Breaking: Reports of shots fired on Capitol Hill

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**timetowaste85**

How does this bode for the shutdown that is affecting a lot of our jobs (including mine)? She's crazy enough to do this, I care how it affects the majority (us) and I'm glad the baby is unharmed.

**Manchu**

No idea who she is yet so that's impossible to say.

**d-usa**

Reporting before you know facts is hard...

**Jimsolo**

MSNBC is reporting she's dead.

**PrehistoricUFO**

So is CNN.

**Breotan**

Oh, now we are getting news that this woman apparently though the President was stalking her. Well, I guess Republicans in the House are to blame for that, too, somehow.

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/04/20816675-woman-in-dc-chase-may-have-thought-obama-was-stalking-her-sources-say?lite

Pete Williams and Erin McClam, NBC News wrote:Woman in DC chase may have thought Obama was stalking her, sources say

Investigators have found indications that the woman who led authorities on a chase from the White House to the Capitol before she was shot to death by police thought that President Barack Obama was stalking her, law enforcement sources told NBC News.

The sources said that Miriam Carey had a history of mental health problems.

The chase, on Thursday afternoon, stirred panic in the capital and briefly stopped the mechanisms of government. It happened two weeks after a man shot 12 people to death at the Washington Navy Yard.

Members of the House and Senate, in a standoff over the government shutdown, were ordered to stay in place. One lawmaker was cut off mid-sentence during a speech. A swarm of police startled tourists who were taking in Washington on a summery day.

Carey, 34, was a dental hygienist living in Stamford, Conn. Details of her background began to emerge in the hours after the episode.

Dr. Barry Weiss, a dentist, told NBC Connecticut that Carey was working for him in January 2012 when she suffered a fall and missed two to three weeks. He said that she appeared increasingly stressed after an unplanned pregnancy. He said that he fired her in August 2012 after patients complained that she was too rough.

Carey was driving a black Infiniti sedan when, just after 2 p.m. ET, she struck a security fence outside the White House. She took off after hitting a Secret Service officer with her car.

From there, police said, she sped up Pennsylvania Avenue toward the Capitol, reaching 80 mph at one point. Police and the Secret Service stopped her at the foot of the Capitol, but she jammed the car into reverse and took off again as police opened fire.

Carey led police on a chase around the perimeter of the Capitol and crashed her car outside a Senate office building a few minutes later, police said. The police shot at her, and she died a short time later.

A Capitol police officer was hurt as he was speeding to confront her and hit a barrier popped up in the street. The two injured officers were exempt from the government shutdown and required to work but were not being paid.

Carey had an 18-month-old child in the car with her, believed to be her daughter, authorities said. The girl was taken to a hospital and found to be unharmed. She was in the protection of social services Friday.

Katy Tur of NBC News contributed to this report.

**Seaward**

The usual suspects on the intertubes are going nuts over the fact that she was unarmed when she was shot.

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

Beginning to look like another reason America should have better (mental) healthcare

(and while in the UK ours is a bit better, it's still substandard)

**Alfndrate**

Seaward wrote:
The usual suspects on the intertubes are going nuts over the fact that she was unarmed when she was shot.

ABC news was talking about that, they mentioned that the car could be considered a weapon and that the officers would be clear to fire if they feared for their lives, but time will tell.

**djones520**

Alfndrate wrote:
Seaward wrote:
The usual suspects on the intertubes are going nuts over the fact that she was unarmed when she was shot.

ABC news was talking about that, they mentioned that the car could be considered a weapon and that the officers would be clear to fire if they feared for their lives, but time will tell.

Considering she injured a Secret Service agent, and a Capitol Police officer with that car, I'd say it's safe to say she was using it as a weapon.

**PredaKhaine**

NBC News wrote:
The police shot at her, and she died a short time later.

Thats a strange turn of phrase - its almost as if they want people to think the two things were unrelated.

**Alfndrate**

djones520 wrote:
Alfndrate wrote:
Seaward wrote:
The usual suspects on the intertubes are going nuts over the fact that she was unarmed when she was shot.

