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 scarletsquig wrote:
I recall Mantic saying that the retail format for the boxes will be 8 players + 2 prones, so I'd expect it'll be highly likely to see some stretch goals to sort out that side of thing in the last few days.

They also have Keepers planned I don't see them doing them separately for retail as they are trying to cut down on individual blisters and DBX won't have boosters so the final team may be 8 players, 2 prones and a keeper.

Still a lot of MVPs alright, Hobgoblin MVP, 2 other Season 6 team MVPs the refbot MVP, 1 looks human, 1 just wants a hug, 1 is bizarre! the game has a lot of MVPs now.

But anyone who drops a earlier frenzy pledge will see it snapped up immediately.. I kind of assumed they were going to do it anyway so I'm not bothered personally. Hurt feelings aside, I think anything that keeps the total moving forward is for the good of the project and backers in general, though I understand the other side of it.

Shame about season 7 being unlikely, that really would have put Frenzy over the top. (If Squig is pessimistic about season 7, that's not a good sign.) I'm hoping Mantic will have a few tricks up their sleeves this weekend to ramp things up, besides what we already know is coming. (Although I am very curious about what the 4th Giant is going to be, now that we know it won't be a Marauder Hulk.)

I'm not sure about how my family would take Dreadball Xtreme. My son thinks the name is stupid, which made me laugh, but otherwise he hasn't expressed much interest. The thing is, while I think Deadzone is inherently more interesting to them as it is for Tamburlaine's family, Dreadball might be better for casual games. There's no line of sight rules, and the board configurations are much easier to set up.

This is a weird Mantic KS for me: I could really see pledging $1, Rampage, or Frenzy*, depending on how things go at the end.

*Yep, I'm considering it now. It's not worth it to me yet, but might get there by Sunday.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 porkuslime wrote:
I am sad to report that according to my latest Mantic Newsletter..

the Frenzy pledge level was NOT as limited as originally determined.. they have opened up 35 more Frenzy spots.

Kinda wish they had stuck to their limited decision..

-P

What? Why? You hate people getting a deal?

I found it annoying as well - not at all because I hate people getting a deal, but because it's another "Mantic - full of gak" moment as they desperately and transparently try to game us to manipulate the Kickstarter numbers. - And because I resent the attempt to "mine cart" the Frenzy pledge levels.

I'm just not feeling this campaign. I think I will pull my pledge at the end. I'd rather use the money for the Journey: Wrath of Demons PM, where all the models are gorgeous.

 highlord tamburlaine wrote:
I assumed that med bot was some sort of machine built for something else that just got put into service on the pitch.

With Deadzone zombies popping up, makes me wonder if we'll see any other DZ stuff.

Unfortunately at this point that's about the only way they're going to get me to stay.

Try as I might, I cannot convince anyone in my family to want to sit down and play. They're not interested in tabletop sports, and when I try to push the bit of the ultraviolence angle, they'd all rather just throw down in a real battle instead

A shame, since there's so much neat stuff on offer here I hate to buy it all and have it just collect dust. I've already go enough games that are already doing that for free!

If you do not physically have the game, I wouldn't count out getting people to play this game.

As far as miniature games go, I've gotten nerds, jocks, goths, preps, emo, kids, adults, brothers, sisters, parents.......this game runs the table on "wide appeal" once folks see it. That thing that helps is seeing lots of humans on the pitch for the folks less into Fantasy and Sci-Fi. But they'll quickly warm up to it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Azazelx wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 porkuslime wrote:
I am sad to report that according to my latest Mantic Newsletter..

the Frenzy pledge level was NOT as limited as originally determined.. they have opened up 35 more Frenzy spots.

Kinda wish they had stuck to their limited decision..

-P

What? Why? You hate people getting a deal?

I found it annoying as well - not at all because I hate people getting a deal, but because it's another "Mantic - full of gak" moment as they desperately and transparently try to game us to manipulate the Kickstarter numbers. - And because I resent the attempt to "mine cart" the Frenzy pledge levels.

I'm just not feeling this campaign. I think I will pull my pledge at the end. I'd rather use the money for the Journey: Wrath of Demons PM, where all the models are gorgeous.

Because the better business decision is to let the KS stall out like it was and be happy stopping at Season 5

Earth Dragon wrote:
That thing that helps is seeing lots of humans on the pitch for the folks less into Fantasy and Sci-Fi.

Then why is there only one human team?

Well if someone here can catch it, just letting you know i'll be dropping a $350 Frenzy in about five minutes.

