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dadakkaest wrote:

 Green is Best! wrote:
Yeah, I finally ran into an Eldar power list this weekend. 3 Wave serpents, two riptides, a bunch of crisis suits with a farseer on a jetbike attached.

It was at a local event and against a guy I am friends with. I called it halfway through turn 1, it was that bad. To top it off, it was a kill points mission. It was so miserable of an experience that I don't even know if I want to go to any more tournaments because I know my local meta is going to run similar lists.

Yeah this is literally all I run into, People abusing fortune with farseers on jetbikes. Dark Eldar Beast Packs or whatever they are with rerollable invulnerable saves. Riptides for days with assault moves that put them out of LOS. I think most of my entire 2000 points of Orks killed 3 of the warp beasts and didn't even scratch one Riptide. 40k just seems like a waste of time for anyone but powergamers now.

Warmachine anyone?

The rerollable invuls both go down to Condemnors. The Riptides get eaten by Dominions and Exorcists. So what's the problem?

And why haven't I put this guy on ignore yet?

I like your enthusiasm, but riptides don't really get "eaten" by anything. They are huge fire sinks, and you are nearly always going to have to put an inordinate amount of firepower into them if you want to kill them outright.

Best thing to do is kill all your opponents marker lights/buffmander/farseer. Marker lights are doable, but removing the buffmander while he's attached to the riptide is no easy proposition. Farseer is going to be hard to nix too as they're generally mounted on the fastest jet bikes in the game and can hop from unit to unit to hide from you.

With sisters, I would avoid shooting at lone riptides entirely. If you're opponent happens to be play with the attached commander however, I would kill that unit at all costs. If your opponent is using the O'Vesa star, table flip is probably your only option.

But back to Sisters:

I love the idea of running retributors with 4 rending Heavy Flamers. I mean that is just a sick amount of damage. Anyone else think that unit is viable or is it a waste of a very valuable HS slot?

On paper they sound like a great idea but I don't see them as being that great of a threat. An easily destroyed transport can leave them out of range for the entire game.

I'm looking forward to replacing my HB ret squad with the FW flyer to replace their role as anti-air and anti-infantry.

Same here; I'm trying out the Strike Fighter in an upcoming game. Hopefully it'll solve my chronic crisis suit problem.

An Avenger seems more and more to be a solid investment. Might have to look into modifying up one of those DA flyers. It have a big chain gun, that's close enough right?

dadakkaest wrote:

 Green is Best! wrote:
Yeah, I finally ran into an Eldar power list this weekend. 3 Wave serpents, two riptides, a bunch of crisis suits with a farseer on a jetbike attached.

It was at a local event and against a guy I am friends with. I called it halfway through turn 1, it was that bad. To top it off, it was a kill points mission. It was so miserable of an experience that I don't even know if I want to go to any more tournaments because I know my local meta is going to run similar lists.

Yeah this is literally all I run into, People abusing fortune with farseers on jetbikes. Dark Eldar Beast Packs or whatever they are with rerollable invulnerable saves. Riptides for days with assault moves that put them out of LOS. I think most of my entire 2000 points of Orks killed 3 of the warp beasts and didn't even scratch one Riptide. 40k just seems like a waste of time for anyone but powergamers now.

Warmachine anyone?

find better people to play against My friends rarly play crazy power lists, most don't even look on the internet to see if something is better then something else, they build liss on themes and what seams like fun.

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
@Quo you must of been lucky with that wave serpent, it has a 5/6 chance of down grading every pen to a glance. Then he could of premeasured to be 36'' away from your deployment zone (Dominions can start 12 off board, scout, 6, move 6, get out 6, 6 inch melta range) and be relatively safe, did he know you where using dominions and just forget to premeasure? He probably should of started with Warwalkers on the table, they would of eaten a squad a turn with only the exorcist as a threat. He would want you to shoot missiles at them, because you can only kill one and it means those shots aren't going into more expensive Avatar.

