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 BoomWolf wrote:

scommy wrote:

Col. Dash wrote:
I ran into this this weekend. Here is the issue I see currently, Tau allied with GK with Cortez. A few of the big suits equiped with intercept and skyfire, broadsides equipped the same, and Cortez with a Storm squad. They have the long range fire power to pummel your longe range fire power. Even if you get a hit or two on the dangerous suits, they could care less since they are MCs not vehicles like you own dreadnought who can die in one hit. Land near them and now you deal with the Storm squad ability or Cortez having the squad shoot anything that comes down nearby.

Even a full Drop pod list you have what, maybe 4 pods on the first turn, three pods get shot up by one each of the three tau, and all four by Cortez squad. This doesnt even take into account the rest of the army, this is just the castled fire base.

You have summed it up perfectly.

Even if they dont have GK ally they can tarpit you with Kroot.

I was looking at going ally with IG to get the heavy artillery. But even that can be shot up easily, there is only so much cover to hide behind.

How can kroot possibly tarpit marines?!
They got no armor to speak of and hardly any assault power of their own-meaning they WILL lose combat, and with low Ld, they will also brake from it, and with low I will get run down to boot.
Kroot cannot really fight anything in combat unless it has 5+ armor or worse.


Also, as said, there is NO way to get broadsides with both skyfire and interceptor. at all. ever. with any shenanigans.

Well.....actually you can! Give them the EWO, and stick them with a Commander that has to get the warlord trait that gives him skyfire for a turn. :3

Oh...only on the shooting phase. :C

AnonAmbientLight wrote:

 BoomWolf wrote:

scommy wrote:

Col. Dash wrote:
I ran into this this weekend. Here is the issue I see currently, Tau allied with GK with Cortez. A few of the big suits equiped with intercept and skyfire, broadsides equipped the same, and Cortez with a Storm squad. They have the long range fire power to pummel your longe range fire power. Even if you get a hit or two on the dangerous suits, they could care less since they are MCs not vehicles like you own dreadnought who can die in one hit. Land near them and now you deal with the Storm squad ability or Cortez having the squad shoot anything that comes down nearby.

Even a full Drop pod list you have what, maybe 4 pods on the first turn, three pods get shot up by one each of the three tau, and all four by Cortez squad. This doesnt even take into account the rest of the army, this is just the castled fire base.

You have summed it up perfectly.

Even if they dont have GK ally they can tarpit you with Kroot.

I was looking at going ally with IG to get the heavy artillery. But even that can be shot up easily, there is only so much cover to hide behind.

How can kroot possibly tarpit marines?!
They got no armor to speak of and hardly any assault power of their own-meaning they WILL lose combat, and with low Ld, they will also brake from it, and with low I will get run down to boot.
Kroot cannot really fight anything in combat unless it has 5+ armor or worse.


Also, as said, there is NO way to get broadsides with both skyfire and interceptor. at all. ever. with any shenanigans.

Well.....actually you can! Give them the EWO, and stick them with a Commander that has to get the warlord trait that gives him skyfire for a turn. :3

Oh...only on the shooting phase. :C

Are you trying to say that kroot should take battle-suit subsystems?

Drop Pod vs Tau is a bit risky. You can't assault the turn You drop, so all You can do is shoot. And in the Tau player turn he will just kill any squad that came from a Drop Pod.

gausus wrote:
Drop Pod vs Tau is a bit risky. You can't assault the turn You drop, so all You can do is shoot. And in the Tau player turn he will just kill any squad that came from a Drop Pod.

But you only have to kill one unit.
Since most Tau Players have Ethereals these days, you just drop everything on top of that squad and eradicate it (since its only 15 T3 wounds tops) gaining you FB, STW and the +1 VP for killing an ethereal, putting you 3 VP up before the game has even started.

Pile that on top of things that will start on the table 100% of the time in a DP list (Devs w/ empty pod and TFCs for example). and the marine player can really force the Tau player on the backfoot.

Yes, if you kill the ethreal in a gunline-you have a good chance to win already.
He is a very strong buffer, but ultimately the weakest link in that army, not only for the extra KP, but as once he dies-the lines quickly crumble.

I didn't know that an etheral gave up an extra VP. I can't remember if it ever was relevant in a game I played, but the Tau players I have played have never mentioned it.

That's the reason to half the tau hate.

50% of the bandwagoners just copy a netlist and don't even properly learn the rules of how tau works, leading to massive number of errors that more often then not push a unit/wargear into the overpowered side of town.

How about fliers? Zooming up the field and dropping a mother load of CC units on their doorstep? Or can Tau handle fliers reliably?

 Razdalan wrote:
How about fliers? Zooming up the field and dropping a mother load of CC units on their doorstep? Or can Tau handle fliers reliably?