It isn't a no confidence vote... I just worked it out that i'll be exchanging some of my pay for Deadzone with a Frenzy Pledge. :-)

 AlexHolker wrote:

Earth Dragon wrote:
That thing that helps is seeing lots of humans on the pitch for the folks less into Fantasy and Sci-Fi.

Then why is there only one human team?

Technically there is three. But straight up there is two

And there is not much more you would get from having multiple sets of human figures. It works fine having two rule sets for them. The rules show the contrast between the different races. You and your buddies are to play out the contrast within a race.

There really is no reason to be adding a bunch of humans teams into the mix. Maybe there is room for a another guard heavy template, but the models they have now would work just fine.

3? I count 2 and both are Corporation so they could be classified as 1 - Trontek and Void Sirens and Trontek could be anything under the armour (I know they are humans just saying) only the Void Sirens are clearly human. Convicts are mix raced including some humans but also other races.

 Azazelx wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 porkuslime wrote:
I am sad to report that according to my latest Mantic Newsletter..

the Frenzy pledge level was NOT as limited as originally determined.. they have opened up 35 more Frenzy spots.

Kinda wish they had stuck to their limited decision..

-P

What? Why? You hate people getting a deal?

I found it annoying as well - not at all because I hate people getting a deal, but because it's another "Mantic - full of gak" moment as they desperately and transparently try to game us to manipulate the Kickstarter numbers. - And because I resent the attempt to "mine cart" the Frenzy pledge levels.

I'm just not feeling this campaign. I think I will pull my pledge at the end. I'd rather use the money for the Journey: Wrath of Demons PM, where all the models are gorgeous.

Yes!



It really isn't a Kickstarter until Azazelx threatens to pull his pledge!

He asked why is there only one human team, and there are three teams/templates with humans on the roster.

There was nothing facetious about Frenzy, the first one was even named Frenzy 1, it was obvious there would be others, and the new one costs more.

Yeah, in saying that though, perhaps people would have been happier if they had increased the gap a bit. Saying a whole £6 isn't enough to stop someone dropping down a pledge level if they're feeling antzy.

Earth Dragon wrote:


Because the better business decision is to let the KS stall out like it was and be happy stopping at Season 5

You're right. When given the choices of lying to your customers/potential customers or making less money, the best option is always to lie.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Alpharius wrote:

Yes!



It really isn't a Kickstarter until Azazelx threatens to pull his pledge!

You haven't been paying attention, have you?

I'm even italicising it each time I threaten to pull my pledge.

Whatever man. Get all pissy if you want. People were sending Mantic e-mails complaining about the folks posting in the comments section about how they had two accounts and were sitting on both EBs, effectively locking them out from grabbing a frenzy, which they made the deadline for.

So it's okay for the customers to game the system and screw us all over but it isn't okay for Mantic to adjust the plan so we get more freebies by breaking more goals and increasing the total and giving what customers are begging for?

I hope you don't run a company

I wondered what all that beeping was that woke me up, it was my Azazel pledge pull counter going off like a maniac.

Earth Dragon wrote:
Whatever man. Get all pissy if you want. People were sending Mantic e-mails complaining about the folks posting in the comments section about how they had two accounts and were sitting on both EBs, effectively locking them out from grabbing a frenzy, which they made the deadline for.

So it's okay for the customers to game the system and screw us all over but it isn't okay for Mantic to adjust the plan so we get more freebies by breaking more goals and increasing the total and giving what customers are begging for?

I hope you don't run a company

Whatever, mate. Get all White Knight and ride on Mantic's lap if you want. (see? I can be a dick, too!)

They designed the system in such a way that the best thing to do for any customer was to game the system in that way. When Scarletsquig is recommending that the best thing for customers to do was to sit on two pledges from almost day 1, and we all predicted the big backslide (that's still going to happen in the next couple of days as people drop one or the other) then Mantic's not doing something right.

If you think it's totally cool to have acted the way they have, then more power to you and feel free to give them as much cash as you like. I'm not so keen, as I find it to be pretty dishonest and I dislike such transparent manipulation. I also dislike the Mine Carting and price bumps with each level, but then, all it does is make me less likely to jump on board for more sub-par figures that I'll never use. Especially when there's new GW stuff from the past few months to catch up on.

By the way, I'm actually quite cool on the whole thing, rather than upset - in case that doesn't come across in my tone. I'm much more "don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining" than "THIS IS THE OUTRAEG!" about the whole thing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Yonan wrote:
I wondered what all that beeping was that woke me up, it was my Azazel pledge pull counter going off like a maniac.

Well, it was only one. The one in reply to Alph was just like a drill to show him what the alarm looks like, since he was apparently sleeping through the previous ones.

