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 Alpharius wrote:
A potential Christmas delivery for a potential Deadzone 2 KS?

Good luck with that!

How about a potential Christmas delivery for my Deadzone 1 Kickstarter?

That stuff is already on clearance in most stores, and I am still waiting.....

Scarletsquig I assume you will be able to continually add to it before it locks on the final day ( a bit like how you can submit multiple surveys now and only the last counts) and just pay any extra due each time otherwise people are going to wait until the end to watch the total rise to a point where more SGs are unlocked before they commit their funds but if people don't commit funds until the very end no more SGs unlock before then catch 22 if you see what I mean.

 DaveC wrote:
I've left my feedback for Mantic in the comments and I'm hoping they send me the why did you drop down your pledge email that they like to send out so I can give some proper feedback.

I think people here have mostly covered the problems already, Mantic need to step back from KS for awhile and catch up with what they have on already. Running a KS while 2 other projects had open PMs was a mistake. I think a lot of people ended up robbing peter to pay Paul, Mantic got the same amount of money from them just spread over more projects.

They have to stop this time limited ubber EB pledge level business both Frenzy and BoTB caused problems. The projects have become far to front loaded or mid point loaded leading to crashes. This is the first of the so called big KS players to flat line their kicktraq graph at the end (that I know of) and that alone must tell them something.

In the end my decision to go with a minimal Rampage pledge for now came down to a lack of alt poses and prones, only 2 teams sculpted and the rest concept art only and actually not liking 5 of those concepted teams who I just don't think fit the gritty team that I thought this was going for.

I look forward to Deadzone 2 but mostly for the terrain which is great and the best stuff mantic have managed to produce so far (IMO).

They exacerbated the front loading on this one by having EB for different levels, encouraging folks to grab one of each and waiting to see which will be the better for them. Especially for this type of KS, pledging for an All In level early may make some sense, but so does seeing if All In is really what you expected/wanted. If you don't know what the final contents are until the end, it is hard to decide until the end unless they make it worth it for you early on. In this case, for me, they did not do so. when they make statements like 'well, we would have included the cheerleaders and fans and Dredd and whatever if we made more' it lets me know they priced that level to include those things and expected overall funding to hit the level making that possible. If over all funding doesn't hit that level, so they don't include those things, they are really stating they overpriced that level for what they ended up putting in it. Inability to see anything but the concept art further decreased the desire to keep that level. Who knows what they'll actually deliver?

And as you said, many of the teams made little sense to the theme of DBX. That also went into my decision to drop Frenzy.

It seems to me an "all-in" level is a better weapon for mid-KS, combined with releasing half-a-dozen of the headline stretch goals. If you've got people hovering at $x on your initial sweet spot and you announce a raft of your best stretch goals and then offer a bigger package that entices the average pledger up a good slug and gets a lot of them (I dunno what people consider reasonable, +$100 on sweet spot?), you'll get a whole wave of pledgers jumping up and giving it some momentum.

It also seems to me that EBs are not necessary for Mantic. They got a good core of players who like the games they make, so they're going to get off to a strong start anyway.

 scarletsquig wrote:
Some good news about the pledge manager with this one is that they've got their own solution in place that allows them to track the total as surveys come in and unlock new stretch goals and keep us informed of the progress via their blog.
So, in effect, the kickstarter continues once the pledge manager is released and continues to unlock however many more goals are needed.
I'm wondering how long before they remove Kickstarter from the equation completely and run a crowdfunder using their own survey software.
It's certainly possible for them, just a matter of seeing whether or not it'd be desirable. It's likely that this hybrid initial kickstarter + extended survey preorder after system is the best solution since KS as a platform is still great.
They've already done it with deadzone, used the survey money to unlock more stretch goals like hard plastic enforcers and new terrain sprue, DBX will be the first one to formalize the process is all.