Any way good game, it seems you had little chance due to him tailoring to beat your army. Against any other army, a single wave serpent would be bad and star cannons would be lacklustre. Against any other army the Avatar would be very fragile, but against and army that practically only uses melta to handle big foes? He's monstrous. Maybe try switch up the list (even with no models its possible with allies and the like) to turn his tailoring on himself

I got pretty lucky. Like I said it was a great turn one. I got one glance on him, the second hit penetrated, and he rolled a 1 on his bs shield. I had two more hits to roll, I think. Scouts deployed in a transport count as a tank, not infantry, so they get a 12 inch scout move, plus the wave serpent is 8 inches long or so. He had most of his army in one corner behind a large LOS blocking gate. The way I was deployed I'm not sure there was anywhere he could have deployed the wave serpent where I wouldn't have been in range with at least one dominion squad.

I find war walkers showing up late game to be devastating. They can pop in at optimal range, and by that time, everything I have that can kill them is already committed. They just mop up uncontested. Had they been on the table on turn 1, I probably would have gone for them over the wave serpent. Also they were deployed in a squadron of 3, I could have killed all of them at once. I'm not sure why he didn't do one squad of 2 and one squad of 1.

 pretre wrote:


And why haven't I put this guy on ignore yet?

Yeah why haven't you? Here I'll show you how it's done. Buh bye.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Brother Weasel wrote:

find better people to play against My friends rarly play crazy power lists, most don't even look on the internet to see if something is better then something else, they build liss on themes and what seams like fun.

Yeah that's how I play normally. Gotta enjoy the fluff or it's more like work than leisure. If the game is down to who can spend the most buying whatever army's rules are being abused right this second before the FAQ comes out, then where's the fun?

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:
An Avenger seems more and more to be a solid investment. Might have to look into modifying up one of those DA flyers. It have a big chain gun, that's close enough right?

This is my plan as well.

dadakkaest wrote:

 pretre wrote:


And why haven't I put this guy on ignore yet?

Yeah why haven't you? Here I'll show you how it's done. Buh bye.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Brother Weasel wrote:

find better people to play against My friends rarly play crazy power lists, most don't even look on the internet to see if something is better then something else, they build liss on themes and what seams like fun.

Yeah that's how I play normally. Gotta enjoy the fluff or it's more like work than leisure. If the game is down to who can spend the most buying whatever army's rules are being abused right this second before the FAQ comes out, then where's the fun?

Most sisters players arn't just jumping on the new boat Most of my players have several armies, and i don't think any of us have started a new army since the tau came out, minus me who has been slowly collecting sisters and havn't put them on the table yet.

Brother Weasel wrote:

Most sisters players arn't just jumping on the new boat Most of my players have several armies, and i don't think any of us have started a new army since the tau came out, minus me who has been slowly collecting sisters and havn't put them on the table yet.

Yeah I've got tons of sisters, just not enough immolator transports for the new codex and am kind of loath to spend another $300 on 40k, knowing for near certainty that the condemnor nerf is coming to return it to it's Grey Knights codex level of uselessness against competitive armies, while nothing whatsoever is coming to slow down the tau-dar/Screamerstar/Riptide spam rape trains for some time.

dadakkaest wrote:

Brother Weasel wrote:

Most sisters players arn't just jumping on the new boat Most of my players have several armies, and i don't think any of us have started a new army since the tau came out, minus me who has been slowly collecting sisters and havn't put them on the table yet.

Yeah I've got tons of sisters, just not enough immolator transports for the new codex and am kind of loath to spend another $300 on 40k, knowing for near certainty that the condemnor nerf is coming to return it to it's Grey Knights codex level of uselessness against competitive armies, while nothing whatsoever is coming to slow down the tau-dar/Screamerstar/Riptide spam rape trains for some time.

No one says you have to play against em.

Good point.

Rules question:

What does the Banner of Sancitity do for Uriah?

I am not a big fan of the eBook, and hope that GW will come out with a hard-book Codex.

Thanks in advance.
J

I'm trying to work out a 1750 foot mob list and here's where I'm at so far:


That comes to 1701, so I've got 49 points to spend and not sure what on. Any ideas?
Also, has anyone played with Condemnors yet? Should a TAC list just take condemnors for all the basic squads combi weapons? I have a certain affection for my combi-flamers and I'm hesitant to make the switch.

joshuafalcon wrote:
Rules question:

What does the Banner of Sancitity do for Uriah?

I am not a big fan of the eBook, and hope that GW will come out with a hard-book Codex.