 Azazelx wrote:

Earth Dragon wrote:
Whatever man. Get all pissy if you want. People were sending Mantic e-mails complaining about the folks posting in the comments section about how they had two accounts and were sitting on both EBs, effectively locking them out from grabbing a frenzy, which they made the deadline for.

So it's okay for the customers to game the system and screw us all over but it isn't okay for Mantic to adjust the plan so we get more freebies by breaking more goals and increasing the total and giving what customers are begging for?

I hope you don't run a company

Whatever, mate. Get all White Knight and ride on Mantic's lap if you want. (see? I can be a dick, too!)

They designed the system in such a way that the best thing to do for any customer was to game the system in that way. When Scarletsquig is recommending that the best thing for customers to do was to sit on two pledges from almost day 1, and we all predicted the big backslide (that's still going to happen in the next couple of days as people drop one or the other) then Mantic's not doing something right.

If you think it's totally cool to have acted the way they have, then more power to you and feel free to give them as much cash as you like. I'm not so keen, as I find it to be pretty dishonest and I dislike such transparent manipulation. I also dislike the Mine Carting and price bumps with each level, but then, all it does is make me less likely to jump on board for more sub-par figures that I'll never use. Especially when there's new GW stuff from the past few months to catch up on.

By the way, I'm actually quite cool on the whole thing, rather than upset - in case that doesn't come across in my tone. I'm much more "don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining" than "THIS IS THE OUTRAEG!" about the whole thing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Yonan wrote:
I wondered what all that beeping was that woke me up, it was my Azazel pledge pull counter going off like a maniac.

Well, it was only one. The one in reply to Alph was just like a drill to show him what the alarm looks like, since he was apparently sleeping through the previous ones.

You are putting "We didn't dump toxic chemicals into the river" when in fact they did with "you have until this time to get this deal" and the when people beg and the business isn't going as well they say "okay, but you'll have to pay slightly more".

Scarletsquig is not Mantic or a rep. And so they should be allowed to adjust the plan because fanboys are doing something and suggesting things that are boxing out potential customers.

I criticize Mantic plenty so don't act like I'm riding their lap, but you sit there with your nose in the air and do nothing but troll acting like making smart business decisions because the situation has change is a crime against you personally when it does nothing but benefit you and want you're pledge can give you.

Earth Dragon wrote:
He asked why is there only one human team, and there are three teams/templates with humans on the roster.

Actually, I was thinking specifically of Xtreme, where humans only play one role on one team, despite this being a human sport played in human cities. They should have gotten rid of the zombies and given the humans at least one real team.

Earth Dragon wrote:

You are putting "We didn't dump toxic chemicals into the river" when in fact they did with "you until this time to get this deal" and the when people beg and the business isn't going as well they say "okay, but you'll have to pay slightly more"

I criticize Mantic plenty, but you sit there with your nose in the air and do nothing but troll acting like making smart business decisions because the situation has change is a crime against you personally.

Mate, you're getting way too bent out of shape about this. I think they're being dishonest and manipulative and somewhat insulting to our intelligence. You think it's ferpectly fine do act as they are. I assumed you were a bit more on the ball, though. Smart business decisions because the situation has changed? Really? You think the "situation has changed"? The "limiting" of Frenzy, than closing it by a certain date, then reopening the pledge level three days later at a higher price is as transparent as these things come. Maybe you should take a walk to cool off and just think about that for a minute when you get back. it's as fake as any stretch goal has been.

And like I said, they set themselves up for pledge camping (and like I said, it's still going to bite them in the arse). Kickstarter has become a meta game for companies like Mantic. If they want to play vs the customers in KS, they get played right back. And back and forth it goes.

Oh yeah. Sharing an opinion with legitimate points to back it up is a pretty far from trolling. Don't resort to trying to strawman my points and opinions as "trolling" just because you don't agree, and your snide remarks are getting a bit tiresome. Rule #1 and all that.

I admit it, I muted it!

Did I miss all the "Fake Stretch Goals" talk too?!?

 AlexHolker wrote:

Earth Dragon wrote:
He asked why is there only one human team, and there are three teams/templates with humans on the roster.

Actually, I was thinking specifically of Xtreme, where humans only play one role on one team, despite this being a human sport played in human cities. They should have gotten rid of the zombies and given the humans at least one real team.

I guess real humans of any talent tend to play in the big leagues, fluffwise? They could have another set of human players/another human team, but they'd need to pretty much be the same as the ones in the original game for balance porpoises - yet they'd need to represent the guys who work down at the (space) docks in their off-hours. I guess the inherent problem is game balance. Despite these being "outer rim" and "prison" teams, the game needs to remain balanced between the teams regardless of fluff. Else it'd play like the Miami Heat going up against the Birmingham Knights or Melbourne Tigers.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Alpharius wrote:
I admit it, I muted it!