ABC news was talking about that, they mentioned that the car could be considered a weapon and that the officers would be clear to fire if they feared for their lives, but time will tell.

Considering she injured a Secret Service agent, and a Capitol Police officer with that car, I'd say it's safe to say she was using it as a weapon.

I agree, it's just how ABC was reporting it last night as the discharge of a weapon was their concern in how the officer would be treated as more things come to light.

**gunslingerpro**

Yeesh. Postpartum depression on top of unexpected pregnancy?

Damn shame.

**pities2004**

gunslingerpro wrote:
Yeesh. Postpartum depression on top of unexpected pregnancy?

Damn shame.

You forgot to mention the 12 bullet wounds.

**Yodhrin**

pities2004 wrote:
gunslingerpro wrote:
Yeesh. Postpartum depression on top of unexpected pregnancy?

Damn shame.

You forgot to mention the 12 bullet wounds.

That's immaterial; how else are (supposedly)trained officers of the law driving vehicles you'd assume are fitted out for pursuits supposed to stop an erratic and speeding driver except with a hail of bullets?

It'll be interesting to find out if they actually made an effort to resolve the situation peacefully, or if they just pulled the usual "they're comin' right at us!" routine and ventilated her car as a first resort. The child is certainly lucky to have survived.

**Grey Templar**

Maybe if it were a normal car chase, but around the WH they have to assume its potentially a terrorist with a car bomb.

**Jihadin**

You have to take in account the visual and public knowledge that there's a Shutdown in progress. Situation like Federal officers are perceived to be on furlough to that would leave the WH/Congress not fully protected so a "attack" has a better chance to succeed. The other piece would be a possible VBIED so I'm sure LEO's were a bit scared to say the least

**KalashnikovMarine**

Yep, my brain would be locked into "Oh feth me, VBIED!" mode not "Oh dear we just to apprehend this citizen and quickly!" mode.

**yeri**

I actually have a cousin who works in DC and says he saw the whole thing go down. he told me that he only heard about the first part from some buddies, but from what he heard the woman panicked when the secret service agent pulled a gun on her and so she tried to back up, the secret service agent was barely grazed by the side of the car. apparently she was running because from what he heard she thought they were trying to kill her and her child. whats even worse is that from what he says the kill shot was made after she had gotten out of the car and had her hands on her head. this was most definitely not a justifiable shooting, this was an execution. it honestly made me sick to think that these capitol hill cops decided to cowboy it up in the middle of the capitol of the USA. and honestly I'm disgusted that the news media acted simply as a mouthpiece for the capitol cops, what the hell happened to journalistic integrity? honestly I'm surprised and sickened that this is not eliciting the same response as the Rodney King beating. but like they say in one of my favorite video games:

CABAL wrote:control the media, control the mind.

**Kanluwen**

yeri wrote:
I actually have a cousin who works in DC and says he saw the whole thing go down. he told me that he only heard about the first part from some buddies, but from what he heard the woman panicked when the secret service agent pulled a gun on her and so she tried to back up, the secret service agent was barely grazed by the side of the car. apparently she was running because from what he heard she thought they were trying to kill her and her child. whats even worse is that from what he says the kill shot was made after she had gotten out of the car and had her hands on her head. this was most definitely not a justifiable shooting, this was an execution. it honestly made me sick to think that these capitol hill cops decided to cowboy it up in the middle of the capitol of the USA. and honestly I'm disgusted that the news media acted simply as a mouthpiece for the capitol cops, what the hell happened to journalistic integrity? honestly I'm surprised and sickened that this is not eliciting the same response as the Rodney King beating. but like they say in one of my favorite video games:

CABAL wrote:control the media, control the mind.

Do you want some tinfoil to protect you from the MLB satellite taking your brainwaves?

Yodhrin wrote:That's immaterial; how else are (supposedly)trained officers of the law driving vehicles you'd assume are fitted out for pursuits supposed to stop an erratic and speeding driver except with a hail of bullets?

