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The Imperial Guard is nowhere near as immoral/amoral as Chaos.

I would even argue that the Imperial Guard is actually a surprisingly ethical army, considering the setting.

Something people seems to be forgetting is the corruption nature of Chaos. It is actually very probable that the corruption started even before you became aware of Chaos.


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 Melissia wrote:
The Imperial Guard is nowhere near as immoral/amoral as Chaos.

I would even argue that the Imperial Guard is actually a surprisingly ethical army, considering the setting.

Considering that the usual IG response to something is throw more bodies to it...

 Wilytank wrote:

shinros wrote:
The thing is its never bad at first but then it turns bad. I mean this is 40k all the factions are evil in some form I mean if the imperium was just fine and dandy you would not have millions converting to chaos everyday. Well at first they may enjoy it but then they realize chaos is just as bad as the imperium but once someone realizes it they are already damned so they just keep going with chaos for the chance for power.

How about the lowly guardsman who's already in the army so he's going to stick with it anyway in hopes he doesn't die and live long enough to achieve veteran status? Sounds like the same thing to me.

Then I say good luck to him cause we all know what a guardmans life expectancy is. Considering that just like chaos the higher ups don't mind spending their lives like a bullet. Its really rare that a chaos god likes a human enough to bring up back to life or they have pseudo-daemonhood like that slaaneshi pskyer in the the ciphas cain novels.

All I am saying that most people who turn the chaos in my opinion do not start like hahahahaha i am evil! Normally they play on the chaos gods positive aspects for example a guardmans killing his enemies with extreme hatred nothing is wrong with that by the imperium standards hate the witch, mutant bla bla. Problem is this person will attract khorne's attention. Or someone who is suffering from an illness nurgle may help them out but we all know what happens at the end of this.

But then it gets worse since their will starts to become overrieded by that of their god and thats when the craziness starts. Personally I don't like it when people say one faction is ONLY evil or is only good. Since the lore is not written like that IMO. No one falls to chaos just to be evil.

shinros wrote:

 Wilytank wrote:

shinros wrote:
The thing is its never bad at first but then it turns bad. I mean this is 40k all the factions are evil in some form I mean if the imperium was just fine and dandy you would not have millions converting to chaos everyday. Well at first they may enjoy it but then they realize chaos is just as bad as the imperium but once someone realizes it they are already damned so they just keep going with chaos for the chance for power.

How about the lowly guardsman who's already in the army so he's going to stick with it anyway in hopes he doesn't die and live long enough to achieve veteran status? Sounds like the same thing to me.

Then I say good luck to him cause we all know what a guardmans life expectancy is. Considering that just like chaos the higher ups don't mind spending their lives like a bullet. Its really rare that a chaos god likes a human enough to bring up back to life or they have pseudo-daemonhood like that slaaneshi pskyer in the the ciphas cain novels.

All I am saying that most people who turn the chaos in my opinion do not start like hahahahaha i am evil! Normally they play on the chaos gods positive aspects for example a guardmans killing his enemies with extreme hatred nothing is wrong with that by the imperium standards hate the witch, mutant bla bla. Problem is this person will attract khorne's attention. Or someone who is suffering from an illness nurgle may help them out but we all know what happens at the end of this.

The life expectancy of the guardsman and the life expectancy of a cultist are probably just about the same. The latter is just counting days before the Inquisition/Space Marines/Sororitas come busting down their door, lining them up along a wall with their friends and executed.

Each Chaos Space Marine has their own personal reason for falling to the allure of the Chaos Gods and that is what drew me to collecting them.

Chaos are the worst, most malignant being in the whole universe. Biggest reason is because they tear up the Imperium of man from within the inside.

SYKOJAK wrote:
Chaos are the worst, most malignant being in the whole universe. Biggest reason is because they tear up the Imperium of man from within the inside.

Of course that is assuming that the IoM is "good".

SYKOJAK wrote:
Chaos are the worst, most malignant being in the whole universe. Biggest reason is because they tear up the Imperium of man from within the inside.

The Imperium of man is hardly good, countless human souls are sacrificed for the corpse-god.

Whereas, with Chaos, countless human souls are sacrificed for the Ruinous Powers of the Warp.

Six of one, half-dozen of the other.

Actually I'd say the Imperium is still a little more moral there anyway. Only those psykers too weak-minded and thus too dangerous to be trusted to handle psychic powers are fed to the beacon; and only do it because it is necessary both for the safety of the Imperium and to power the Astronomican.

With Chaos, they particularly delight in sacrificing innocents, children, and love forcing cruel sacrifices on others, and often make the sacrifices for their own sakes. Even when it's "necessary", it's almost always only for the sake of their own personal power, and screw everyone else.

Chaos is the destroyer of humanity within human culture. There's a reason that people would rather live in an organised tyrany than a horrific chaotic mess - just look at Syria right now. Assad may have been a bastard, but his rule was far better than a devestating civil war which is destroying the country and killing huge numbers of people.

