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At four bucks a pot, GW paint costs a bit, but a quick and easy way to do these effects is quite welcome

--Chris
www.chrisvalera.com

 Azazelx wrote:
links and gak

Thanks for the links Az, book marked that post for future use.

 Bull0 wrote:
I really dislike the current fashion for all metal to either be caked in incredibly bright orange rust or green verdigris stuff. Doubtless I'll wind up getting these anyway.

They both have their place. Having said as much. That place is not "everywhere". Still, learning to use both effectively is a useful thing for painters.

 Bull0 wrote:

Ap0k wrote:

I really dislike the current fashion for all metal to either be caked in incredibly bright orange rust or green verdigris stuff. Doubtless I'll wind up getting these anyway.

I'll take that over tacky NMM any day!

Oh, yeah, that gets overused to hell too.

I agree on all counts.

A lot of that is just a below average, to mediocre painter's way of achieving a "cool" effect without actually trying to learn a technique. So they slop on Tamiya Clear, pigment powders, or wash-heavy rust colors.

I will likely try these out, since I get all GW paints for free anyway.

Hey, some of us don't have too much time to paint and like stuff like that for the quick, acceptable result it gives. What's wrong with that?
Sure, pigment powder inferno is not some place I like to go either but really, could you be more condescending if you tried?

 Bolognesus wrote:
Hey, some of us don't have too much time to paint and like stuff like that for the quick, acceptable result it gives. What's wrong with that?
Sure, pigment powder inferno is not some place I like to go either but really, could you be more condescending if you tried?

Agreed. How dare people do something they enjoy if they can't also be the best at it? And how dare they use techniques that have been part of the greater model-making community's repertoire for many years in order to get a good looking effect?

Don't let your head disappear up your own backside.

 MajorStoffer wrote:

 Grimtuff wrote:

 MajorStoffer wrote:
GW generally has pretty solid paints, and pigments and the like aren't easy to get a hold of normally, so I'd welcome this.

You can't get Tamiya clear colours (which is what I'm assuming they're the GW equivalent of) in Canada?

Weird.

"Hobbies" in Canada includes hockey, followed by soccer, followed by football, followed by airsoft, followed by everything else.

I think there's one store in all of my city, with some 3 million residents, which might carry tamiya clear.

there just isn't a market for niche products like this; population is too spread out to make physical stores practical in most cases, one or two per large city and that's it, and they do the usual MTG/Warmahordes/GW/Collectibles deal to stay successful, tamiya, which is often associated with traditional modelling/painting rarely appears on their shelves.

I could order something, but paying $5 in shipping or what have you on product not worth much more than that isn't really practical.

You might consider looking at hobby stores as opposed to game stores. You know, the ones with the old guys who sell model trains, planes and automobiles? Weathering, painting and effects on those types of models are still about a decade ahead of where most miniature painters and paint companies are. They are getting better, but you still have a larger selection of better products at a lower price through model suppliers than through game suppliers.

Exactly. Well put, Sean. Woodland Scenics water products and the like are easily found in model and train stores - and in quantities that make game store products look like a joke. (and it's often the same products, repackaged).

I'd also add to that - Art and Craft supply stores are generally the best places to source things like acrylic mediums, acrylic paste, etc that then gets repackaged into smaller versions by Vallejo - and tiny versions by GW.

Hobby tools like Xuron cutters (repackaged by Army Painter) are much cheaper from places that stock beads and such. - My Xuron cutters from eBay have "Xuron" on the blades and "Beadsmith" on the handles. They also cost half of what the Army Painter Xuron cutters go for.

looks awesome. the copper rust will be great for scenery painters methinks.

 brassangel wrote:


I will likely try these out, since I get all GW paints for free anyway.

How?

 brassangel wrote:

A lot of that is just a below average, to mediocre painter's way of achieving a "cool" effect without actually trying to learn a technique. So they slop on Tamiya Clear, pigment powders, or wash-heavy rust colors.

No, it's actually about old farts being butthurt that some people are inventing new tools and techniques that look equally good but take less effort.

 Panic wrote:
yeah,
These look very cool and interesting.

I'm gonna buy them all!

Panic...

You do know that you can write Panic...In your signature?Instead of me starting to post a reply to ask why we should panic and then noticing your name?Without you having to type it out every time you post?But anyway on topic:Blood for the blood god is the best paint name ever.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 brassangel wrote:

A lot of that is just a below average, to mediocre painter's way of achieving a "cool" effect without actually trying to learn a technique. So they slop on Tamiya Clear, pigment powders, or wash-heavy rust colors.

No, it's actually about old farts being butthurt that some people are inventing new tools and techniques that look equally good but take less effort.

I'm sensing a divide developing between those who aren't keen on the over use of special effects as a substitute for a good paint job (no, everyone doesn't have to be an expert, but a little restraint here and there would improve things remarkably sometimes) and those that feel they are guilty of said practice!

It's all about the delivery of the message. AKA there's simply no need to be elitist or a dick about it. In my opinion, all tools and techniques are valid and have their uses. There's also absolutely no need to be rude when others get a good result for "less work".
Deciding that using X or Y is "too easy" just shows that person as closed-minded, and generally, as a fool. I'd rather be a mediocre painter than a mediocre human in possession of mediocre social skills. I consider myself neither.

 Azazelx wrote:
It's all about the delivery of the message. AKA there's simply no need to be elitist or a dick about it. In my opinion, all tools and techniques are valid and have their uses. There's also absolutely no need to be rude when others get a good result for "less work".
Deciding that using X or Y is "too easy" just shows that person as closed-minded, and generally, as a fool. I'd rather be a mediocre painter than a mediocre human in possession of mediocre social skills. I consider myself neither.