Hahahah! You must be new here.

On a more serious note, not only can the Tau deal with fliers, but flying anywhere near broadsides and melta riptides is suicide.

Why does everyone seem to think that broadsides will be packing skyfire, interceptor, splitfire and a 4up invuln all at the same time?

Broadsides are good, but they've gotta be tooled out specifically for a task and then employed at that. The fact that people are having to choose between skyrays and broadsides speaks volumes to this.

Because every time I have seen Riptides and Broadsides they are packing skyfire and/or Interceptor

Considering broadsides can only get one or the other they are not as bad.

It is the riptides that are the problem, however if you time your movement phase around it then it is not as bad since he has to give up shooting in his next turn, if you present enough threats it might not be as easy a decision to intercept or not.

Also with drop pods you can use your 6 inch move to get really close to his troops so he can't drop the template on you and has to do the three shots at bs 3. Suddenly its not so scary.

Alloy with guard and take 2 leman rus eradicators with heavy bolter sponsons. STR 6 large blast AP 4 ignores cover and isn't ordinance (meaning you can fire the bolters at full BS). If you sit on a skyshield you will wipe out every firewarior on enemy team before they die (even if they have longstrike).

3 Vindicators can wipe out any suits that try to advance

Shell them for 3 turns then move in and grab all the objectives

Heck, bait intercept on the riptides turn 1 with drop pods, turn 2 fly in with the Calvary. bada bing bada boom you now safely moved onto the board without being mulched. If they don't intercept you shoot the crud out of them with the things that drop podded in (which should do well by them selves)

Col. Dash wrote:
Because every time I have seen Riptides and Broadsides they are packing skyfire and/or Interceptor

And every time I see someone complaining about them online, they have both, along with split fire.

Anyone considered a Raven Guard Rhino Rush yet? 12inch scout + 6 inch move + 6 inch disembark... may be able to get within rapidfire and flamer range for first turn. And you don't have to worry about scatter or Interceptor. I'm thinking a couple units of Plasma Sternguard for Riptides, Tacticals to dakka down Pathfinders/Firewarriors and Ethereals, Backed up by Devs. Maybe even some cheapo flamer scout units in Storms. Flavor with a lightly upgraded Vanguard squad for turn two multicharging maybe.

Obviously would work best first turn, but when you pull second turn deploying half-in, half-out (Combat squad)of the Rhinos in cover to present too many targets should help, and if you were able to scout the Vanguard behind LOS blocking terrain (or just behind a few Rhinos) you could then charge on turn 1 (second player turn, first game turn). Or even place a midfield Aegis to scout up to (ya I know about Pathfinders etc, but they can't hit every unit at once).

I don't know, just throwing it out there.

Heck barrage them with whirlwinds as well snipe some ethereal. but the book comes out in like 2 days so i will wait and see.

 Krellnus wrote:

gausus wrote:
Drop Pod vs Tau is a bit risky. You can't assault the turn You drop, so all You can do is shoot. And in the Tau player turn he will just kill any squad that came from a Drop Pod.

But you only have to kill one unit.
Since most Tau Players have Ethereals these days, you just drop everything on top of that squad and eradicate it (since its only 15 T3 wounds tops) gaining you FB, STW and the +1 VP for killing an ethereal, putting you 3 VP up before the game has even started.

Nah, attach that Ethereal to one of your Broadside teams, place the Fire Warriors around it. The broadsides will have LOS to stuff over the Fire Warriors heads and the Ethereal benefits from majority T4 and 2+ saves to LOS to and can still pump out powers to all the units around him.

Ok, in a 1500 point game, considering you'll have maybe 500 points in like Objective Scouts, Thunderfires, Whirlwinds, and HQ's, you'll be able to field...

2x Dreadnoughts in Pods ~ 300 pts
5x 5 Man Tacs w/ a Flamer in Each in Pods ~ 525 pts
Sternguard x5 in Pod w/ 4x Combi Meltas ~ 175 pts

8 pods, with 4 on turn 1. The Dreads, Sternguard, and 1 Tac come in first then the other tacs come in 2nd turn. I think I might try it out.

Drop pod with dreadnought with TL HF, and HF. Kill some seriouse important infantry.

Maybe multiple of these.

Dreadnoughts (unless they get better or in some way or much cheaper point wise) are not worth it as of now, hopefully they will be a little better. I have watched to many games where Drop Pods arrive only to be sinped by either a BS 5 Icarus Lascannon or brought down by Riptides, Broadsides, firewarriros with a side armor angle ect. with ease. You will be better off getting more infantry on to the table then investing in a Dreadnought.

Ok, in a 1500 point game, considering you'll have maybe 500 points in like Objective Scouts, Thunderfires, Whirlwinds, and HQ's, you'll be able to field...