Chaos is simply the embodiment of that breakdown of society. Individual events may not be "evil" per se, it's simply the nature of how those elements are organised - chaotically.


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 MetalOxide wrote:

SYKOJAK wrote:
Chaos are the worst, most malignant being in the whole universe. Biggest reason is because they tear up the Imperium of man from within the inside.

The Imperium of man is hardly good, countless human souls are sacrificed for the corpse-god.

Tens of thousands of people right here on earth die every year in industry. Mining in particular has killing millions of men since the industrial revulution, just so that people can have electricity and the mine-owners can make money. Still today tens of thousands of people die in instustry purely so that they can make goods for people to consume.

Given that, do you really think the Imperium is evil for killing a tiny, tiny amount of people within the imperium, in order to stop all of humanity from being destroyed? That's not evil dude.

xruslanx wrote:
Chaos is the destroyer of humanity within human culture. There's a reason that people would rather live in an organised tyrany than a horrific chaotic mess - just look at Syria right now. Assad may have been a bastard, but his rule was far better than a devestating civil war which is destroying the country and killing huge numbers of people.

Chaos is simply the embodiment of that breakdown of society. Individual events may not be "evil" per se, it's simply the nature of how those elements are organised - chaotically.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 MetalOxide wrote:

SYKOJAK wrote:
Chaos are the worst, most malignant being in the whole universe. Biggest reason is because they tear up the Imperium of man from within the inside.

The Imperium of man is hardly good, countless human souls are sacrificed for the corpse-god.

Tens of thousands of people right here on earth die every year in industry. Mining in particular has killing millions of men since the industrial revulution, just so that people can have electricity and the mine-owners can make money. Still today tens of thousands of people die in instustry purely so that they can make goods for people to consume.

Given that, do you really think the Imperium is evil for killing a tiny, tiny amount of people within the imperium, in order to stop all of humanity from being destroyed? That's not evil dude.

I have to fundamentally disagree with the bold part if this was the case people falling to chaos would not be an issue. Considering how hard the imperium works to route out heresy shows that the the imperium is not fine and dandy. As I said most people who fall to chaos do not do it just to be evil or just to be an evil cackling villain. Reading loads of the black libary novels were the imperium is the protagonist I constantly see reasons why one may fall to chaos.

Now onto the 1000 psyker thing personally I feel if the imperium got over their stagnate view of technology the would not have to sacrifice psykers in the first place. Since the imperium is the sheer opposite of change this will never happen.

Plus as I said if people were fine living under the imperium corruption and people falling to chaos would not be a huge issue. The imperiums very laws that helps prevent corruption causes people to fall in the first place which is the sad fact. The whole point of 40k is that no one is "good" reading the uplifting primer is funny and horrific at the same time and reading the sisters of battle codex I would not want to live near these women. Also I just shake my head at the repentia squad personally I feel sorry for em.

Plus what do you think the imperium does to planets who do not wish to join them and worship the emperor? There is no good here only war, slaughter, people sacrificing others to their gods and oppression. Hence why this is my favorite quote.

"There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods."

As happy jew said there is no "good", good died in warhammer 40k heck if the imperium is fine and "good" we would not have human planets joining the tau and refusing to return to the imperium.

Plus the chaos gods don't have to do anything because the imperium and their followers is doing their job for them. While reading sisters of battle fluff and playing them in soulstorm khorne must be grinning constantly watching these girls go. When you beat the tau the cannoness is offerring up the ethereal skull to the emperor. I simply sighed since that skull is not going to the emperor lol I don't even think he can accept skulls.

This thread smells of heresy... *BLAM!*

 Insane Smile wrote:
This thread smells of hersey... *BLAM!*

shinros wrote:

xruslanx wrote:
Chaos is the destroyer of humanity within human culture. There's a reason that people would rather live in an organised tyrany than a horrific chaotic mess - just look at Syria right now. Assad may have been a bastard, but his rule was far better than a devestating civil war which is destroying the country and killing huge numbers of people.

Chaos is simply the embodiment of that breakdown of society. Individual events may not be "evil" per se, it's simply the nature of how those elements are organised - chaotically.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 MetalOxide wrote:

SYKOJAK wrote:
Chaos are the worst, most malignant being in the whole universe. Biggest reason is because they tear up the Imperium of man from within the inside.

The Imperium of man is hardly good, countless human souls are sacrificed for the corpse-god.

Tens of thousands of people right here on earth die every year in industry. Mining in particular has killing millions of men since the industrial revulution, just so that people can have electricity and the mine-owners can make money. Still today tens of thousands of people die in instustry purely so that they can make goods for people to consume.

Given that, do you really think the Imperium is evil for killing a tiny, tiny amount of people within the imperium, in order to stop all of humanity from being destroyed? That's not evil dude.

I have to fundamentally disagree with the bold part if this was the case people falling to chaos would not be an issue. Considering how hard the imperium works to route out heresy shows that the the imperium is not fine and dandy. As I said most people who fall to chaos do not do it just to be evil or just to be an evil cackling villain. Reading loads of the black libary novels were the imperium is the protagonist I constantly see reasons why one may fall to chaos.