See, I didn't get that message at all, I saw a few people (myself included) comment on some trends and techniques they didn't particularly like on a model, and a number of people apparently taking offence at that. Nowhere have I seen anyone say "if you use these you are a bad painter, and a lazy person, and should feel ashamed" but the reactions seem to be as though they did.

Frankly, I'm all for labour saving, if what I want to achieve looks to need a disproportionate of time, I'll often look for a cheat or revise my plan altogether!

I'm not talking about your post...

 Azazelx wrote:
I'm not talking about your post...

I honestly didn't think you were, but I still can't really see what has been said to illicit the responses I've seen.

Ah, well, not really important!

I don't really care how an effect was achieved as long as it looks good.

Dipping is cheating. Washing is cheating. Airbrushing is cheating. Anyone who's ever taken a peek at the Painting subsection has seen these threads coming up since at least the mid 2000s. I guess we can add weathering powders to the list now that they've become widely available. They were just fine as long as only "experts" had access to them.

 sing your life wrote:
I don't really care how an effect was achieved as long as it looks good.

Me too, and if I can do it quicker then all the better, sometimes I don't have time to try and replicate the Sistine Chapel ceiling on a LR interior every weekend unfortunately.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Dipping is cheating. Washing is cheating. Airbrushing is cheating. Anyone who's ever taken a peek at the Painting subsection has seen these threads coming up since at least the mid 2000s. I guess we can add weathering powders to the list now that they've become widely available. They were just fine as long as only "experts" had access to them.

Perhaps you can explain to me where this accusation of cheating is coming from? (Not a loaded question, honest request)

All I've seen is people expressing a dislike for the over use of a technique or applying excessive amounts of some sort of technical aid in order to try and mask a poor job (and, IMO, frequently make it look worse by doing so)

This is great! I know they're not "new" concepts, but just think, each paint may inspire/spawn an entire army.

 Azazelx wrote:
Woodland Scenics water products and the like are easily found in model and train stores - and in quantities that make game store products look like a joke.

Too bad noone plays model train anymore so that only a few mail order stores per continent survive.

I don't think people "play" with model trains in the first place. But still, why would you buy extremely overpriced GW products when they are in fact just rebranded and repacked products of other companies?

 brassangel wrote:

 Bull0 wrote:

Ap0k wrote:

I really dislike the current fashion for all metal to either be caked in incredibly bright orange rust or green verdigris stuff. Doubtless I'll wind up getting these anyway.

I'll take that over tacky NMM any day!

Oh, yeah, that gets overused to hell too.

I agree on all counts.

A lot of that is just a below average, to mediocre painter's way of achieving a "cool" effect without actually trying to learn a technique. So they slop on Tamiya Clear, pigment powders, or wash-heavy rust colors.

I believe this is the post which is causing the contention. Emphasis mine on the part which can be seen to be inferred as saying those who use "Tamiya Clear, pigment powders or wash-heavy rust colours" are below average to mediocre painters trying to achieve an effect without "learning a technique", which I have to assume is the longhand way of doing it.

 Kroothawk wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
Woodland Scenics water products and the like are easily found in model and train stores - and in quantities that make game store products look like a joke.

Too bad noone plays model train anymore so that only a few mail order stores per continent survive.

There's two places that sell model train to the people who "play" them in the central business district of Melbourne, and one a few Ks away in the opposite direction from where I live. So I guess those three all near me must be it for the entirety of Australia?

 Kroothawk wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:
Woodland Scenics water products and the like are easily found in model and train stores - and in quantities that make game store products look like a joke.

Too bad noone plays model train anymore so that only a few mail order stores per continent survive.

What's making me chortle at your comment is that you're writing from, I believe, Germany, the Mecca of model railroading. There's a German store for everything one could ever wish for in 1:87 scale.

RoninXiC wrote:
I don't think people "play" with model trains in the first place. But still, why would you buy extremely overpriced GW products when they are in fact just rebranded and repacked products of other companies?

well there's not many supplies that you can pick up in town on the way to work. I don't mind paying a premium for paints if it means i can pop into a shop, talk to a staffer about what colours i want to use, see what the paints look like on actual models etc.

That only applies to paint though. All their other supplies are far to expensive and usually crappy.

 LadyCassandra wrote:

 brassangel wrote:

 Bull0 wrote:

Ap0k wrote:

I really dislike the current fashion for all metal to either be caked in incredibly bright orange rust or green verdigris stuff. Doubtless I'll wind up getting these anyway.

I'll take that over tacky NMM any day!

Oh, yeah, that gets overused to hell too.

I agree on all counts.

A lot of that is just a below average, to mediocre painter's way of achieving a "cool" effect without actually trying to learn a technique. So they slop on Tamiya Clear, pigment powders, or wash-heavy rust colors.

I believe this is the post which is causing the contention. Emphasis mine on the part which can be seen to be inferred as saying those who use "Tamiya Clear, pigment powders or wash-heavy rust colours" are below average to mediocre painters trying to achieve an effect without "learning a technique", which I have to assume is the longhand way of doing it.

I completely disagree there is no such thing as cheating in painting,you might like the long way to go about a particular effect,but if someone can do similar by thinking outside the box,it is just that a different technique.
Back in the day no one used acrylics only enamels,are you cheating by using acrylic?
No your not.
The main thing is if you are enjoying yourself,then do what works for you.

Oh, for sure. I also think it's worth bearing in mind not every model is a competition entry, and anything that lets you achieve an eye-catching effect fast on large groups of models is a Good Thing.