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There's lots of terrain and fortifications that already help non-gunline armies.

You can, for instance, put an Aegis line anywhere on your table half, not just in your deployment zone, so line it up across midfield, move up to it on turn one and survive the alpha strike.

Smaller units can hide behind a Bastion, infiltrators can begin the game on top of a skyshield set up in the midfield.

I wonder if a simple solution wouldn't be to just say that you aren't slowed by your own fortifications? Your army is assumed to have it's own passages, ladders, doors, etc. in order to move freely beyond any fortifications you set up. This yields the LOS/cover advantages to an assaulting army without crippling their movement.

I guess it's a house rule kind of thing, but it would be a simple fix that does get to the meat of Ailero's issue.

I like the idea of offensive fortifications.

For the smoke example, call it an orbital bombardment. Your fortification is a ship in orbit. Or even make a smoke mortar weapon emplacement... picture a quad gun base with a mortar on top. You can shoot it like you do the quad gun. You fire down X amount of smoke clouds. Treat them as a large blast that scatters like everything else. Then once in a location, treat it like a forest, with say, a 4+ cover save. Anything in it, or being shot through it, gets a save.

Landmines would be tricky because you'd have to keep it secret and accurate like an infiltrator, or they'd be in the open on your half.

 deviantduck wrote:
I like the idea of offensive fortifications.

For the smoke example, call it an orbital bombardment. Your fortification is a ship in orbit. Or even make a smoke mortar weapon emplacement... picture a quad gun base with a mortar on top. You can shoot it like you do the quad gun. You fire down X amount of smoke clouds. Treat them as a large blast that scatters like everything else. Then once in a location, treat it like a forest, with say, a 4+ cover save. Anything in it, or being shot through it, gets a save.

Landmines would be tricky because you'd have to keep it secret and accurate like an infiltrator, or they'd be in the open on your half.

I always found it funny that they don't even have a rule for concealment instead of cover for smoke. plus a giant moving Land Raider popping smoke wouldn't really affect it's position from where it was spotted. Smoke is usually used to obscure movement of infantry or for signaling.

You obviously have never seen a modern battle tank throw up a smoke cover?

Naw wrote:
You obviously have never seen a modern battle tank throw up a smoke cover?

Yes I have but the smoke itself isn't actual cover but concealment. Smoke obscures the target making it a little harder to target but it is also a gigantic neon sign telling the enemy that something is going on/ people are moving,

Edit: Expounded on my statement.

Indeed. Smoke is not cover, it's concealment.

I'd love to see a huge ork catapult that throws boyz at the enemy! Let's say it can throw 15-20 models per turn, they alwayz scatter 2d6 or maybe 3d6 and each model takes a "harsh landing" test and dies on a 5+ without saves of any kind. The turn they land - they can't shoot but must run straight forward represinting them rolling over from the landing impulse remaining. Well, i don't know about precise rules and how useful it might be but it'd be great to have a boy'z launcha!

If we're in for a more realistic approach - smth like a teleport marker would be great for someone that uses mass deepstriking. Otherwise, i don't see any terrain that can buff an assault force more than harm it - cept for a huge los-blocker midfield. But all that no-los weapons screw such attemts

 Swastakowey wrote:

 ansacs wrote:
If they just let you buy a bunch of 4"+ flat vertical boards and put them anywhere to block LoS that alone would be huge. ~3" tall tunnels would be awesome...actually those would be similar to the IG trenches which I think have been insinuated as being a part of this.

I purchased a trench line puzzle type system a while back and we played it like it was the tunnels of a space hulk. Absolute carnage. The congestion and limited firing halls etc was crazy. Might do that again some time actually.

I played in an in store mega battle for the 3rd war of Armageddon that still to this day is the most fun battle I have ever participated in. Me and my best bud, both space marine players had our 1000pt each troops and walkers only army fighting 2 Eldar armies on a space hulk board that represented the sewers of a city, the winners had a chance for their army to 'pop' out of the sewers on the main game board. The firing lanes were unreal killing zones in the sewers, it just ended up my captain and assault squad and my buds emps champion and decimated crusador squad vs a wraith lord, seer council and howling banshees in combat in the center chamber on turn 3 or 4, somehow my captain was the only thing to come out alive after some very lucky iron halo saves and slaying the wraithlord. He climbed out of the sewers right by a warboss and knobs, he charged and again was lucky to hold them up long enough for a death company to roll in on them... Genuinely such an epic game....

