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djones520 wrote: He's lived there for 26 years, and he's Kanluwen. He doesn't need to provide proof.
I thought we had to provide the proof?
You're both wrong, this clearly isn't an academic discussion (because someone threw the P-bomb) and no proof is necessary!
"So, do please come along when we're promoting something new and need photos for the facebook page or to send to our regional manager, do please engage in our gaming when we're pushing something specific hard and need to get the little kiddies drifting past to want to come in an see what all the fuss is about. But otherwise, stay the feth out, you smelly, antisocial bastards, because we're scared you are going to say something that goes against our mantra of absolute devotion to the corporate motherland and we actually perceive any of you who've been gaming more than a year to be a hostile entity as you've been exposed to the internet and 'dangerous ideas'. " - MeanGreenStompa
"Then someone mentions Infinity and everyone ignores it because no one really plays it." - nkelsch
whembly wrote: I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me how/why Voter ID is racist again...
Because context matters. The people who write these laws know perfectly well who they're targeting, this isn't just some abstract theory about how to run a fair election.
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
So which completely unbiased news outlet is acceptable? MSNBC?
I hear the word of god is pretty infallible.
Shame it always seems to be written down and then mistranslated, misinterpreted and just plain got wrong by so many fallible humans, then.
Imagine if it hadn't been misinterpreted or mistranslated and God/whatever-higher-being-if-there-is-one is just a dick.
That'd be a real pain.
Dakka Bingo! By Ouze "You are the best at flying things"-Kanluwen
"Further proof that Purple is a fething brilliant super villain " -KingCracker
"Purp.. Im pretty sure I have a gun than can reach you...."-Nicorex
"That's not really an apocalypse. That's just Europe."-Grakmar
"almost as good as winning free cake at the tea drinking contest for an Englishman." -Reds8n
Seal up your lips and give no words but mum.
Equip, Reload. Do violence.
Watch for Gerry.
It was horrible, just horrible. I was forced to show some ID, just like last time. I gave them the option of TDL, CHl, or passport. ; ) Oh Noes Da Horror!!!!
cincydooley wrote: Wow. That's really interesting. Anyone know the costs for the IDs in Texas?
If i remember, Frazz said it was free in texas
IIRC when the law was put in place there is the option for a free ID for lower income persons. This may have been around for some time.
Of more terrible import, GC is now taking her online courses. Soon her and I will be bebopping along the roads. To quote GKar to his (failed) attempted assassin "first you will know fear. Then you will know pain. Then you will know death. Have a good day."
Kanluwen wrote: There's a difference between saying that you provide voter IDs free of charge and actually doing so.
But hey, it's not like I live in North Carolina and actually have experience in dealing with the NC DMV.
Its not like I live in Indiana, and actually have experience dealing with the Indiana BMV (as recently as last week)
Are you trying to say that the law providing for free ID is not being followed and people are being charged for them? Or is it your usual track of claiming that no one has time off before elections, and that people who lost their original documents have to pay to replace those before a free ID can be obtained?
Not every DMV location offers ID services, not everyone has the time, etc.
Since you seem so dismissive of that as a "claim" though, I'll just tell you to keep imagining that the voter ID laws were totally put into place to prevent voter fraud and not as a member of the Republican party here in NC put it "to block people who vote Democrat".
Every DMV location in Texas (called DPS here) open to the public does however. I once did a license renewal in a trailer, with two old ladies working and three customers in the budding metropolis of Waller County (population 12 I think, not including cattle of course). They even offered me coffee and a donut.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Maddermax wrote: One in Five Texas Voters had to sign an affidavit to vote - Just remember that, because the original law did not allow that until Wendy Davis introduced an amendment to it.
Thats what you call... a lie. I had to sign an affadavit for the last election. It took me about 8 seconds, five of which to find the English version.
Automatically Appended Next Post: "On the 20% figure, sorry, that was one fifth of voters in Travis Country.. It would still have been pretty horrific if not for the Davis amendment."
Travis County is the Texas quarantine facility for Californians. No wonder Californians can't get their act together. They are too busy ruining the wierdness that was Austin.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
whembly wrote: Now remind me again how/why Voter ID is racist again?
Because Democrats assume minorities can't get their act together to get an ID.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
cincydooley wrote: Because minorities can't afford IDs or don't have the time to go get them?
So which completely unbiased news outlet is acceptable? MSNBC?
I hear the word of god is pretty infallible.
The yodels of the Great Wienerdog are wisdom for the ages.
This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2013/11/14 12:42:46
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Kanluwen wrote: If we're talking about proof, I'd like to see actual numbers of convictable voter fraud.
If you want to prove this is something which so direly needed to be protected from fraud, then it should not be hard to do.
And no citations of Fox News. Actual evidence.
So I provided you with a link in the OP from that hard right source CNN showing that voter ID laws did not disenfranchise people, and you come out crying about Fox News Absolutely classic Taking part in the electoral process is one of the most sacred duties that a citizen can do in the United States. It is the cornerstone of our political system, and reflects the will of the people. There should not be more scrutiny involved in buying a beer than taking part in activity that helps shape the political landscape and direction that the country takes
Sept. 5, 2013. Between 2008 and 2012, 475 cases of voter fraud in North Carolina were referred for prosecution, according to a new NC Board of Elections report obtained by the Voter Integrity Project of North Carolina (after repeated requests), which undermines claims that voter fraud in North Carolina is insignificant.