Thanks in advance.
J

Fearless and Counterattack within 12"


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Amerikon wrote:
I'm trying to work out a 1750 foot mob list and here's where I'm at so far:

Spoiler:

HQ
St Celestine
5x Ministorum Priest

TROOPS
BSS, 5 Women, Heavy Flamer, Flamer, SS w/ Combi-Flamer
BSS, 5 Women, Heavy Flamer, Flamer, SS w/ Combi-Flamer
BSS, 5 Women, Heavy Flamer, Flamer, SS w/ Combi-Flamer
BSS, 20 Women, Multi-Melta, Meltagun, Simulacrum
BSS, 20 Women, Multi-Melta, Meltagun, Simulacrum

FAST ATTACK
Dominions, 6 Women, 4x Meltagun, VSS w/ Combi-Plasma, MM Immolator
Dominions, 6 Women, 4x Meltagun, VSS w/ Combi-Plasma, MM Immolator

HEAVY SUPPORT
Exorcist
Exorcist

That comes to 1701, so I've got 49 points to spend and not sure what on. Any ideas?
Also, has anyone played with Condemnors yet? Should a TAC list just take condemnors for all the basic squads combi weapons? I have a certain affection for my combi-flamers and I'm hesitant to make the switch.

Litanies! If you're taking a foot mob, I would recommend fitting in Jacobus somewhere as well. Also, why the 5 girl squads without rides? they are going to die horribly. I think one big squad of 20 is more than enough. YOu put all five priests and Jacobus in there and just lol.

So drop the 20 entirely and use the points for Uriah and the rides for the 5 girl squads, imo. And litanies is required.

Thanks for the info Pretre.

Amerikon wrote:
Also, has anyone played with Condemnors yet? Should a TAC list just take condemnors for all the basic squads combi weapons? I have a certain affection for my combi-flamers and I'm hesitant to make the switch.

I am still trying to figure out the right balance between Condemnors and Flamers/Melta/Plasma, but you want at least three Condemnors in any setting you think you'll meet up with Heralds or Warlock councils. Personally, I would rather have the backup shots just in case (so I run 5). I can come up with situations where I only have one chance to take out a 2++ psyker squad before they start getting locked in combat, so I want as many shots as possible. I cannot come up with similar scenarios needing a combi-flamer or melta. Your mileage will definitely vary though, depending on the lists you play against. For what its worth my first game with the new Sisters was against CronAir and I did not mind having the Condemnors - flamers would not have made any difference, melta MAYBE.

pretre wrote:
itanies is required.

One thousand times this. Have priests? Take Litanies! Remember it causes you to auto-pass preferred enemy in a Sisters blob (so simulacrum and Jacobus means 3 guaranteed phases of PE), and Celestine's Intervention if you run her with that squad.

And all of the Hymns of War rolls, even more importantly.

That's why you take it in the first place

Ok so I'm really trying to get it but I don't: Why are Priests the auto include everyone has made them to seem? The War Hymns are great but ONLY in the assault phase which is something that it seems SoB should avoid like the plague. Not to mention the fact that almost all of 40K steers away from. What am I missing??

In other news, Coming soon to a Shapeways near you:

Because one of the biggest issues for SoB is dying/fleeing due to leadership tests. Every other army has easy access to either fearless, ATSKNF, stubborn or just a damn high leadership. Sisters had none of that until now with a priest that grants fearless to their unit.

I have been thinking on ways to make Uriah work without sending him forward.

Aegis Defensive line and quad gun for the Exorcists.

10 retributors with 4 heavy bolters and a simulacrum sitting behind that line as well.

Stick Uriah behind the line with the Retributors.

You have plenty of wounds to shift before the heavy bolters die.
You get 2 x rending from the girls and Uriah gives you a free one on top that you don't even need to roll leadership for.

Since you don't have to buy a Superior, Uriah is really 90 points, or buy a laud hailer on a nearby exorcist.

I think anyone would think twice before assaulting that squad as they are going to be very hard to kill with the re-roll armors you're getting. Furthermore, being able to get rending shots basically when you want is better than their previous incarnation and with this setup... you're getting 3 turns of it. Heavy Bolters got more expensive, but I think they can be a lot more reliable now.

Pretre, what's your opinion on which kind of power weapon you'd equip an SCS countercharge unit with?