I suggest to anyone to play a game in space hulk corridors, so so so much fun, even in 6th.

It is fairly easy t make terrain that is close combat oriented. Heck, a lot of wha is already produced is very helpful to non-gunline armies if placed correctly. Set up in a deployment zone with a wide open field in front of it, it is geared towards gunlines. Seup in the field out of the deployment zone where it provides cover and blocks LOS, it favors the nongunne army.

You can also buy some foamboard and build yourself some rock outcroppings that block LOS. take a look at some Grand Canyon pictures for ideas on ways to make it look cool and go to town on it.

I'd love it if I could get some of the tunnel systems from the old apoc book or cities of death.

How I would love for it to work is:

1. ANY unit (friend or foe) can move through it, but enemy units, Including desperate/convenient allies, would need to roll a special difficult terrain test, one that specifically disallows move through cover.
2. Allows the unit to move from point A to point B at the same speed as a transport, and possibly allow upgrades to allow for "assault vehicle" versions of it.
3. The entrances could be some sort of low-lying building, either AV or have it be quasi-artillery. Targetable, but once destroyed you can still exit through difficult/dangerous terrain, which once again disallows move through cover.
4. Every 6-12" (depending on starting length) would count as its own "building" for assault purposes. Each counting as a medium building for # of models allowed.

have the basic cost be the same as a basic ADL, with things like "assault exits" and booby traps, and multiple exits being upgrades, and not necessarily mutually exclusive. For deployment, the entrance would have to be in the purchaser's deployment zone, and the exit can be 18-24-36" away.

Profile wise something like:

Tunnel System [50?] points:
* 2x [AV12] / [T7 | 3w | 3+ Sv], one an Entrance, one an Exit.
*24" Separation at most, Entrance must be in your deployment zone.

Upgrades:
* Assault exit : allows the Exit(s) to be counted as an assault vehicle [35?] pts
* Booby Traps: enemy units entering each [6?]" section count it as dangerous terrain as well, which fails on 1-2 [5?] pts per section
* Multiple exits : Adds an additional exit [25?] pts/exit, to a total maximum of [4?]


Edit: Forgot building size..derp

I would love underground exits. You take a certain number of small buildings that can be placed anywhere on the battlefield. From these buildings you can exit turn 1 unless the building is destroyed. It would be like turn 1 genestealers for everybody.

koooaei wrote:
I'd love to see a huge ork catapult that throws boyz at the enemy! Let's say it can throw 15-20 models per turn, they alwayz scatter 2d6 or maybe 3d6 and each model takes a "harsh landing" test and dies on a 5+ without saves of any kind. The turn they land - they can't shoot but must run straight forward represinting them rolling over from the landing impulse remaining. Well, i don't know about precise rules and how useful it might be but it'd be great to have a boy'z launcha!

If we're in for a more realistic approach - smth like a teleport marker would be great for someone that uses mass deepstriking. Otherwise, i don't see any terrain that can buff an assault force more than harm it - cept for a huge los-blocker midfield. But all that no-los weapons screw such attemts

I was actually going to suggest a giant slingshot that doubled your movement rate that turn if you started within 6" of it or something. I think it would be fun.

We had an accelerator in the 40k mod we had for tribes. Worked very well in that, having a tabletop version of it would be cool. Especially if it had the possibile side effects we had in Tribes (hiting things along the way if not perfectly positioned, accelerating upwards instead or straight across ec).

I think the 'Escape Hatch' building upgrade in Stronghold Assault is really cool, and somewhere along the lines of these ideas. I think game clubs could put such examples to task in making custom terrain and the rules to go with them.

Fortifications that can deep strike would be cool for Tyranids. For example, a structure that bursts from the ground and starts spawning Gaunts like a Tervigon.

Or Caterpillary towers that give shrouded to all nearby Tyranid units and create dangerous terrain around its base for all other units.