Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I'm curious what others look for when deciding on a new army, like what factors you consider. I've always been a big fan of the fluff/lore behind the universe, and I've always preferred to stay true to army themes (versus going with FOTM cheese lists, for instance) when choosing a list, even if I end up taking "bad" units as long as it represents a realistic army on the tabletop.

Since I've come back to the game I went with the old standby of Space Marines, but I'm thinking for the future I'll want something else as I've never been that thrilled with Loyalist marines, or having to come up with contrived fluff reasons why they would fight other Imperial forces (I know it can happen, but it's generally rare in the lore outside of actual secession a la the Badab War). The problem, of course, is deciding what that other army should be :p

Personally when I consider an army I want the following:

* Good fluff, preferably with background resources available to "get into" the army
* Allows for customization of the army background (naming characters/squads, coming up with a history, etc)
* Not that difficult to paint as a beginner, but detailed enough to allow for improvement and conversions
* Has lore reasons to fight any opponents, including the same faction, without resorting to "It's a training simulation" type of hand-waving
* Competitive without being anti-fun, preferably without resorting to min/maxed troops and maxed out heavies and/or cheese lists

Which army, if any, matches that criteria? Just from brainstorming, Chaos seems to fit nicely as you can have a themed warband but even the most rigid Chaos warbands can fight each other over disagreements that turn violent, and Chaos hates everyone.

I think you just described Orks my friend.

* Good fluff, preferably with background resources available to "get into" the army
Great fluff and historical battles. Also several clans to choose from with various fighting methods. Or make your own! I myself have a theif army of orks that prefer vehicles and stealing.
* Allows for customization of the army background (naming characters/squads, coming up with a history, etc)
Oh yea, as listed above. You can name your Waaagh whatever you want.
* Not that difficult to paint as a beginner, but detailed enough to allow for improvement and conversions
Painting boyz is pretty basic, but they have tons of conversion possibilities. Probably more conversion opportunities than any other army, and they can be painted down to the tooth and snot, or just washed over to give it a dirty, grimy feel.
* Has lore reasons to fight any opponents, including the same faction, without resorting to "It's a training simulation" type of hand-waving
Orks will fight anyone. Either for the teeth and gold, or just for the fight. You dont have to worry why orks would fight anyone really. And they have a history of allying with almost anyone to take on a larger threat.
* Competitive without being anti-fun, preferably without resorting to min/maxed troops and maxed out heavies and/or cheese lists
They have some very fun lists with all the random rolls, but they also have some very strong units and builds that have been known to place in tournaments. Maybe not top-tier, but also a lot more fun and variable than some of those single-build armies.

Perhaps but Orks have one major (IMO) downside: Tends to be VERY expensive due to the sheer number of models you need to field and the ever-inflating price of GW miniatures :(

Meh, you don't have to run a hordes, footslog list. I run a pretty decent army at 1500 points with only 40 boyz.

But if you are looking for smaller, elite units, then you can go with the bikernob unit, or mega-armored Nobs.

They do have one of the better Battleforces out there as well. Getting a couple of those would put you on the start to a good army.

Oops twin linked post darn interwebs

WayneTheGame wrote:
Perhaps but Orks have one major (IMO) downside: Tends to be VERY expensive due to the sheer number of models you need to field and the ever-inflating price of GW miniatures :(

Ugh, this is the only reason I haven't started a Steel Legion army. 35 bucks per squad, 35 bucks per chimera, it starts getting expensive before I even get enough for a 500 point game!

 robam45 wrote:

WayneTheGame wrote:
Perhaps but Orks have one major (IMO) downside: Tends to be VERY expensive due to the sheer number of models you need to field and the ever-inflating price of GW miniatures :(

Ugh, this is the only reason I haven't started a Steel Legion army. 35 bucks per squad, 35 bucks per chimera, it starts getting expensive before I even get enough for a 500 point game!

Tell me about it... when I last played it was like $25 I think for a Tactical Squad and now it's almost doubly for roughly the same quality.

Granted that probably doesn't factor in inflation, there is still much truth to that.

For you: Eldar fit all but ease of painting, DE are similar to Eldar although struggling in comparison to not just shelf, Chaos Daemon fluff is neutered and forces you to go one or a combination of the 4 gods, Orks fit all of your categories although to be decent they tend to have to rely on loota spam and are not a cheap army. Still, they are likely about to get an update so you could get some boys before the inflation and then have a new book. IG also suffer from being pricy whilst more difficult to paint (unless you go mechanized) but suffer a bit from fighting Imperial factions although you could simply explain fighting other guard as traitors or even your guys are a planet rebelling as the Inquisition tries to send all to kill you. CSM are great for all but spammy. For the most part, you will be deploying 3 single Oblits and relying on either spawn, bikers, or heldrakes as well as fully kitted out chaos lords. I will warn you though, it is one of the worst codices currently that makes it difficult to really deploy something with most of the units being traps and one of the four marks being unplayable unless you like spending 100+ points on something relatively worthless.

