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For those of you who own both the Apocalypse and Escalation books: are there significant differences in the unit entries between the two books? I understand they converted structure points to hull points, but is it a straight 3:1 ratio? Have they made any other changes (points costs, weapon profiles, etc.) that would preclude me from simply using the apoc book for Escalation games?

I'd rather purchase a 300 page book at $75 than a 100 page book at $50 if the content is nearly identical.

Basically a couple of new gacky formations and units in escalation, 1 or 2 new scenarios and some vague fluff.

Nothing like what was promised.

If you're talking about the recent Apoc book, then yes, the units are about the same. However, you seem to have an older edition of Apoc that still uses Structure Points. There may have been some changes to some of the units within. For example, the Revenant lost the Agile rule but now, it can move 36" and still fire instead. The Cobra has lost its Barrage status and it's blast has been reduced from 10" to 7". There are also a lot of changes in the Points costs of most units. There may be other changes as well, but I haven't checked myself.

 jy2 wrote:
If you're talking about the recent Apoc book, then yes, the units are about the same. However, you seem to have an older edition of Apoc that still uses Structure Points. There may have been some changes to some of the units within. For example, the Revenant lost the Agile rule but now, it can move 36" and still fire instead. The Cobra has lost its Barrage status and it's blast has been reduced from 10" to 7". There are also a lot of changes in the Points costs of most units. There may be other changes as well, but I haven't checked myself.

My bad, didn't realize that they had completely done away with SPs with the 6th Edition Apoc book Yeah I was referring to the differences between the most recent edition of Apoc and Escalation. Would be nice if there are no significant changes!

Apoc has a lot more units than escalation, it also has the formations if you're interested in those (not many of them are useful). It also has rules for stratagems.

Escalation basically plucked a smattering of datasheets out, cut out some options like Commissariat Crew and Command Tank, slapped on a warlord table and missions, and called it a day.

 GreyHamster wrote:
Escalation basically plucked a smattering of datasheets out, cut out some options like Commissariat Crew and Command Tank, slapped on a warlord table and missions, and called it a day.

That's the impression I sorta got. Sounds better to just spend a few extra bucks and get Apocalypse. Thanks for the info, fellas

 jy2 wrote:
If you're talking about the recent Apoc book, then yes, the units are about the same. However, you seem to have an older edition of Apoc that still uses Structure Points. There may have been some changes to some of the units within. For example, the Revenant lost the Agile rule but now, it can move 36" and still fire instead. The Cobra has lost its Barrage status and it's blast has been reduced from 10" to 7". There are also a lot of changes in the Points costs of most units. There may be other changes as well, but I haven't checked myself.

Actually, the Rev still has Agile. I can see it in my copy of Escalation.

I am to believe they nerfed D weapons in escalation.

 sing your life wrote:
I am to believe they nerfed D weapons in escalation.

That'd be incorrect. They should have but did not.

 sing your life wrote:
I am to believe they nerfed D weapons in escalation.

Nope. Copy paste from the current Apoc book, where, imo, Titan Killers are much stronger. You could take saves before. Now you can't.

Which is odd, because during 5th ed GW tried to get rid of anything that could ignore invuls.

I mean, it's called an "invulnerable" save, not an "almost invulnerable" save.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 sing your life wrote:
I am to believe they nerfed D weapons in escalation.

Nope. Copy paste from the current Apoc book, where, imo, Titan Killers are much stronger. You could take saves before. Now you can't.

Which is odd, because during 5th ed GW tried to get rid of anything that could ignore invuls.

I mean, it's called an "invulnerable" save, not an "almost invulnerable" save.

Well they probably did play testing and got butt hurt over 2++ screamer stars and Hammernators. When apoc came out and i saw what the destroyer weapons looked like, i was crushed. They reduced it to how many Ds you could place on the board and who would go first. I was hoping to run a massive group of hammernators since i have some of the models for that formation. Now they have that stupidity that is current D weapons in regular 40k. I guess I'm reduced to waiting a year to get a thunderhawk in order to have any chance of doing OK.

So if say I wanted to get into apoc do I just buy the new book or do I still have to buy the imperial armor books too?

 wowsmash wrote:
So if say I wanted to get into apoc do I just buy the new book or do I still have to buy the imperial armor books too?

It depends on what you want to field. Some FW units are in the Apoc book, some aren't.

Apocalypse has far more complicated rules for the game aside from the models themselves, Escalation is more simplified for quicker gaming

Apoc has no force org and more formations. Escalation has force org, and limited formations.

FW just released an FAQ about which of their models can also be used in escalation, which was pretty much everything.

I was initially apposed to escalation, but after the forgeworld update - I've changed my mind a bit

Apoc has a lot of other rules that make it a lot of fun.

Everything form the finest hour to the planet literally breaking apart during a battle.

The most important thing when playing apoc to remember is this: models are supposed to die....do not try to min/max anything - its about having fun and blowing stuff up.

If you are trying to run a "killer" anything - you will be very upset
when your uber deathstar is erased from the board in a single turn from a vortex grenade.

Its not uncommon for a thousand points of models to be removed in a single shooting event.

but its totally epic!