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The Battle Brothers restriction on transport use is on all Battle Brothers. It never specifies if it applies unit by unit or model by model.

But I don't think that is the question you meant to ask. The Battle Brothers rule applies to all units in the Primary and Allied Detachments of an army that qualifies for the Battle Brothers level of alliance.

The battle brothers rules where you find that restriction specifies units.

If it does not fit the definition within those rules, those rules do not apply.

Read the thread.

That's what I said, I just gave a more complete answer.

No, you did not.

Battle brothers is defined as "Friendly units", those are what battle brothers in the rules contained refer to.

Is the IC a "Friendly unit" while joined to a squad?

Jefffar wrote:
The Battle Brothers restriction on transport use is on all Battle Brothers. It never specifies if it applies unit by unit or model by model.

The actual rules that have been repeatedly quoted disagree. Read the thread please and argue citing actual rules instead of what you want to pretend they say.

OK, it is time to start begging.

Will a Mod, please, please, PLEASE lock this thread. Just like before it going nowhere. Both sides have made their arguments. Whether or not a person believes the rules allow it, I don't see anyone actually claiming they play it that way let alone it is the intent of the authors. It also appears that people need to step back take a breath and remember It is a game of plastic (or metal/resin) soldiers.

I play it and claim it as intent.

But then all my armies are story-based.

 Happyjew wrote:
OK, it is time to start begging.

Will a Mod, please, please, PLEASE lock this thread. Just like before it going nowhere. Both sides have made their arguments. Whether or not a person believes the rules allow it, I don't see anyone actually claiming they play it that way let alone it is the intent of the authors. It also appears that people need to step back take a breath and remember It is a game of plastic (or metal/resin) soldiers.

Now that's a sentiment I can get behind... lol...

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
No, you did not.

Battle brothers is defined as "Friendly units", those are what battle brothers in the rules contained refer to.

Is the IC a "Friendly unit" while joined to a squad?

Battle Brothers are also defined as a Level of Alliance.

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
No, you did not.

Battle brothers is defined as "Friendly units", those are what battle brothers in the rules contained refer to.

Is the IC a "Friendly unit" while joined to a squad?

Battle Brothers are also defined as a Level of Alliance.

And that definition has no relevant rules. The rule at question is tied to a "friendly unit".

I can't remember the exact wording on the rule for battle brothers and don't have my book with me at the moment, but doesn't it actually say that Battle brothers are treated as friendly units for the purposes of targeting and psychic powers? how does that part apply to them being "friendly units" for any other purpose?

FlyerMM wrote:
I can't remember the exact wording on the rule for battle brothers and don't have my book with me at the moment, but doesn't it actually say that Battle brothers are treated as friendly units for the purposes of targeting and psychic powers? how does that part apply to them being "friendly units" for any other purpose?

No, it doesn't say that.
It's been quoted before.

Until this is decided, don't put your ICs with battle brothers in a transport. You're only doing it because it helps you. So if you don't want to be TFG, don't do it until a FAQ miraculously says you can.

It is rarely all that beneficial.

II do it because it fits the narrative(Generally having Marines and guard allied).

If you're doing narrative based fluffy games then who cares really? By that I mean why not bend the rules, in multiple ways?

Otherwise, no. Don't do it. Wait for the snails at GW to get around to answering it in a FAQ.

rigeld2 wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
No, you did not.

Battle brothers is defined as "Friendly units", those are what battle brothers in the rules contained refer to.

Is the IC a "Friendly unit" while joined to a squad?

Battle Brothers are also defined as a Level of Alliance.

And that definition has no relevant rules. The rule at question is tied to a "friendly unit".

"Battle Brothers are treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view" (112) The attached IC is still a BB...

rigeld2 wrote:

Jefffar wrote:
The Battle Brothers restriction on transport use is on all Battle Brothers. It never specifies if it applies unit by unit or model by model.

The actual rules that have been repeatedly quoted disagree. Read the thread please and argue citing actual rules instead of what you want to pretend they say.

The actual post that you quoted had more in it. Please read my post and argue citing what I actually said instead of what you want to pretend I said.

 DeathReaper wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
No, you did not.

Battle brothers is defined as "Friendly units", those are what battle brothers in the rules contained refer to.

Is the IC a "Friendly unit" while joined to a squad?

Battle Brothers are also defined as a Level of Alliance.

And that definition has no relevant rules. The rule at question is tied to a "friendly unit".

"Battle Brothers are treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view" (112) The attached IC is still a BB...

SO you are saying that the Attached IC is still a separate unit?

SuperNewb: Because I play by the rules. You can do both, especially in 6th edition.

Jefffar wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

Jefffar wrote:
The Battle Brothers restriction on transport use is on all Battle Brothers. It never specifies if it applies unit by unit or model by model.

The actual rules that have been repeatedly quoted disagree. Read the thread please and argue citing actual rules instead of what you want to pretend they say.