Not to be rude or to show you up here, but there is not really such a thing as "vehicles fitted out for pursuits". Pursuits generally go until law enforcement officers(LEOs) have cause to believe that the continuation of the pursuit would represent a 'justifiable danger to the public at large' in which case they are supposed to stop pursuit or to try to put an end to it as quickly as possible with lethal measures if the situation warrants it.

In regards to how you would actually stop a vehicle being driven erratically? You've got spike strips(most police cars carry a set of these now, but it depends on where/how well funded the department is) and guns. Not many other ways to stop a vehicle that is able to be driven, given that reports in this instance have her 'ramming barricades' during the pursuit and then keeping right on going.

**Grey Templar**

And spike strips don't stop a car immediately. They only puncture the tires, the vehicle can still drive for quite a distance. All they really do is slow the vehicle down enough for police to do a PIT maneuver, which from what I know of it doesn't work well at lower speeds or cramped areas that make pulling it off difficult.

**Yodhrin**

Kanluwen wrote:
yeri wrote:
I actually have a cousin who works in DC and says he saw the whole thing go down. he told me that he only heard about the first part from some buddies, but from what he heard the woman panicked when the secret service agent pulled a gun on her and so she tried to back up, the secret service agent was barely grazed by the side of the car. apparently she was running because from what he heard she thought they were trying to kill her and her child. whats even worse is that from what he says the kill shot was made after she had gotten out of the car and had her hands on her head. this was most definitely not a justifiable shooting, this was an execution. it honestly made me sick to think that these capitol hill cops decided to cowboy it up in the middle of the capitol of the USA. and honestly I'm disgusted that the news media acted simply as a mouthpiece for the capitol cops, what the hell happened to journalistic integrity? honestly I'm surprised and sickened that this is not eliciting the same response as the Rodney King beating. but like they say in one of my favorite video games:

CABAL wrote:control the media, control the mind.

Do you want some tinfoil to protect you from the MLB satellite taking your brainwaves?

Yodhrin wrote:That's immaterial; how else are (supposedly)trained officers of the law driving vehicles you'd assume are fitted out for pursuits supposed to stop an erratic and speeding driver except with a hail of bullets?

Not to be rude or to show you up here, but there is not really such a thing as "vehicles fitted out for pursuits". Pursuits generally go until law enforcement officers(LEOs) have cause to believe that the continuation of the pursuit would represent a 'justifiable danger to the public at large' in which case they are supposed to stop pursuit or to try to put an end to it as quickly as possible with lethal measures if the situation warrants it.

In regards to how you would actually stop a vehicle being driven erratically? You've got spike strips(most police cars carry a set of these now, but it depends on where/how well funded the department is) and guns. Not many other ways to stop a vehicle that is able to be driven, given that reports in this instance have her 'ramming barricades' during the pursuit and then keeping right on going.

Hmm, must just be an oddity of the UK police then, but we have specialist vehicles with the Transport Police with superior speed and handling to standard police cars, as well as advanced training for some officers. Also in contrast, in almost every situation I can think of, the reaction of the British police to a chase being a genuine danger to the public would be to, well, stop chasing - they would back well off and follow the suspect vehicle with a helicopter until it came to a stop or moved away from populated areas.

Perhaps not being able to resort to firearms has bred a different attitude as to what is the appropriate response.

**Seaward**

Yodhrin wrote:
Hmm, must just be an oddity of the UK police then, but we have specialist vehicles with the Transport Police with superior speed and handling to standard police cars, as well as advanced training for some officers. Also in contrast, in almost every situation I can think of, the reaction of the British police to a chase being a genuine danger to the public would be to, well, stop chasing - they would back well off and follow the suspect vehicle with a helicopter until it came to a stop or moved away from populated areas.

Perhaps not being able to resort to firearms has bred a different attitude as to what is the appropriate response.

Yeah, we're mildly concerned about people trying to drive VBIEDs into national landmarks over here. I think our general policy when you ram the White House gate and go screaming off towards the Capitol isn't going to be to let you drive on.

**Andrew1975**

Standard police cars here in the US are pretty beefed up as far as pursuit abilities go. However this was a pretty strange situation.

