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2013/12/05 15:35:13
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
It's enough caliber to shoot the person you are with in the foot so that you can get away while he slows them down.
now thats executive thinking there.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/05 15:36:33
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2013/12/05 15:38:47
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
KalashnikovMarine wrote: It's clear it was a 9mm Parabellum. So more or less a mouse fart compared to a proper caliber like .45 ACP or .357 Magnum
Stand in front of one and say that.
I have a wall of 9mms, .45ACP and .44 special/Mag. I like the .45ACP but I can put 4 rounds into you at 7 yards with a 9mm with a carry pistol. try that with a .45ACP.
4 rounds at 7 yards with a .45? Man sized target? Frazz maybe you're going blind in your old age but that's not exactly difficult. If you can't dump a magazine into a man sized target at 10 yards with your sidearm... I worry for you.
4 rounds in a 6in diameter plate size.
Right. That is not exactly difficult shooting Frazz. Albeit I carry a full size 1911 cause Murrica.
Its not difficult with an ACP? Have you tried it or are you just full of gak?
4 rounds 1 second 6 in target .45 ACP 7 yards
EDIT: if so you're WAY better than your average police officer.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/05 16:16:30
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2013/12/05 17:11:00
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
You keep moving goal posts adding the time, I'd like to see four round in a second though, but four rounds rapid into a six inch disk at 7 yards? fething hell man.
Also being better then the average police officer is not exactly a mark of distinction for an individual in the same country as the LAPD and NYPD.
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
Im happy if i can keep my groupings at 7 yards to 3-4 inches when I take my time. I'm pretty positive I couldn't kepe them in 6 inches within a second.
2013/12/05 17:50:28
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
KalashnikovMarine wrote: You keep moving goal posts adding the time, I'd like to see four round in a second though, but four rounds rapid into a six inch disk at 7 yards? fething hell man.
Also being better then the average police officer is not exactly a mark of distinction for an individual in the same country as the LAPD and NYPD.
Sorry I thought I put the time in the original post. my bad.
For the record, I do see guys with 4 rounds from a .45ACP in 1 second at that distance. But those are competition guns and they are way better than poor me.
With a carry sized piece I'm probably 3 rounds in same because that 6.5 lb trigger slows me up.
Whayts fun though is scenarios where you're arms length. Thats pretty much as fast as you can pull the trigger. BANG BANG BANG BANG!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/05 17:53:12
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2013/12/05 17:57:55
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
Frazzled wrote: Sorry I thought I put the time in the original post. my bad.
For the record, I do see guys with 4 rounds from a .45ACP in 1 second at that distance. But those are competition guns and they are way better than poor me.
With a carry sized piece I'm probably 3 rounds in same because that 6.5 lb trigger slows me up.
Whayts fun though is scenarios where you're arms length. Thats pretty much as fast as you can pull the trigger. BANG BANG BANG BANG!
ToddG doing a Bill Drill in 1.98 with a stock (other than sights, I believe) HK45.
Most of us ain't anywhere near that good, though.
2013/12/05 18:09:15
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
KalashnikovMarine wrote:It's clear it was a 9mm Parabellum. So more or less a mouse fart compared to a proper caliber like .45 ACP or .357 Magnum
Honestly, the calibre isn't anywhere near as important in self-defense as the placement and control. You can call the 9mm a mouse fart all you like, but it's still going to blow through your sinus cavity and ruin your day in a hurry. Center mass, the .45 is definitely going to make a difference. But I'd rather use a calibre that I can consistently hit a small (head-sized) target with at 7 yards.
Frazzled wrote:Its not difficult with an ACP? Have you tried it or are you just full of gak?
4 rounds 1 second 6 in target .45 ACP 7 yards
EDIT: if so you're WAY better than your average police officer.
I *am* way better than your average police officer, and I'm not confident that I could do this consistently.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/12/05 18:09:34
2013/12/05 18:12:38
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
Well, back when I was shooting the regularly I think I could pull off one good shoot a second MAXIMUM. The blast would send that pistol over my head and the 13ish lb trigger pull was too much to be faster.
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2013/12/05 18:52:09
Subject: Re:Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
d-usa,
Without being able to read everything you've posted(gotta get to work!) you have missed one key thing regarding whether to engage, or not to.