“This looks like an interim report, but it shows some disturbing numbers,” said Jay DeLancy, Executive Director of Voter Integrity Project-NC. “Because reports of voter fraud often don’t get referred for prosecution until the year after an election, the extent of potential fraud in the 2012 election still remains to be seen. The large increase in fraud referrals in 2012 over 2008 suggests that substantial fraud occurred in last year’s election, but the full numbers have not yet been reported. In any event, these numbers totally crush the lie that there is no voter fraud in North Carolina”
“Opponents of North Carolina’s new election law often point to the low prosecution rates to support their denials of voter fraud in North Carolina,” said DeLancy. “This report raises a more disturbing question: Why are District Attorneys in North Carolina so negligent in prosecuting election fraud?”
DEL RIO, Texas - In a courtroom here, Dora Gonzalez confessed.
She had intentionally hampered the voting process by mishandling more than 100 absentee ballots in the March 2 Democratic primary in Val Verde County. By 29 votes, her employer, County Commissioner Jesus Ortiz, had won the primary, effectively handing him re-election in this Democratic county. Challenger Gus Flores alleged voter fraud and sued.
A judge ruled in August that Gonzalez' activity on Ortiz' behalf was illegal and ordered a new primary. Under close scrutiny, the election was won by Flores with a 306-vote margin.
In many ways, the case is typical of voter fraud in South Texas: Many violators are not charged -- Gonzalez wasn't either --- because prosecutors complain the cases are hard to prove. When they are prosecuted, the penalties are so small they don't deter the crime. So, with payment as "get out the vote" workers for candidates, the vote harvesters continue to hijack absentee ballots by sending applications on behalf of voters, arriving on their doorstep as the ballots arrive and coaching their votes.
"It's almost like it's OK because it's always been done," said Rudy Montalvo, election administrator in Starr County, which hugs the Mexican border just northwest of McAllen. He's done battle with his own Dora Gonzalezes, to little avail.
"We've had four people indicted, and all of them got a plea bargain. And that's probation, usually," he said. "In the end, the hammer's not hard enough."
Gonzalez testified that she worked the March primary for a number of local candidates, as well as Congressman Ciro Rodriguez, Texas state Sen. Carlos Uresti and gubernatorial candidate Bill White. Since politiqueras' activity is marshaled through local party players, it is unlikely that anyone on White or Uresti's level would ever know of their work.
Gonzalez told the court that Ortiz had given her a stack of applications for mail-in ballots for potential voters and 100 stamps.
Many of those voters said in depositions that Gonzalez took their completed ballots. Most said that Gonzalez did not attempt to influence their votes, but others did. "She filled them out so I could sign, and then she took the envelope," one voter said.
And Gonzalez' reason for assisting these candidates and voters?
"Because I'm interested in my community, and I'm interested in having good people help the community," Gonzalez replied, according to an account in the Del Rio News Herald.
LITTLE ATTENTION FROM AUSTIN
Florence Shapiro
SHAPIRO
Shortly after Texas Watchdog began its series of stories on voter fraud in March, state Sen. Florence Shapiro said in an interview, “I will be filing legislation to deal with this.”
Now, with bills being pre-filed and the session’s January start just weeks away, Shapiro is vague as to just what can be done.
“We’ve talked a lot about it through another senator who wanted to do something about it,” Shapiro said, although she couldn’t recall the other senator’s name. “And other people in the senate are looking at filing some of these bills.”
But she declined to be specific or even support what she vowed to do earlier this year. It’s been the way of voter fraud in Texas, particularly in South Texas.
“In Austin, anyone from San Antonio and above thinks that this is the Wild West, so why pay attention,” said state Rep. Aaron Peña, whose District 40 takes in a large swath of the region. “They look back over 300 years of history, and they see that now they’re still doing the same thing with voting in South Texas.”
Steve Wolens
WOLENS
Voter fraud has been over the years inadvertently abetted by malaise or disinterest at the state lawmaker level. In some cases like Gonzalez', politiqueras have been linked to prominent state officeholders and candidates.
The most recent statewide effort to address mail-in ballot fraud, a 2003 bill by former Democratic state Rep. Steve Wolens, enhanced penalties for certain activities regarding mail-in ballots.
“The first thing that happened when I put the bill out there is that people came out saying it would disenfranchise voters, like the elderly and the disabled,” Wolens said. “And my response was, ‘Poppycock. This is aimed at the illegal harvesting of voters by paid opportunists who were themselves disenfranchising the elderly and the disabled.'”
In 2005, Robert Talton, a staunch conservative Republican state representative from Pasadena, moved to one-up Wolens. His House bill would have barred anyone from assisting more than one voter in an election, with some provisional caveats for close family. The bill died in committee.
ELECTIONS CHIEFS FRUSTRATED
But the practice of vote harvesting has never relented. State law regarding the mail-in ballot is fairly simple: If a person is mailing in a ballot, as Gonzalez did, that person must sign the ballot.
"A person other than the voter who deposits the carrier envelope in the mail or with a common or contract carrier must provide the person's signature, printed name, and residence address on the reverse side of the envelope," the law says.
The rule for signing a ballot for someone else - the signer is called a witness - is also explicit:
"The witness must state on the document or paper the name, in printed form, of the person who cannot sign. ... The witness must affix the witness's own signature to the document or paper and state the witness's own name, in printed form, near the signature. The witness must also state the witness's residence address unless the witness is an election officer, in which case the witness must state the witness's official title."
Vote harvesters, who can assist voters legally, are entitled to as many ballots as they need or want, and can even request them at the Secretary of State’s website.
“They get the mail-in ballot, then the fraud comes in,” said Pam Hill, election administrator in San Patricio County. She’s been in office since January 2006, and the practice has grown since that time, she said.
The number of mail-in ballots cast varies wildly, depending on the contest, she said. "It could be 1,500 mail in ballots, or 100."