**Yodhrin**

Seaward wrote:
Yodhrin wrote:
Hmm, must just be an oddity of the UK police then, but we have specialist vehicles with the Transport Police with superior speed and handling to standard police cars, as well as advanced training for some officers. Also in contrast, in almost every situation I can think of, the reaction of the British police to a chase being a genuine danger to the public would be to, well, stop chasing - they would back well off and follow the suspect vehicle with a helicopter until it came to a stop or moved away from populated areas.

Perhaps not being able to resort to firearms has bred a different attitude as to what is the appropriate response.

Yeah, we're mildly concerned about people trying to drive VBIEDs into national landmarks over here. I think our general policy when you ram the White House gate and go screaming off towards the Capitol isn't going to be to let you drive on.

See that's funny, in Scotland we can just leave that kind of thing to our airport baggage handlers and random passers-by while the polis get on with important stuff. But I suppose a massive car chase and a hail of bullets will do if your citizenry's first response to a potential terror attack isn't to yell "frakkin' mon then!" and kick them in the danglies

**d-usa**

Yodhrin wrote:
Seaward wrote:
Yodhrin wrote:
Hmm, must just be an oddity of the UK police then, but we have specialist vehicles with the Transport Police with superior speed and handling to standard police cars, as well as advanced training for some officers. Also in contrast, in almost every situation I can think of, the reaction of the British police to a chase being a genuine danger to the public would be to, well, stop chasing - they would back well off and follow the suspect vehicle with a helicopter until it came to a stop or moved away from populated areas.

Perhaps not being able to resort to firearms has bred a different attitude as to what is the appropriate response.

Yeah, we're mildly concerned about people trying to drive VBIEDs into national landmarks over here. I think our general policy when you ram the White House gate and go screaming off towards the Capitol isn't going to be to let you drive on.

See that's funny, in Scotland we can just leave that kind of thing to our airport baggage handlers and random passers-by while the polis get on with important stuff. But I suppose a massive car chase and a hail of bullets will do if your citizenry's first response to a potential terror attack isn't to yell "frakkin' mon then!" and kick them in the danglies

So if somebody is trying to drive a car into whatever building your government hangs out in your cops call the local airport, get some baggage handlers, all while a random citizen stops the car with a bag of haggis and kicks this lady in the balls?

No wonder the English think you are weird...

**Yodhrin**

d-usa wrote:
Yodhrin wrote:
Seaward wrote:
Yodhrin wrote:
Hmm, must just be an oddity of the UK police then, but we have specialist vehicles with the Transport Police with superior speed and handling to standard police cars, as well as advanced training for some officers. Also in contrast, in almost every situation I can think of, the reaction of the British police to a chase being a genuine danger to the public would be to, well, stop chasing - they would back well off and follow the suspect vehicle with a helicopter until it came to a stop or moved away from populated areas.

Perhaps not being able to resort to firearms has bred a different attitude as to what is the appropriate response.

Yeah, we're mildly concerned about people trying to drive VBIEDs into national landmarks over here. I think our general policy when you ram the White House gate and go screaming off towards the Capitol isn't going to be to let you drive on.

See that's funny, in Scotland we can just leave that kind of thing to our airport baggage handlers and random passers-by while the polis get on with important stuff. But I suppose a massive car chase and a hail of bullets will do if your citizenry's first response to a potential terror attack isn't to yell "frakkin' mon then!" and kick them in the danglies

So if somebody is trying to drive a car into whatever building your government hangs out in your cops call the local airport, get some baggage handlers, all while a random citizen stops the car with a bag of haggis and kicks this lady in the balls?

No wonder the English think you are weird...

It was a joke, look up John Smeaton.

**sebster**

yeri wrote:
I actually have a cousin who works in DC and says he saw the whole thing go down.

Yeah, we better reject every other source and the recordings they made of the event, and go with what your cousin says.

**Frazzled**

Hey you know what? Attack the Capital - get your ass shot. Move along, nothing to see here.

**MeanGreenStompa**

Frazzled wrote:
Hey you know what? Attack the Capital - get your ass shot. Move along, nothing to see here.

Concurred.