is horrible response time? Look at the poll. 29 per cent thinks that Obama has a horrible response time because he has had four and a half years to get things cleaned up and hasn't. All I did was show possible reasons they think that way based off two of a few news items that outline the complaints of people living there. You might not like it and go off trying to make light of the opinions of people in New Orleans by saying Obama is history's greatest monster, but they're the ones having to deal with the crap.
Would you be happy, thinking you were being forgotten for an 8 year stretch of time? Read the posted articles to understand how these people feel.

**Jihadin**

I thought the Corp of Engineers are handling the reconstruction of Post Katrina?

**Relapse**

Jihadin wrote:
I thought the Corp of Engineers are handling the reconstruction of Post Katrina?

Here's the Wiki on the deal. It seems like the corp has been paying contractors and there is some of the usual red tape happening. The homless situation was bad when I lived there and it's changed by far for the worse.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reconstruction_of_New_Orleans