Hill and other election administrators from South Texas have been meeting informally for the past couple years to talk about voter fraud issues unique to the region. They hope to get support from lawmakers, but so far the group has had little luck. And to make things worse, two elected officials who attended a small conference with the election officials in Kingsville in August, Solomon Ortiz, Jr., and Abel Herrero, lost their re-election bids in November.
“We just aren’t sure what to do now,” said Roy Ruiz, election administrator in Kenedy County.
A legislative election committee report is due out at the start of the year and contains nothing about addressing mail-in ballot fraud, according to the committee's office. It will, though, contain plenty about the need for a voter ID measure that has failed in previous sessions. Several Republican lawmakers prefiled voter ID measures last month.
DA: CASES HARD TO PROSECUTE
In the politiquera world, they are legends: names like Elvira Rios, Gloria Barajas, Cynthia Lopez, Dora Gonzalez and Zaida Bueno. For years, they have been known as the go-to people for South Texas candidates.These mostly female vote harvesters work the apartment complexes, the nursing homes and any other living areas for the elderly and disabled. The compensation varies, from a deal that gives them perhaps $1 per ballot to a wider-ranging proposal that could pay hundreds of dollars for supervising a team of politiqueras.
They are helping, most say, enabling a person to exercise his or her constitutional right to vote. Some like Gonzalez say they are volunteers and make no money, and are only in it for the good of the community. Others are documented as paid in campaign finance reports, sometimes by local district attorneys and judges -- the same officials who are responsible for determining if the vote-harvesting has crossed over into illegal activity.
Rene Guerra, district attorney in Hidalgo County, saw a grand jury hand up 43 counts of voter fraud on a number of individuals -- some who he admits may have helped him win elections -- in a massive 2005 case presented by the Texas Rangers. As the years went by, he dropped all but one of the cases. Nothing there, he said.
In a county that is legendary for its politiquera activity, Guerra said he has never been able to prove voter fraud.
“It’s almost impossible to prove that,” Guerra said. “If I pay you $10 or a hamburger to vote for Obama or Bush, and you go vote, how do you prove it?"
The witnesses to the crime don't help, either.
"As some dementia sets into the elderly block of voters they’re prone to contradict themselves in statements. It will be the killing shot for prosecution," he said.
'A FAIR ELECTION. FINALLY.'
The state Attorney General’s office has proclaimed war on people like those vote harvesters, though the office can only act when its assistance is requested by a local law enforcement agency.
Still, the AG this year successfully wrapped up 10 cases of voter-related issues, including mail-in ballot fraud, and filed nine more cases that have not yet been heard. Bueno, who explained how voter fraud works in a Texas Watchdog story this year, pleaded guilty in June to one count of mishandling mail-in ballots along with two others in Jim Wells County. All those convicted received the same punishment: a year of probation, a 180-day suspended jail sentence, a $200 fine and 40 hours of community work.
Few ever get jail time, even with confessions.
“Nothing happens,” said Lucy Lopez, an alderman in Taft, Texas. “And so people get to the point where, why even say anything about it?”
Gus Flores, the county commissioner who pushed his case in Val Verde County, said the only way for him to disrupt the entrenched voter fraud system was to take it into a courtroom. It cost him tens of thousands of dollars, he said. “But that election was stolen from me, and we had to prove it."
Even the local Democratic party was against him, Flores said, and together with League of United Latin American Citizens tried to prevent the do-over election, saying the date of Sept. 25 did not allow adequate time for voter participation.
Diana Salgado, chair of the local Democratic party, said the judge's verdict enabling a new election "was a poor decision. ... There's much more to this story than was presented." She did not return a follow-up call.
“It never mattered,” Flores said. “They knew the election was wrong, but it’s the way its been done here for many years. And it reaches all the way to the top, the top officials.
“But in the end, we had a fair election. Finally."
Voter fraud occurs in Texas, though convictions and guilty pleas are rare
False
Texas’ attorney general, Greg Abbott, has his facts wrong on the voting process, U.S. Rep. Eddie Bernice Johnson said in an opinion column published Aug. 8, 2013, in the Fort Worth Star-Telegram.
For example, "Abbott advocates the use of voter ID laws, allegedly to stop voter fraud," the Dallas Democrat wrote. "Studies have shown that voter fraud is non-existent in Texas."
"Non-existent" is pretty strong; we don’t have to look any farther than our own reporting to know that statement isn’t entirely accurate. But how prevalent is voter fraud in Texas?
Johnson spokesman Cameron Trimble told us by phone and email that the column should have said "virtually" non-existent. He sent us web links to research and news stories that described nationwide voter fraud as rare. None of the materials analyzed fraud in Texas specifically, and we found only one mention of a Texas case -- the 2006 conviction of a Pecos woman who filled out and mailed absentee ballots for others.
Trimble’s sources mostly referred to voter fraud -- deception committed by individual voters, such as voting more than once, impersonating a voter or voting despite ineligibility -- rather than overall election fraud, which encompasses actions by others, such as election officials or campaign workers, who break election laws in ways that could include intimidating voters, publishing misinformation about polling places or possessing ballots not their own.
We dipped into that distinction in an April 2012 fact-check that rated as Half True a claim from Abbott that he had secured 50 convictions for election fraud. Abbott’s basis was his office’s records on 2002-12 prosecutions for alleged election code violations.
For this fact-check, we asked Abbott’s office for an updated list. County district attorneys and the Texas secretary of state’s elections division usually refer allegations of election code violations to the attorney general. We also called the secretary’s office and several district attorney offices around the state, but found no specific information about how many violations were reported or prosecuted.
Abbott spokeswoman Lauren Bean emailed us records showing that from August 2002 through September 2012, the office received 616 allegations of election-code violations and recorded 78 election-code prosecutions.