Definitely a shame to hear that about Chaos; I know that's partially why I went with regular Marines (also the new Codex) even though I've always preferred Chaos; it seems the trend of "new Codex is OP, older Codexes are crap" hasn't changed in 10 years

WayneTheGame wrote:
Definitely a shame to hear that about Chaos; I know that's partially why I went with regular Marines (also the new Codex) even though I've always preferred Chaos; it seems the trend of "new Codex is OP, older Codexes are crap" hasn't changed in 10 years

A lot of chaos players I know of have left for HH to deploy their legions and others have used loyalist codices to better represent their army. Actually, it isn't perfect, but vanilla SM are always a middling army, you could easily use the loyalist codex to represent a recently fallen army of chaos. Kinda combine chaos kits and SM kits. Want them to go daemonic? Warp everything mwahahaha! Want them to be more like a extreme faction of Marines that want to save the Imperium but by way of forceful change for the better of the Imperium. If you want some hints perhaps have some Tzeentchian icons (increased rate of librarians as well) such as birds, fish, eyes, dragons biting their own tail, persian and egyptian themes, irraxescent and scintillwting armor, increased rate of mutations. Or perhaps they are pirate marines? They exist in the fluff of CSM at least. Also keep in mind I warn you of these things all the while having an army of at least 4000 points of KYOS! If the army is still appealing, go for it. The mark of Nurgle can represent cybernetics or one that has suffered many mutations. This method isn't perfect and you will still have things like the Tzeentch sorcerer is the worst CSM sorcerer but it can work. I have about 14 pages of my own personal CSM fluff awash with a mess of devotions and idealologies. You can have them be antiheroes, heroes that descend, or just plane villains from the getgo. When you play them, you will be deploying SM-1 but darn it we are chaos! We are the warriors of change, hope, ambition, madness, insanity, intrigue, betrayal, fury, wrath. We are the misfits that have banded together and have as many different beliefs and goals as stars in the sky! Expand the warp devoting yourself to chaos, use chaos to your own benefit, or resist it and some goal I have not listed. Strive, achieve, accomplish. The skies are the limit! As long as you have ambition and some luck anyhing is possible. Defy logic! Destroy fate! Even become immortal! We are chaos for better or worse. We are unbound from the petty restrictions of the decaying Imperium. For Tzeentch! For Nurgle! For Slaanesh! For Khorne! We are the warriors of a thousand colors and the knights of the mirror.

That or a Xenos faction works fine


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh anyways how I pick my faction...
1. Fluff! If I can't become motivated by the fluff, I can't make an army. The game is a unbalanced mess but the world has such atmosphere. For me, I like the concept for Necrons but dislike the execution and just cannot put my heart into it. For another example, Tau. I liked their concept but just couldn't get into them despite the Orwellian hintings and their utter disgust of close combat (I am an assault player at heart. I like close combat, pistols, flamers, and meltas) but Farsight is a tau I can get behind! Speaking of which, if you are willing to go for far sight, suits can be easy but can also show skill. You can build a list without much effort and not be going all super cheese and it provides a unique play style. Also it is an army that makes sense to fight everybody including other Tau.
2. Some sort of theme that makes them unique. In other words, what have I not done. Currently I have CSM, CD, and IG as well as the WIP armies of SM and Inquisition. I need something to make them different. CSM? Well they were my fist army
Chaos Daemons? The close combat army that defies logic and breaks the mortal mind also very MC and foot logging but fast. IG? Tanks! SM? Drop Pods! Now, eventually all the armies spread from the original theme but I need that first push.

Those are my main two factors.

First and foremost I have to like the look, if the models don't look good, I won't enjoy owning them.
Second I have to like the fluff. Without fluff, we are just playing toy soldiers.
Third, I have to have something different. I don't believe I would ever own 2 space marine armies.

An example is when I started 6th, having played SW and daemons in 5th, but sold both of them. I looked to chaos space marines, thinking they had a little of both worlds. When I read the codex and tried them out, I found that it was not chaotic enough for me, and felt a little too close to space wolves, so I ditched them when Daemons came out. Now I am much happier!

before now, it was always based on what i think looked cool (and i could make look cooler) and what I could afford. I have always been able to come up with fluff and color schemes/imagery.

Now it is the same as before except that I also take into consideration what could work well, when mixed with my current armies (for example, my radical knights (grey) and my marines have the exact same color scheme and vehicles like razorbacks and land raiders are interchagable.

WayneTheGame wrote:
Perhaps but Orks have one major (IMO) downside: Tends to be VERY expensive due to the sheer number of models you need to field and the ever-inflating price of GW miniatures :(

If you aren't bothered about using official gw models, mantic's marauders range make great alternatives for a fraction of the cost. Certainly for the big mobs of boyz anyway.

http://www.manticgames.com/mantic-shop/warpath/marauders.html

I started in this hobby with Tyranids because I just loved how they looked. Got the codex, the starter set and any book that featured them. Which turned out to be none.

I then started collecting Imperial Guard because the conversion options there were endless and there was plenty of books about them. Grabbed up some sisters of battle stuff to ally in with them over time.

Now I am starting a Dark Eldar army because while bored one month I was reading all the codexes and I fell in love with their lore. I had always assumed they were just evil space elves (which is still kinda true), but it takes it to such a grimdark extreme that I had to build an army.

Fluff and fun tricks, gotta love an army that has some shiny tricks hidden up their sleeve, kinda why i want to start necrons

When selecting miniatures for an army, my first criteria used for choosing one is whether I like enough of the models to bother starting that army.

The second is (due to storage limitations) whether I like that army MORE than one I already have and don't want to get rid of.

Generally, if it passes #1, it fails #2.

There hasn't been any miniatures company in the last 30 years where the entire army range has been one I liked. Where I do like enough of them, the army then gets made up of ONLY those units.

Uniqueness, dakka, specialty, and awesomeness, and thus the guard was born!

How I picked factions was how the models looked. I REALLY loved the look of Ork stuff, so I went Orks! I really like the look of Tau and Eldar AND Necrons though, so I don't know what to get next. I also avoid terrible armies like the plague.