Perception. The citizen who engaged the robber describes how he viewed the situation, guy had an employee on his knees with a gun to his head. In my eyes, without being there, that is an immediate threat to life. If he felt the same way, he had every right and reason to engage.
What I have read so far of your posts regarding this situation, I have agreed with. In the end its all about perception.
"You are judged in life, not by the evil you destroy, but by the light you bring to the darkness" - Reclusiarch Grimaldus of the Black Templars
2013/12/05 19:05:47
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
KalashnikovMarine wrote:It's clear it was a 9mm Parabellum. So more or less a mouse fart compared to a proper caliber like .45 ACP or .357 Magnum
Honestly, the calibre isn't anywhere near as important in self-defense as the placement and control. You can call the 9mm a mouse fart all you like, but it's still going to blow through your sinus cavity and ruin your day in a hurry. Center mass, the .45 is definitely going to make a difference. But I'd rather use a calibre that I can consistently hit a small (head-sized) target with at 7 yards.
Which would be the difference I suppose. I shoot center of mass like Momma Corps told me to. Missing head shots is easy, tearing bloody messy holes in vital organs is a more sure shot and easier to boot. At least as far as self defense goes. I know how the adrenaline dump works and I can't promise you I'd be able to hit headshots once the slight tremor sets in you know? gak's easy to compensate for in the rifle, but hand gun shooting? I dunno man. Especially since the goblin can and will be moving.
I also like how you got immediately butt hurt.
Range shooting hitting a head sized target at 7 yards? Come on man. Make it a challenge, can you regularly tag the T box on a man sized target at 7 yards?
I beg of you sarge let me lead the charge when the battle lines are drawn
Lemme at least leave a good hoof beat they'll remember loud and long
KalashnikovMarine wrote:It's clear it was a 9mm Parabellum. So more or less a mouse fart compared to a proper caliber like .45 ACP or .357 Magnum
Honestly, the calibre isn't anywhere near as important in self-defense as the placement and control. You can call the 9mm a mouse fart all you like, but it's still going to blow through your sinus cavity and ruin your day in a hurry. Center mass, the .45 is definitely going to make a difference. But I'd rather use a calibre that I can consistently hit a small (head-sized) target with at 7 yards.
Which would be the difference I suppose. I shoot center of mass like Momma Corps told me to. Missing head shots is easy, tearing bloody messy holes in vital organs is a more sure shot and easier to boot. At least as far as self defense goes. I know how the adrenaline dump works and I can't promise you I'd be able to hit headshots once the slight tremor sets in you know? gak's easy to compensate for in the rifle, but hand gun shooting? I dunno man. Especially since the goblin can and will be moving.
I also like how you got immediately butt hurt.
Funny how, for all our perceived differences between the Army and the Corps, we all shoot the "same" as I also aim strictly center mass while actually practicing (if I'm just blowing off rounds because range time is running short, I'll start playing with headshots, but usually not), as the way you practice is the way you'll do it for real, if that need ever arises.
I do like how the "fact" that the good guy here claims to have carried for 4 or so years with no incident/reason to draw until this came up. I've seen numerous people in this post claiming that CCW holders are wannabe cops and whatnot. But, the fact is, if this guy has been carrying as long as he had without ever having the need to use it, doesnt paint me a picture of a John Wayne type figure who is strolling into town lookin for somethin to shoot.
2013/12/05 19:30:02
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
"So, do please come along when we're promoting something new and need photos for the facebook page or to send to our regional manager, do please engage in our gaming when we're pushing something specific hard and need to get the little kiddies drifting past to want to come in an see what all the fuss is about. But otherwise, stay the feth out, you smelly, antisocial bastards, because we're scared you are going to say something that goes against our mantra of absolute devotion to the corporate motherland and we actually perceive any of you who've been gaming more than a year to be a hostile entity as you've been exposed to the internet and 'dangerous ideas'. " - MeanGreenStompa
"Then someone mentions Infinity and everyone ignores it because no one really plays it." - nkelsch
FREEDOM!!!
- d-usa
2013/12/05 19:30:43
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
That explains why I was terrible at CoD, I always went for center mass
All about the bonus points!