By our count, 46 of the prosecutions ended with a conviction, guilty plea, no-contest plea or guilty plea as part of deferred adjudication. Of those, 18 cases appeared to involve fraud committed by individual voters: 12 cases with ineligible voters, five cases of voter impersonation and one case of voting more than once.
So, by our reading of the attorney general’s records, 18 instances of voter fraud have been confirmed in Texas since 2002.
In 2012, the News21 investigative project headquartered at Arizona State University’s journalism school compiled a database that showed 104 Texas cases of alleged election fraud among 2,068 nationwide since 2000.
The News21 students, who published their results online Aug. 12, 2012, gathered allegations through public information requests, news accounts and court records. According to the project’s website, they included all cases "that had reached some level of official action: That is, someone was charged, an investigation was opened, a specific accusation was made against a named person."
News21 determined that 37 of the 104 Texas allegations were made against voters. Most of the cases were still pending at the time the students published their project in 2012, but 15 had resulted in a guilty plea or conviction, according to the database.
Our ruling
Johnson said, "Studies have shown that voter fraud is non-existent in Texas."
She did not provide, nor did we find, studies showing such fraud to be non-existent. To the contrary, Abbott’s records show 18 convictions, no-contest pleas or guilty pleas on voter fraud charges from 2002 through 2012. That’s not a lot of fraud, by any means, but it still evidently occurred.
Johnson might have meant to say "virtually non-existent," but the Truth-O-Meter holds individuals accountable for what they actually say. We rate this statement as False.
To date, 46 states have prosecuted or convicted cases of voter fraud.
More than 24 million voter registrations are invalid, yet remain on the rolls nation-wide.
There are over 1.8 million dead voters still eligible on the rolls across the country.
More than 2.75 million Americans are registered to vote in more than one state.
True The Vote recently found 99 cases of potential felony interstate voter fraud.
Maryland affiliates of True The Vote uncovered cases of people registering and voting after their respective deaths.
This year, True The Vote uncovered more than 348,000 dead people on the rolls in 27 states.
California: 49,000
Florida: 30,000
Texas: 28,500
Michigan: 25,000
Illinois: 24,000
12 Indiana counties have more registered voters than residents.
The Ohio Secretary of State admitted that multiple Ohio counties have more registered voters than residents.
Federal records showed 160 counties in 19 states have over 100 percent voter registration.
The Florida New Majority Education Fund, Democratic Party of Florida and the National Council of La Raza are currently under investigation for alleged voter registration fraud.
True The Vote is Chuck Norris approved.
How popular is Voter ID?
74 percent of Americans support, according to The Washington Post.
71 percent of Latinos support it, according to the PEW Research Center.
How did our voting records get so bad?
Various groups threaten local election authorities to not maintain their rolls according to federal law:
http://www.rottenacorn.com/index.html [url]ACORN returned to the national spotlight during the 2008 election when its employees turned in fraudulent voter registration files, including listing the Dallas Cowboys’ starting lineup as voters in Nevada. This blatant attempt at fraud led authorities to raid ACORN’s offices in the state. Not to be outdone, ACORN canvassers in Florida actually attempted to turn in forms registering Mickey Mouse as a voter. And ACORN managed to register a seven-year old girl to vote in Connecticut. The list goes on.
Nation-wide investigations into ACORN’s role in voter fraud have yielded dozens of indictments. Nevada recently charged ACORN with 26 counts of voter registration fraud and 13 counts of illegally compensating canvassers. In Pennsylvania, seven Pittsburgh-area ACORN employees were charged with falsifying voter registration forms. Six of them were accused of doing so to meet an illegal quota system.
Spoiler:
State Year Details
AR 1998 A contractor with ACORN-affiliated Project Vote was arrested for falsifying about 400 voter registration cards.
CO 2005 Two ex-ACORN employees were convicted in Denver of perjury for submitting false voter registrations.
2004 An ACORN employee admitted to forging signatures and registering three of her friends to vote 40 times.
CT 2008 The New York Post reported that ACORN submitted a voter registration card for a 7-year-old Bridgeport girl. Another 8,000 cards from the same city will be scrutinized for possible fraud.
FL 2009 In September, 11 ACORN workers were accused of forging voter registration applications in Miami-Dade County during the last election. The Florida Department of Law Enforcement and the state attorney’s office scoured hundreds of suspicious applications provided by ACORN and found 197 of 260 contained personal ID information that did not match any living person.
2008 Election officials in Brevard County have given prosecutors more than 23 suspect registrations from ACORN. The state's Division of Elections is also investigating complaints in Orange and Broward Counties.
2004 A Florida Department of Law Enforcement spokesman said ACORN was “singled out” among suspected voter registration groups for a 2004 wage initiative because it was “the common thread” in the agency’s fraud investigations.
IN 2008 Election officials in Indiana have thrown out more than 4,000 ACORN-submitted voter registrations after finding they had identical handwriting and included the names of many deceased Indianans, and even the name of a fast food restaurant.
MI 2008 Clerks in Detroit found a "sizeable number of duplicate and fraudulent [voter] applications" from the Michigan branch of ACORN. Those applications have been turned over to the U.S. Attorney's office for investigation.
2004 The Detroit Free Press reported that “overzealous or unscrupulous campaign workers in several Michigan counties are under investigation for voter-registration fraud, suspected of attempting to register nonexistent people or forging applications for already-registered voters.” ACORN-affiliate Project Vote was one of two groups suspected of turning in the documents.
MO 2008 Nearly 400 ACORN-submitted registrations in Kansas City have been rejected due to duplication or fake information.
2007 Four ACORN employees were indicted in Kansas City for charges including identity theft and filing false registrations during the 2006 election.
2006 Eight ACORN employees in St. Louis were indicted on federal election fraud charges. Each of the eight faces up to five years in prison for forging signatures and submitting false information.