Now onto the 1000 psyker thing personally I feel if the imperium got over their stagnate view of technology the would not have to sacrifice psykers in the first place. Since the imperium is the sheer opposite of change this will never happen.

Plus as I said if people were fine living under the imperium corruption and people falling to chaos would not be a huge issue. The imperiums very laws that helps prevent corruption causes people to fall in the first place which is the sad fact. The whole point of 40k is that no one is "good" reading the uplifting primer is funny and horrific at the same time and reading the sisters of battle codex I would not want to live near these women. Also I just shake my head at the repentia squad personally I feel sorry for em.

Plus what do you think the imperium does to planets who do not wish to join them and worship the emperor? There is no good here only war, slaughter, people sacrificing others to their gods and oppression. Hence why this is my favorite quote.

"There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods."

As happy jew said there is no "good", good died in warhammer 40k heck if the imperium is fine and "good" we would not have human planets joining the tau and refusing to return to the imperium.

Plus the chaos gods don't have to do anything because the imperium and their followers is doing their job for them. While reading sisters of battle fluff and playing them in soulstorm khorne must be grinning constantly watching these girls go. When you beat the tau the cannoness is offerring up the ethereal skull to the emperor. I simply sighed since that skull is not going to the emperor lol I don't even think he can accept skulls.

I didn't say that the imperium was "fine and dandy". Surely it should be obvious that the Imperium is less chaotic than chaos?

 Tyran wrote:

 Insane Smile wrote:
This thread smells of hersey... *BLAM!*

This is what happens when I try to make a joke, I'll leave with my head low now.

...you can buy a 2 kilo bar of chocolate in America? D:

Personally I see each faction in wh 40 k as neutral, they are good for them selves and bad for others. Each faction is made up of millions of individuals which varies entirely so it is hard to say that a given faction is bad or good.

All of the 40k factions have different levels of Evilness, Chaos is one of the most evil.

Chaos are evil to some extent, but it seems that they usually tend to really threaten and roar about not really doing anything.

What I mean is that they are too cocky. Look at the Black Crusades for example. Took Chaos 13 goes to finally establish a foothold on Imperial territory, despite their mighty Gods, their so-called "sick" powers etc.

In combat, Chaos are more like tactical retards, almost like Orks. They just charge at you, maybe incorporate some cunning, but most of the time, come at you with brute force and fail, depending which race they go up against them.

The likes of Tyranids or even the Necrons are much more menacing than Chaos. They the job done. Chaos has all them daemons but you know it's bad when mortal humans can pwn them.

xruslanx wrote:
...you can buy a 2 kilo bar of chocolate in America? D:

Of course you can. How did you think we became such huge fatasses? By God, American Ingenuity had to get involved! We *had* to develop ways to shovel calories into our sedentary bodies faster and more efficiently!

 Whiskered wrote:
Personally I see each faction in wh 40 k as neutral, they are good for them selves and bad for others. Each faction is made up of millions of individuals which varies entirely so it is hard to say that a given faction is bad or good.

This is like saying that there were positives to Hitler's regime. Sure he helped the German economy, but the bad far outweighs the negative. And even the Tau make Hitler look like a saint in comparison.

What about the Alpha Legion? They're chaos but work to liberate the galaxy by destroying chaos with chaos. Does that not make them "good" chaos?

Brother Payne wrote:
What about the Alpha Legion? They're chaos but work to liberate the galaxy by destroying chaos with chaos. Does that not make them "good" chaos?

Does being a nazi to the nazis while being a nazi yourself cancel out your naziness?

 Kain wrote:

Brother Payne wrote:
What about the Alpha Legion? They're chaos but work to liberate the galaxy by destroying chaos with chaos. Does that not make them "good" chaos?

Does being a nazi to the nazis while being a nazi yourself cancel out your naziness?

Only if you are from the dark side of the moon and fly zeppelins in space.

 Happyjew wrote:

 Kain wrote:

Brother Payne wrote:
What about the Alpha Legion? They're chaos but work to liberate the galaxy by destroying chaos with chaos. Does that not make them "good" chaos?

Does being a nazi to the nazis while being a nazi yourself cancel out your naziness?

I guess it's a bit like Hitler killed Hitler so he's a good guy.
Or on a less extreme note committing an evil to prevent a greater evil


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oops - I guess it's a bit like Hitler killed Hitler so he's a good guy.
Or on a less extreme note committing an evil to prevent a greater evil

Brother Payne, you seem to have accredited me with your post.

 Happyjew wrote:
Brother Payne, you seem to have accredited me with your post.

Ah. My bad I'm pretty new to this

Just click the quote button on whoever's post you want to quote, and start writing after any other text in the window.

You only gotta get creative if you're going to respond to multiple people in the same quote-block. Then you gotta know how to craft your own quote tags.

Cheers Psienesis