"So, do please come along when we're promoting something new and need photos for the facebook page or to send to our regional manager, do please engage in our gaming when we're pushing something specific hard and need to get the little kiddies drifting past to want to come in an see what all the fuss is about. But otherwise, stay the feth out, you smelly, antisocial bastards, because we're scared you are going to say something that goes against our mantra of absolute devotion to the corporate motherland and we actually perceive any of you who've been gaming more than a year to be a hostile entity as you've been exposed to the internet and 'dangerous ideas'. " - MeanGreenStompa
"Then someone mentions Infinity and everyone ignores it because no one really plays it." - nkelsch
FREEDOM!!!
- d-usa
2013/12/05 19:32:37
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
Ensis Ferrae wrote: Hence why I ALWAYS take a 240B or 249, or equivalent in those games
Never liked the CoD versions of those, but Battlefield 3 was a blast.
"So, do please come along when we're promoting something new and need photos for the facebook page or to send to our regional manager, do please engage in our gaming when we're pushing something specific hard and need to get the little kiddies drifting past to want to come in an see what all the fuss is about. But otherwise, stay the feth out, you smelly, antisocial bastards, because we're scared you are going to say something that goes against our mantra of absolute devotion to the corporate motherland and we actually perceive any of you who've been gaming more than a year to be a hostile entity as you've been exposed to the internet and 'dangerous ideas'. " - MeanGreenStompa
"Then someone mentions Infinity and everyone ignores it because no one really plays it." - nkelsch
FREEDOM!!!
- d-usa
2013/12/05 20:04:37
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
How else are you going to take down the Walkers????
-"Wait a minute.....who is that Frazz is talking to in the gallery? Hmmm something is going on here.....Oh.... it seems there is some dispute over video taping of some sort......Frazz is really upset now..........wait a minute......whats he go there.......is it? Can it be?....Frazz has just unleashed his hidden weiner dog from his mini bag, while quoting shakespeares "Let slip the dogs the war!!" GG
-"Don't mind Frazzled. He's just Dakka's crazy old dude locked in the attic. He's harmless. Mostly."
-TBone the Magnificent 1999-2014, Long Live the King!
2013/12/05 20:36:06
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
KalashnikovMarine wrote:It's clear it was a 9mm Parabellum. So more or less a mouse fart compared to a proper caliber like .45 ACP or .357 Magnum
Honestly, the calibre isn't anywhere near as important in self-defense as the placement and control. You can call the 9mm a mouse fart all you like, but it's still going to blow through your sinus cavity and ruin your day in a hurry. Center mass, the .45 is definitely going to make a difference. But I'd rather use a calibre that I can consistently hit a small (head-sized) target with at 7 yards.
Which would be the difference I suppose. I shoot center of mass like Momma Corps told me to. Missing head shots is easy, tearing bloody messy holes in vital organs is a more sure shot and easier to boot. At least as far as self defense goes. I know how the adrenaline dump works and I can't promise you I'd be able to hit headshots once the slight tremor sets in you know? gak's easy to compensate for in the rifle, but hand gun shooting? I dunno man. Especially since the goblin can and will be moving.
I also like how you got immediately butt hurt.
Range shooting hitting a head sized target at 7 yards? Come on man. Make it a challenge, can you regularly tag the T box on a man sized target at 7 yards?
I'm honestly not sure what part you thought sounded butthurt, and I sincerely hope you didn't interpret my use of the infinitive "you" to mean you specifically. I have no intention of getting defensive (punny!) here, because everyone should shoot what and how they are comfortable with. I'm only offering a counterpoint.
Anyway, yeah, with a 9mm I'm not going to miss often at 7 yards.
2013/12/06 04:53:57
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
Firehead158 wrote: Until you're actually trying to kill someone, while they are trying to kill you.
Bingo.
A lot of people haven't experienced trying to do tasks requiring manual dexterity under a true adrenaline dump.
That said, caliber wars are pretty pointless when you're using modern self-defense loads, but I also know better than to argue with a Marine about the .45 ACP.
2013/12/06 11:33:36
Subject: Good samaritan stops armed gunman, gunmans parents have interesting things to say about this.
! 