2003 Of 5,379 voter registration cards ACORN submitted in St. Louis, only 2,013 of those appeared to be valid. At least 1,000 are believed to be attempts to register voters illegally.
MN 2004 During a traffic stop, police found more than 300 voter registration cards in the trunk of a former ACORN employee, who had violated a legal requirements that registration cards be submitted to the Secretary of State within 10 days of being filled out and signed.
NC 2008 County elections officials have sent suspicious voter registration applications to the state Board of Elections. Many of the applications had similar or identical names, but with different addresses or dates of birth.
2004 North Carolina officials investigated ACORN for submitting fake voter registration cards.
NM 2008 Prosecutors are investigating more than 1,100 ACORN-submitted voter registration cards after a county clerk found them to be fraudulent. Many of the cards included duplicate names and slightly altered personal information.
2005 Four ACORN employees submitted as many as 3,000 potentially fraudulent signatures on the group’s Albuquerque ballot initiative. A local sheriff added: “It’s safe to say the forgery was widespread.”
2004 An ACORN employee registered a 13-year-old boy to vote. Citing this and other examples, New Mexico State Representative Joe Thompson stated that ACORN was “manufacturing voters” throughout New Mexico.
NV 2009 Nevada authorities indicted ACORN on 26 counts of voter registration fraud and 13 counts of illegally compensating canvassers. ACORN provided a bonus compensation program called “Blackjack” or “21+” for any canvasser who registered more than 20 voters per shift, which is illegal under Nevada law.
2008 Nevada state authorities raided ACORN's Las Vegas headquarters as part of a task force investigation of election fraud. Fraudulent registrations included players from the Dallas Cowboys.
OH 2008 ACORN activists gave Ohio residents cash and cigarettes in exchange for filling out voter registration card, according to the New York Post. Some voters claim to have registered dozens of times, and one man says he signed up on 72 cards.
2007 A man in Reynoldsburg was indicted on two felony counts of illegal voting and false registration, after being registered by ACORN to vote in two separate counties.
2004 A grand jury indicted a Columbus ACORN worker for submitting a false signature and false voter registration form. In Franklin County, two ACORN workers submitted what the director of the board of election supervisors called “blatantly false” forms. In Cuyahoga County, ACORN and its affiliate Project Vote submitted registration cards that had the highest rate of errors for any voter registration group.
PA 2009 Seven ACORN workers in the Pittsburgh area were indicted for submitting falsified voter registration forms. Six of the seven were also indicted for registering voters under an illegal quota system.
2008 State election officials have thrown out 57,435 voter registrations, the majority of which were submitted by ACORN. The registrations were thrown out after officials found "clearly fraudulent" signatures, vacant lots listed as addresses, and other signs of fraud.
2008 An ACORN employee in West Reading, PA, was sentenced to up to 23 months in prison for identity theft and tampering with records. A second ACORN worker pleaded not guilty to the same charges and is free on $10,000 bail.
2004 Reading’s Director of Elections received calls from numerous individuals complaining that ACORN employees deliberately put inaccurate information on their voter registration forms. The Berks County director of elections said voter fraud was “absolutely out of hand,” and added: “Not only do we have unintentional duplication of voter registration but we have blatant duplicate voter registrations.” The Berks County deputy director of elections added that ACORN was under investigation by the Department of Justice.
TX 2008 In Harris County, nearly 10,000 ACORN-submitted registrations were found to be invalid, including many with clearly fraudulent addresses or other personal information.
2008 ACORN turned in the voter registration form of David Young, who told reporters “The signature is not my signature. It’s not even close.” His social security number and date of birth were also incorrect.
VA 2005 In 2005, the Virginia State Board of Elections admonished Project Vote and ACORN for turning in a significant number of faulty voter registrations. An audit revealed that 83% of sampled registrations that were rejected for carrying false or questionable information were submitted by Project Vote. Many of these registrations carried social security numbers that exist for other people, listed non-existent or commercial addresses, or were for convicted felons in violation of state and federal election law.
In a letter to ACORN, the State Board of Elections reported that 56% of the voter registration applications ACORN turned in were ineligible. Further, a full 35% were not submitted in a timely manner, as required by law. The State Board of Elections also commented on what appeared to be evidence of intentional voter fraud. "Additionally,” they wrote, “information appears to have been altered on some applications where information given by the applicant in one color ink has been scratched through and re-entered in another color ink. Any alteration of a voter registration application is a Class 5 Felony in accordance with § 24.2-1009 of the Code of Virginia."
WA 2007 Three ACORN employees pleaded guilty, and four more were charged, in the worst case of voter registration fraud in Washington state history. More than 2,000 fraudulent voter registration cards were submitted by the group during a voter registration drive.
WI 2008 At least 33,000 ACORN-submitted registrations in Milwaukee have been called into question after it was found that the organizations had been using felons as registration workers, in violation of state election rules. Two people involved in the ongoing Wisconsin voter fraud investigation have been charged with felonies.
2004 The district attorney’s office investigated seven voter registration applications Project Vote employees filed in the names of people who said the group never contacted them. Former Project Vote employee Robert Marquise Blakely told the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel that he had not met with any of the people whose voter registration applications he signed, “an apparent violation of state law,” according to the paper.
EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
Building confidence in U.S. elections is central to our nation’s democracy. At a time when there is growing skepticism with our electoral system, the Commission believes that a bold new approach is essential. The Commission envisions a system that makes Americans proud of themselves as citizens and of democracy in the United States. We should have an electoral system where registering to vote is convenient, voting is efficient and pleasant, voting machines work properly, fraud is deterred, and disputes are handled fairly and expeditiously.