Did I miss all the "Fake Stretch Goals" talk too?!?

I haven't been flying that particular flag this time, though I made a snarky reference to it once while mentioning that I decided to give that argument a rest this campaign. Others have taken up that mantle, though - so not all is lost!

I think there's ample opportunity to convert your own human teams to use with non-human rules. I'll do more than one Eisenkern striker model one day, I promise! I'd much rather Mantic keep enriching the warpath universe with awesome new races tbh, and leave making humans out of the abundant third party (and even Mantic) options to us. Best of both worlds that way too... great Dreadball rules with great third party models ; p

I've also cancelled 4 posts now I think weighing in on the "discussion" atm. Maybe i'll gather my thoughts on it before the end of the KS ; p I blame Prince Valium.

Well, I'm sure you could make an alternative human team out of Blood Bowl models pretty easily.

 AlexHolker wrote:

Earth Dragon wrote:
He asked why is there only one human team, and there are three teams/templates with humans on the roster.

Actually, I was thinking specifically of Xtreme, where humans only play one role on one team, despite this being a human sport played in human cities. They should have gotten rid of the zombies and given the humans at least one real team.

Fair enough.

The big thing is all the teams are built in the same manner of DBO teams where you won't see any mixing and matching. DBO is played with the teams isolated as far as "permanent players go". All those teams from the first three seasons will be mixing in with the new teams. So not only are you getting the humans from the box set, but you'll be able to go pick up a box of Trontek or Void and be able to mix them in as well.

In short, anything already out will be usable in Xtreme

 AlexHolker wrote:

Actually, I was thinking specifically of Xtreme, where humans only play one role on one team, despite this being a human sport played in human cities.

Humans aren't automatically second class citizens - it makes sense that the only humans playing Xtreme are criminals / convicts because im sure all the non-criminal humans have silver spoons and are living large somewhere above all the grunge.

Earth Dragon wrote:
The big thing is all the teams are built in the same manner of DBO teams where you won't see any mixing and matching. DBO is played with the teams isolated as far as "permanent players go". All those teams from the first three seasons will be mixing in with the new teams. So not only are you getting the humans from the box set, but you'll be able to go pick up a box of Trontek or Void and be able to mix them in as well.

In short, anything already out will be usable in Xtreme

Even then, they could have run with the idea and added a set of humans wearing uniforms appropriate to the various other teams - a human guard who matches the Asterians, a human striker who plays with the Devastators, things like that.

 Micky wrote:
Humans aren't automatically second class citizens - it makes sense that the only humans playing Xtreme are criminals / convicts because im sure all the non-criminal humans have silver spoons and are living large somewhere above all the grunge.

"Criminal" and "convict" aren't the same things. Just because you're in trouble with the law doesn't mean you're going to get caught, so there's room for deserters or organised crime syndicates to get involved.

 AlexHolker wrote:

"Criminal" and "convict" aren't the same things. Just because you're in trouble with the law doesn't mean you're going to get caught, so there's room for deserters or organised crime syndicates to get involved.

Actually on that note, i think we have to hope the Rebs team will contain some humans. In duster coats, obviously.

 AlexHolker wrote:

 Micky wrote:
Humans aren't automatically second class citizens - it makes sense that the only humans playing Xtreme are criminals / convicts because im sure all the non-criminal humans have silver spoons and are living large somewhere above all the grunge.

"Criminal" and "convict" aren't the same things. Just because you're in trouble with the law doesn't mean you're going to get caught, so there's room for deserters or organised crime syndicates to get involved.

Not to mention the realistic likelihood of lower-skill-tier humans who prefer to compete in the "X-treeeeme" version of Dreadball because it pays better than their 8th-tier local league, etc.

 Micky wrote:

 AlexHolker wrote:

"Criminal" and "convict" aren't the same things. Just because you're in trouble with the law doesn't mean you're going to get caught, so there's room for deserters or organised crime syndicates to get involved.

Actually on that note, i think we have to hope the Rebs team will contain some humans. In duster coats, obviously.

But this is what I'm talking about. The Season 1&2 Humans are dressed in Dreadball gear. Regardless if you play Arena or Fullscale football, the PPE is the same. The Humans that are gonna show up with a full fledge reb outfit in the underground are likely to be using the same sports gear, and for criminal sponsors it would be easy enough to get.

The way DBX is set-up, all you have to do is buy the current models and you're good to go.

This goes for the Teratons, Judwan, Marauders, or anyone else who might show up on an underground team that is already represented.