The actual post that you quoted had more in it. Please read my post and argue citing what I actually said instead of what you want to pretend I said.

Jefffar wrote:
But I don't think that is the question you meant to ask. The Battle Brothers rule applies to all units in the Primary and Allied Detachments of an army that qualifies for the Battle Brothers level of alliance.

I ignored it because it was the question I meant to ask, and you answered it incorrectly.
To the rest of your post - pleas cite an actual rule saying that. You'd be the first.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 DeathReaper wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
No, you did not.

Battle brothers is defined as "Friendly units", those are what battle brothers in the rules contained refer to.

Is the IC a "Friendly unit" while joined to a squad?

Battle Brothers are also defined as a Level of Alliance.

And that definition has no relevant rules. The rule at question is tied to a "friendly unit".

"Battle Brothers are treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view" (112) The attached IC is still a BB...

Citation required. If he's still a friendly unit I can target him independent of the unit he joined.
That's what you're asserting.

"Battle Brothers are treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view" (112)

Interesting.. That would mean I cannot shoot at my opponent his Battle Brothers since they count as friendly units 'from all points of view'. :(

 Kommissar Kel wrote:


SuperNewb: Because I play by the rules. You can do both, especially in 6th edition.

But this is massively in dispute right now. So unless you want to be TFG, perhaps you shouldn't try to get your opponents to go along with this?

Super Newb wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:


SuperNewb: Because I play by the rules. You can do both, especially in 6th edition.

But this is massively in dispute right now. So unless you want to be TFG, perhaps you shouldn't try to get your opponents to go along with this?

How do you know that KK tries to get his opponents to go along? For all we know, his opponents tried against him first.

Well he did say 2 times that that's how he plays it. How can he NOT be getting his opponents to go along with it if that's how he plays it?

Over 85% of people don't agree that they have proven what they claim to be fact.

The condescension isn't helping.

Either you believe that battle brothers can't ride in allied transports, or you believe that the restriction is only for units completely compromised of battle brothers.

The vast majority of people voted that you can't. Pure and simple.

rigeld2 wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:


"Battle Brothers are treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view" (112) The attached IC is still a BB...

Citation required. If he's still a friendly unit I can target him independent of the unit he joined.
That's what you're asserting.

That seems to be what the allied rules are saying, but that does not matter.

Nothing lifts the battle brother status from the IC though, for the purposes of being a BB it is always a BB unit even when attached.

Therefore the restriction still applies.

 DeathReaper wrote:

rigeld2 wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:


"Battle Brothers are treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view" (112) The attached IC is still a BB...

Citation required. If he's still a friendly unit I can target him independent of the unit he joined.
That's what you're asserting.

That seems to be what the allied rules are saying, but that does not matter.

Nothing lifts the battle brother status from the IC though, for the purposes of being a BB it is always a BB unit even when attached.

Therefore the restriction still applies.

So you're ignoring the definition on page 112 in an attempt to prove your point.
Cool story bro - too bad you have to ignore rules to make it work.

The rules say that "Battle Brothers are treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view" (112)

Andf Nothing lifts the battle brother status from the IC, for the purposes of being a BB it is always a BB unit even when attached.

so sayeth the rules.

 DeathReaper wrote:
The rules say that "Battle Brothers are treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view" (112)

Andf Nothing lifts the battle brother status from the IC, for the purposes of being a BB it is always a BB unit even when attached.

so sayeth the rules.

And the three bullet points are examples of what it means to be a Battle brother as a friendly unit.

An attached IC is no longer a unit and thus no longer follows those examples.

So sayeth the rules.

And the IC is still a battle brother, as per the levels of alliance.

The attached IC is still an allied unit for the purposes of the Alliance rules, as per page 112

Because the IC is " treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view" (112)

 DeathReaper wrote:
And the IC is still a battle brother, as per the levels of alliance.

The attached IC is still an allied unit for the purposes of the Alliance rules, as per page 112

Because the IC is " treated as 'friendly units' from all points of view" (112)

He's no longer a unit and therefore cannot be a friendly unit.

I can see both sides of the argument here, and we always play as they can't. I am curious though as to why Battle Brothers are being referred to as rules and not Levels of Alliance? Would that not be a category that units fall into with special conditions instead of rules?

Forgive me if I'm wrong on any of what you said, rigeld, as I'm tired and a bit sick. Wouldn't losing the Battle Brother status create a catch 22? If the IC joins another unit he loses the BB status, without this status he can't join the unit. Once he can't join/isn't in the unit he gains the BB status and can join the unit again.

Just my thoughts, not saying it is or isn't this way for sure. I just feel that the Battle Brothers is more of a status that applies rules/restrictions and the status stays in effect whether or not the IC is in a unit.

Also, are we talking about an IC from the Allied Detachment joining the Primary, or an IC from the Primary joining the Allied? I believe I've seen someone argue that Allied joining Primary is allowed since it says "allied transportation", and that got into a grammar argument about the difference between allied transportation and Allied Detachment...