This report represents a comprehensive proposal for modernizing our electoral system. We propose to construct the new edifice for elections on five pillars:
First, we propose a universal voter registration system in which the states, not local jurisdictions, are responsible for the accuracy and quality of the voter lists. Additionally, we propose that the U.S. Election Assistance Commission (EAC) develop a mechanism to connect all states’ list. These topdown and interoperable registration lists will, if implemented successfully, eliminate the vast majority of complaints currently leveled against the election system. States will retain control over their registration list, but a distributed database can remove interstate duplicates and help states to maintain an up-to-date, fully accurate registration list. This would mean people would need to register only once in their lifetime, and it would be easy to update their registration information when they move. We also propose that all states establish uniform procedures for counting provisional ballots, and many members recommend that the ballots should be counted if the citizen has voted in the correct jurisdiction.
Second, to make sure that a person arriving at a polling site is the same one who is named on the list, we propose a uniform system of voter identification based on the "REAL ID card" or an equivalent for people without a drivers license. To prevent the ID from being a barrier to voting, we recommend that states use the registration and ID process to enfranchise more voters than ever. States should play an affirmative role in reaching out to non-drivers by providing more offices, including mobile ones, to register voters and provide photo IDs free of charge. There is likely to be less discrimination against minorities if there is a single, uniform ID, than if poll workers can apply multiple standards. In addition, we suggest procedural and institutional safeguards to make sure that the rights of citizens are not abused and that voters will not be disenfranchised because of an ID requirement. We also propose that voters who do not have a photo ID during a transitional period receive a provisional ballot that would be counted if their signature is verified.
Third, we propose measures that will increase voting participation by having the states assume greater responsibility to register citizens, make voting more convenient, and offer more information on registration lists and voting. States should allow experimentation with voting centers. We propose ways to facilitate voting by overseas military and civilians and ways to make sure that people with disabilities have full access to voting. In addition, we ask the states to allow for restoration of voting rights for ex-felons (other than individuals convicted of capital crimes or registered sex offenders) when they have fully served their sentence. We also identify several voter and civic education programs that could increase participation and inform voters, for example, by providing information on candidates and the voting process to citizens before the election. States and local jurisdictions should use Web sites, toll-free numbers, and other means to inform citizens about their registration status and the location of their precinct.
To improve ballot integrity, we propose that federal, state, and local prosecutors issue public reports on their investigations of election fraud, and we recommend federal legislation to deter or prosecute systemic efforts to deceive or intimidate voters. States should not discourage legal voter registration or get-out-the-vote activities, but they need to do more to prevent voter registration and absentee ballot fraud.
Fourth, we propose ways to give confidence to voters using electronic voting machines that their votes will be counted accurately. We call for an auditable backup on paper at this time, but we recognize the possibility of alternative technologies to audit those machines in the future. We encourage independent testing of voting systems (to include voting machines and software source code) under EAC supervision.
Finally, we recommend strengthening and restructuring the system by which elections have been administered in our country. We propose that the EAC and state election management bodies be reconstituted on a nonpartisan basis to become more independent and effective. We cannot build confidence in elections if secretaries of state responsible for certifying votes are simultaneously chairing political campaigns, and the EAC cannot undertake the additional responsibilities recommended by this report, including critical research, without gaining additional funds and support. Polling stations should be organized to reduce the chances of long lines; they should maintain "log-books" on Election Day to record complaints; and they need electronic poll-books to help voters find their correct precinct. HAVA should be fully funded and implemented by 2006.
The Commission puts forward 87 specific recommendations. Here are a few of the others:
We propose that the media improve coverage of elections by providing at least five minutes of candidate discourse every night in the month preceding the election.
We ask news organizations to voluntarily refrain from projecting presidential election results until polls close in the 48 contiguous states.
We request that all of the states provide unrestricted access to all legitimate domestic and international election observers, as we insist of other countries, but only one state currently permits; and
We propose changing the presidential primary schedule by creating four regional primaries.
Election reform is neither easy nor inexpensive. Nor can we succeed if we think of providing funds on a one-time basis. We need to view the administration of elections as a continuing challenge, which requires the highest priority of our citizens and our government. . .
5.1 INVESTIGATION AND PROSECUTION OF ELECTION FRAUD
While election fraud is difficult to measure, it occurs. The U.S. Department of Justice has launched more than 180 investigations into election fraud since October 2002. These investigations have resulted in charges for multiple voting, providing false information on their felon status, and other offenses against 89 individuals and in convictions of 52 individuals. The convictions related to a variety of election fraud offenses, from vote buying to submitting false voter registration information and voting-related offenses by non-citizens.54
In addition to the federal investigations, state attorneys general and local prosecutors handle cases of election fraud. Other cases are never pursued because of the difficulty in obtaining sufficient evidence for prosecution or because of the low priority given to election fraud cases. One district attorney, for example, explained that he did not pursue allegations of fraudulent voter registration because that is a victimless and nonviolent crime.55
Election fraud usually attracts public attention and comes under investigation only in close elections. Courts may only overturn an election result if there is proof that the number of irregular or fraudulent votes exceeded the margin of victory. When there is a wide margin, the losing candidate rarely presses for an investigation. Fraud in any degree and in any circumstance is subversive to the electoral process. The best way to maintain ballot integrity is to investigate all credible allegations of election fraud and otherwise prevent fraud before it can affect an election.
Investigation and prosecution of election fraud should include those acts committed by individuals, including election officials, poll workers, volunteers, challengers or other nonvoters associated with the administration of elections, and not just fraud by voters.
Frazzled wrote: It was horrible, just horrible. I was forced to show some ID, just like last time. I gave them the option of TDL, CHl, or passport. ; ) Oh Noes Da Horror!!!!