2x Dreadnoughts in Pods ~ 300 pts
5x 5 Man Tacs w/ a Flamer in Each in Pods ~ 525 pts
Sternguard x5 in Pod w/ 4x Combi Meltas ~ 175 pts

8 pods, with 4 on turn 1. The Dreads, Sternguard, and 1 Tac come in first then the other tacs come in 2nd turn. I think I might try it out.

If TAC marines can now take 5 guys with a drop pod I can see alot of small unit spam to bring in lots of Drop Pods in turn one, hoping that is the case. Also with Combi-Weapons being 10pts. each I would recommend taking only x3 combi-meltas max.

Your dreadnoughts die to interceptor fire - either the riptides will double fusion them or you will be bombarded with S7 Tank hunter twin-linked high-yield missile pods.

Your tac squads have a choice... drop fruther back and be out of range to do anything - and thus be on the losing end of a fire-fight with Tau, or drop in close, cause some minor damage from flamers - and then be on the losing end of a short ranged fire fight.

Or you go up against another army and lose. Seriously, that's not a TAC list.

Sgt_Scruffy wrote:
Your dreadnoughts die to interceptor fire - either the riptides will double fusion them or you will be bombarded with S7 Tank hunter twin-linked high-yield missile pods.

Not if your out of 18" range fusion and no tank hunter if you go first

and besides that if they just wasted interceptor on a dread the rest of your stuff is moving up as far as possible.

Sgt_Scruffy wrote:
Your dreadnoughts die to interceptor fire - either the riptides will double fusion them or you will be bombarded with S7 Tank hunter twin-linked high-yield missile pods.

Your tac squads have a choice... drop fruther back and be out of range to do anything - and thus be on the losing end of a fire-fight with Tau, or drop in close, cause some minor damage from flamers - and then be on the losing end of a short ranged fire fight.

Or you go up against another army and lose. Seriously, that's not a TAC list.

Would rather risk deploying close to the Aegis Defence Line with infantry (Sternguard with Flamers and Grav Guns for example) and get them up against the Aegis so they get a 4+ cover save from interceptor blast templates. Done this multiple times and it is very effective.

Hmm Sternguard can combat squad yes? 3 pods, 30 guard(yes, expensive) many high AP combi weapons and regular assault weapons. There are now 9 targets to be fired upon. Say its a triple Riptide list they are still only going to take out 3 teams leaving the other 3 to deliver heavy damage to something. If some had flamers even better vs the bubble wrap. Solution, not really, but it is something at least which will tie up the firebase the next shooting round, especially if you add in bonus tac squads doing the same thing.
Currently thinking of fielding 3 full sternguard like that, a 5 man tactical with flamers in a DP and 3 full tacs.(yes I know the price of combis has gone up.)

How about 3 or 4 hidden whirlwinds to just swamp the tau base with fire? Then gunline?

I mean the whirlwinds hammer the Tau troop choices.

This would force the Tau player into a more offensive role, leaving him open to attacks from devs.

That implies you have spare heavy slots. If you are fielding a landing force like me, you only vehicles are drop pods and flyers. I still dont think we are allowed squadrons of whirlwinds in the new codex, if wrong then maybe it is worth re-looking at.

 Bonde wrote:
I didn't know that an etheral gave up an extra VP. I can't remember if it ever was relevant in a game I played, but the Tau players I have played have never mentioned it.

They never mentioned it, perhaps, because it isn't true. Ethereals give up extra Kill Points, not Victory Points, so it only applies if you're playing Purge the Alien, or whatever the KP mission is called.

 Brother Sergeant Bob wrote:
Drop Pods with stern guard or some similar flamy unit, they have a better chance to survive then a dred

Agree all you need is Drop Pods and flamers

I just played against a full crisis suit army and took six grey hunter squads in Drop pods and was totally destroyed but then again maybe I didn't take enough. My current thoughts are the castle approach. Stay back and go the thunderfire cannon route, like the other guy said, with centaurian back- up. But don't necessarily equip the centaurians with the new grav weapons for obvious kroot reasons. Rhinos for cover or Drop pods (empty) as difficult terrain templates. Hope you have some good line of sight blocking terrain and like the other Tau player said: Whittle him down. The majority of Tau shooting is at 30 inches if he doesn't take those crazy missiles on his tanks.

 tomjoad wrote:

 Bonde wrote:
I didn't know that an etheral gave up an extra VP. I can't remember if it ever was relevant in a game I played, but the Tau players I have played have never mentioned it.

They never mentioned it, perhaps, because it isn't true. Ethereals give up extra Kill Points, not Victory Points, so it only applies if you're playing Purge the Alien, or whatever the KP mission is called.

This is absolutely wrong. They give up victory points, Last sentence, paragraph under 'Failure is not an option' page 35.