So bottom line, how does everyone feel about stealing the D.Angels fighter for use as a stand in Avenger? WYISWYG wise it has the same weapons load out in the chain gun variant. If the Avenger can't take on extra "boom" then the missile pods are decorative. If they can, there's your boom.

 pretre wrote:

Amerikon wrote:
I'm trying to work out a 1750 foot mob list and here's where I'm at so far:

Spoiler:

HQ
St Celestine
5x Ministorum Priest

TROOPS
BSS, 5 Women, Heavy Flamer, Flamer, SS w/ Combi-Flamer
BSS, 5 Women, Heavy Flamer, Flamer, SS w/ Combi-Flamer
BSS, 5 Women, Heavy Flamer, Flamer, SS w/ Combi-Flamer
BSS, 20 Women, Multi-Melta, Meltagun, Simulacrum
BSS, 20 Women, Multi-Melta, Meltagun, Simulacrum

FAST ATTACK
Dominions, 6 Women, 4x Meltagun, VSS w/ Combi-Plasma, MM Immolator
Dominions, 6 Women, 4x Meltagun, VSS w/ Combi-Plasma, MM Immolator

HEAVY SUPPORT
Exorcist
Exorcist

That comes to 1701, so I've got 49 points to spend and not sure what on. Any ideas?
Also, has anyone played with Condemnors yet? Should a TAC list just take condemnors for all the basic squads combi weapons? I have a certain affection for my combi-flamers and I'm hesitant to make the switch.

Litanies! If you're taking a foot mob, I would recommend fitting in Jacobus somewhere as well. Also, why the 5 girl squads without rides? they are going to die horribly. I think one big squad of 20 is more than enough. YOu put all five priests and Jacobus in there and just lol.

So drop the 20 entirely and use the points for Uriah and the rides for the 5 girl squads, imo. And litanies is required.

The idea was to cram in as many foot troops as possible. I originally had two squads of 20 and two of 10, but I figured splitting them up into units of 5 would give me a couple more flamers. I was generally thinking they would be more or less disposable.

So you would put Uriah and all five Priests in the 20 Sisters mob? If I do go that route, I might be better off dropping Celestine to let Jacobus be my Warlord to get the 5++ on my blob unit.

I am not Pretre, but I have been thinking about a command squad myself and this is how I am planning on doing it.

Canoness with Rosarius and Mantle of Ophelia. Maybe an inferno pistol to pop a transport for them to charge.

4 Celestians with Power axes and bolt pistols.
Hospitalier.

2 Priests. Power mauls, but not required. Possibly Jacobus with them for fearless and counter attack.

Run them into a Repressor or keep them back without transport for counter attack.

Good chance of that transport making it to enemy lines.

Celestians will hit after marines and same time as guardsman so axes don't penalize them that much. Re-roll armors should keep them up through either's attacks, especially if you factor in feel no pain.
Canoness is there to tank anything that could harm the celestians and/or priests.

With re-roll to hits and wounds, Celestians will go to town and clear pretty much anything. 9 hits after re-rolls, 7 wounds also after re-rolls. Factor in the priests, odd wound from the canoness and it's going to be hard to beat that unit unless you're a unit full of death cult assassins.

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:
So bottom line, how does everyone feel about stealing the D.Angels fighter for use as a stand in Avenger? WYISWYG wise it has the same weapons load out in the chain gun variant. If the Avenger can't take on extra "boom" then the missile pods are decorative. If they can, there's your boom.

I think it would be fine personally and I plan on doing it as well.

 MrFlutterPie wrote:

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:
So bottom line, how does everyone feel about stealing the D.Angels fighter for use as a stand in Avenger? WYISWYG wise it has the same weapons load out in the chain gun variant. If the Avenger can't take on extra "boom" then the missile pods are decorative. If they can, there's your boom.

I think it would be fine personally and I plan on doing it as well.

Smaller, cheaper, and better looking than an actual Avenger. Sounds pretty good to me.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Second crack at the 1750 list, from pretre's suggestions:


It's less "fearless power armor horde" and more "mech plus priest-bomb". I figured I'd throw a bunch of Condemnors in there just to see how it goes. I put two on the priests even though they're BS3. I thought that having a little critical mass in one unit would be handy. Total points looks like 1746. I hate odd numbers like that, but I guess sometimes you have to leave points on the table.