I too had to show my ID when I went and voted, at a polling place I spent 4.5 years in (the .5 was my student teaching), and one of the poll workers taught at my school when I went there. I was greeted, and then even though he knew me, asked for my name and my ID to verify the address on my ID matched my voter registration. I then signed the book to say, "yes I is who I said I is" and then I went and voted.
I also got a stick that says, "I Ohio Voting"
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DR:80+S++G+M+B+I+Pwmhd11#++D++A++++/sWD-R++++T(S)DM+ Ask me about Brushfire or Endless: Fantasy Tactics
Sept. 5, 2013. Between 2008 and 2012, 475 cases of voter fraud in North Carolina were referred for prosecution, according to a new NC Board of Elections report obtained by the Voter Integrity Project of North Carolina (after repeated requests), which undermines claims that voter fraud in North Carolina is insignificant.
“This looks like an interim report, but it shows some disturbing numbers,” said Jay DeLancy, Executive Director of Voter Integrity Project-NC. “Because reports of voter fraud often don’t get referred for prosecution until the year after an election, the extent of potential fraud in the 2012 election still remains to be seen. The large increase in fraud referrals in 2012 over 2008 suggests that substantial fraud occurred in last year’s election, but the full numbers have not yet been reported. In any event, these numbers totally crush the lie that there is no voter fraud in North Carolina”
“Opponents of North Carolina’s new election law often point to the low prosecution rates to support their denials of voter fraud in North Carolina,” said DeLancy. “This report raises a more disturbing question: Why are District Attorneys in North Carolina so negligent in prosecuting election fraud?”
...Ohhhhhhhhhhh you.
Next time before trying to pull a "GOTCHA!" moment I suggest you actually do some research.
Educate yourself as to why. The "Voter Integrity Project-NC" is an offshoot of "True the Vote" and is run by Jay deLancey.
Also since you still do not seem to grasp what a lot of people are saying:
The fact is not necessarily that it is disenfranchisement. It is the fact that these laws were passed as a solution to a supposed epidemic of voter fraud--which doesn't actually seem to exist.
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Easy E wrote: huh. That is intersting. I want to see more ver the course of more elections, but I find the initial results in this one Texas election promising.
Still, I think the core of my problem with the Voter ID laws is they are a solution looking for a problem.
We have an open border here. Its more than a solution looking for a problem. But I agree. It should be part of an overarching series of measures to insure voter infranchisement. This would include ovter guides, a full array over voter locations, multiple day voting, and careful oversight of the absentee and regular voting process to insure no fraud, or inversely, that eligible voters can indeed vote.
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
Next time before trying to pull a "GOTCHA!" moment I suggest you actually do some research.
Educate yourself as to why. The "Voter Integrity Project-NC" is an offshoot of "True the Vote" and is run by Jay deLancey.
Also since you still do not seem to grasp what a lot of people are saying:
The fact is not necessarily that it is disenfranchisement. It is the fact that these laws were passed as a solution to a supposed epidemic of voter fraud--which doesn't actually seem to exist.
Ohhhhhhhhhhh you
Crying about things being statistically insignificant, yet somehow not even reading your own link
Her name was one of nearly 30,000 across the state that volunteers with the Voter Integrity Project identified two weeks ago as potentially being dead but still registered to vote. The Voter Integrity Project is a North Carolina offshoot of True the Vote, a national movement that purports to combat election fraud by challenging the voter registration of those they believe should not be on voter lists.
"We're not really interested in partisan politics," said Jay DeLancy, a retired Air Force officer and director of Voter Integrity Project. "As an organization, we try to eliminate those kinds of biases in our research."
However, the subject of voter fraud is inextricably linked to the current political conversation. Republicans in many states, including North Carolina, have led efforts to pass laws that would require people to present picture identification when they go to the polls. That effort failed in North Carolina, but DeLancy recently appeared on a Fox News Channel show calling such laws "common sense". Democrats have generally pushed back against such laws, saying they would disproportionately affect elderly and minority voters.
Since DeLancy's group gave those names of potentially dead voters to the State Board of Elections, state and county elections officials have been investigating the list. Some names were already removed through regular list maintenance procedures, officials say. Others required further investigation. In Wake County, letters went to the families of 148 possibly deceased voters.
So far, 42 have sounded off that they're still among the living.
The argument for disenfranchisement was the one that was commonly brought up in each previous thread, along with accusations of racism. Both of which have proven unfounded. Now you're trying to argue the scale of fraud after it has been demonstrated that the numbers are skewed because DAs do not want to prosecute the crime, and that a bi-partisan group also stated that voter fraud is an issue.
Would that be True The Vote that was targeted by the IRS?
Oh, and congratulations. Your second link did nothing but prove that voter fraud convictions are so low because of serious hurdles to overcome, especially when non-citizens are having their illegally cast ballots protected. That and you ignored absolutely everything else that counters your argument.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/11/14 14:37:01
Next time before trying to pull a "GOTCHA!" moment I suggest you actually do some research.
Educate yourself as to why. The "Voter Integrity Project-NC" is an offshoot of "True the Vote" and is run by Jay deLancey.
Also since you still do not seem to grasp what a lot of people are saying:
The fact is not necessarily that it is disenfranchisement. It is the fact that these laws were passed as a solution to a supposed epidemic of voter fraud--which doesn't actually seem to exist.
Ohhhhhhhhhhh you
Crying about things being statistically insignificant, yet somehow not even reading your own link
Her name was one of nearly 30,000 across the state that volunteers with the Voter Integrity Project identified two weeks ago as potentially being dead but still registered to vote. The Voter Integrity Project is a North Carolina offshoot of True the Vote, a national movement that purports to combat election fraud by challenging the voter registration of those they believe should not be on voter lists.
"We're not really interested in partisan politics," said Jay DeLancy, a retired Air Force officer and director of Voter Integrity Project. "As an organization, we try to eliminate those kinds of biases in our research."
However, the subject of voter fraud is inextricably linked to the current political conversation. Republicans in many states, including North Carolina, have led efforts to pass laws that would require people to present picture identification when they go to the polls. That effort failed in North Carolina, but DeLancy recently appeared on a Fox News Channel show calling such laws "common sense". Democrats have generally pushed back against such laws, saying they would disproportionately affect elderly and minority voters.
Since DeLancy's group gave those names of potentially dead voters to the State Board of Elections, state and county elections officials have been investigating the list. Some names were already removed through regular list maintenance procedures, officials say. Others required further investigation. In Wake County, letters went to the families of 148 possibly deceased voters.
So far, 42 have sounded off that they're still among the living.
The argument for disenfranchisement was the one that was commonly brought up in each previous thread, along with accusations of racism. Both of which have proven unfounded. Now you're trying to argue the scale of fraud after it has been demonstrated that the numbers are skewed because DAs do not want to prosecute the crime, and that a bi-partisan group also stated that voter fraud is an issue.
"True the Vote" and the "Voter Integrity Project" are anything but a "bi-partisan group".
And once again you have missed what is actually important.
But Bartlett adds that neither the state nor any of the county boards have yet discovered someone who voted when they should not have as a result of the Voter Integrity Project's submission. Bartlett says he doesn't rule out the possibility it could happen, but he points out that election officials have access to Social Security numbers, birthdays and drivers license numbers that citizen groups cannot legally get. All of those pieces of information have been used to differentiate between those who are really dead and those who are expected to show up at the polls this November, he said.
"The takeaway so far is that our lists are pretty good," Bartlett said.
Would that be True The Vote that was targeted by the IRS?
Sure, and that's also "True the Vote" that has the tagline "If you see something at the polls that just doesn't seem right, record it." and was --surprise surprise--founded in Texas by a Tea Partier. Voter Integrity Project has the same ties to the Tea Party as well.
Oh, and congratulations. Your second link did nothing but prove that voter fraud convictions are so low because of serious hurdles to overcome, especially when non-citizens are having their illegally cast ballots protected. That and you ignored absolutely everything else that counters your argument.
No, I ignored everything unrelated to North Carolina. There's a difference.
Plus when you link from a source called "rottenacorn.com" about something relating to ACORN, it's kind of hard to take you seriously. It's like you are unable to sort the junk from the legitimate and keep going for the junk.
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whembly wrote: I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me how/why Voter ID is racist again...
Because context matters. The people who write these laws know perfectly well who they're targeting, this isn't just some abstract theory about how to run a fair election.
That's not answer... that's spin.
Why is it racistto have Voter ID laws?
Sure, you'd have a point that such laws is a change pre/post laws. Most folks are generally resistant to change and because of that *could* have some impact. But these are not onerous requirements.
So you ignore everything that does not relate to North Carolina and get upset that people aren't talking about North Carolina specifically..... but you feel the need to inject North Carolina into a discussion about Texas voter ID law
You may have missed the link that I specifically flagged as bi-partisan, not the two that you think I indicated were bi-partisan, so I'll let you go back and actually read my posts again to find it. At least you're honest enough to say that you just reject some posts out of turn just because you'd rather shoot the messenger rather than deal with the message.
Still waiting to hear how these free IDs are not free also
So, in case you missed it;
- no disenfranchisement of Texan voters
- increased turn out from Texan voters
- increased turnout from minorities under the Texan law
- little to no difficulty of providing required documents, including my Democrats who attempted to become martyrs to the cause
- voter fraud of all stripes is under reported, and many DAs refuse to prosecute it, which skews the figures tremendously
Isn’t the main argument against voted ID laws that people from minorities are less likely to be have a form of ID?
To be honest I’m not convinced by this argument, furthermore I think the suggestion that people from poorer backgrounds just won’t bother vote if they are asked to provide an ID is actually rather patronizing.
"And if we've learnt anything over the past 1000 mile retreat it's that Russian agriculture is in dire need of mechanisation!"
I had a problem voting in the last election as they had my name backwards on my voter ID and I didn't catch it. My last name is a common first name, and it was reversed.
I showed them my voter registration card and driver's license, they made a call to someone, and I got to vote.
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Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Maybe you should change your name to Knork
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Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
kronk wrote: I had a problem voting in the last election as they had my name backwards on my voter ID and I didn't catch it. My last name is a common first name, and it was reversed.
I showed them my voter registration card and driver's license, they made a call to someone, and I got to vote.
Its almost as if resolving a genuine mistake over a name when attempting to vote is not a difficult task
It was also easy to fix afterwards. I called them up and they said "You must have filled out the paper work incorrectly, but we'll look." Not 2 hours later, the same lady called me as said that they found my original paperwork and the mistake was theirs. I got a new voter registration card about a month later.
I added a picture above to make it easier for you to see the obvious.
Also, notice the bold part:
whembly wrote: I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me how/why Voter ID is racist again...
Good to see you finally realize you're just asking the same question over and over again despite getting what must at this point be hundreds of posts in reply.
But don't let me get in the way of your rally here. DEY TERK ER VOTES!
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I want to honestly see if they can find anyone who was not allowed to vote because of tthe ID problem. I used to be on the side of no ID voting, but this is compelling evidence, not enough to sawy me until we see it in other states to see if Texas is a phenomenon or not
Easy E wrote: Still, I think the core of my problem with the Voter ID laws is they are a solution looking for a problem.
We have an open border here.
Uh...what?
I can't see the thing he posted. I get the red X of doom. Maybe he's targetting me through the internetz for termination? Run!
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-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!