Count me in for cutting out the overheads. Kickstarter + Amazon/Paypal + Backerkit = not insubstantial cost, most of which is avoidable (payment processor not so much). Losing the KS advertising platform will no doubt reduce the influx of new pledgers, but as the frontloading has shown - they have a substantial following that probably contribute the majority to the campaigns anyway.

Of course, they did a time-limited 'all in' for Mars Attacks (which ended up being exceptionally good value) that pumped up the total massively, and then caused backsliding towards the end as people de-duped/downsized.

I really think it's as simple as: don't encourage people to speculatively pledge through early birds, especially multiple early birds. Then (I'd imagine) people would upgrade to higher levels once the value was there, and it would happen a bit more organically.

In a sense the tactics did work though - they got 700 backers to pledge at the ~$375 level, which is completely bonkers for a $75 boardgame that already contains everything you need to play in the box!

I don't think cutting out KS is a good idea at all. KS is a trusted platform and Mantic would likely lose everyone who wasn't already a steady customer.

Bioptic wrote:
In a sense the tactics did work though - they got 700 backers to pledge at the ~$375 level, which is completely bonkers for a $75 boardgame that already contains everything you need to play in the box!

Excellent point. In the wargaming world, $150 for a kickstarter board game with extras is considered standard, and usually a very good deal depending on the campaign.

In the real world, paying $150 for a board game with extras is considered insane.

Some of you are more fortunate than I am in this respect, but spending $1,000+ over the course of a year on miniatures would be financially inadvisable for me, and get me in serious hot water with my wife. I'd be very content if Mantic would do just two kickstarter campaigns a year, one fantasy, one sci-fi. As an annual event, it would be much easier to be a return customer and make a substantial pledge each time.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't think cutting out KS is a good idea at all. KS is a trusted platform and Mantic would likely lose everyone who wasn't already a steady customer.

Mantic has a webshop of their own that's been in business for a while and a solid history of fulfilling their crowdfunding projects that they can point to, trust shouldn't be an issue at all. The eyeballs gained from the KS platform would be much bigger imo so Mantic would need to decide if the reduction in overheads is worth the loss of exposure. There would probably be substantial upsides too - doesn't KS limit payment processors which irritates a lot of potential backers? Look at Star Citizen, it received 2 million on KS but is stretching to 41 million now thanks to funding through their own site.

Despite being a huge fan of Mantic I had to question if I really needed DBX. The game is still relatively new - how many DB in-depth articles are there on the Mantic website? How many large scale DB events have been run? Not that many. Wass it really time to start expanding that system so quickly?

I decided no. Supporting a game system should be more than "release more stuff"... I like the idea of being able to pick/form a team of any player/race but did it need a kickstarter to do this? I don't think so, especially with so many other issues needing addressing.

I dropped to the $1 disorder and MAY end up getting one or two of the Season Rulebooks but I'm in no rush and can happily wait till retail release.

Sorry to be a damp squib but I hope Mantic take time now to get their house in order, their Quality Control up to speed and address a lot of issues that should have been cleared up a long time ago.

*disclaimer: if a DKH game were to come along which allowed for classic dungeon delving, utilising the entire KOW range and adding new monsters/hero sculpt I would drop some cash on that

 Zweischneid wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
A potential Christmas delivery for a potential Deadzone 2 KS?

Good luck with that!

How about a potential Christmas delivery for my Deadzone 1 Kickstarter?

That stuff is already on clearance in most stores, and I am still waiting.....

And will it be as messed up as my DZ1 was, along with many others?

Great!

Yeah, Mantic could definitely do with slowing down their KickStarters (which I think we've all said the past 3, no?). I'm a reasonably die-hard completion-ist and I lack any sort of regulation (read: wife/girlfriend) on the money I spend so my "discretionary spending" is fairly high and even I'm getting a bit tapped out on enthusiasm.

The hybrid-KS model similar to what Star Citizen did would be quite interesting. A lot of SC's funding increases have come as they show more content and modules, and I don't see why a similar approach wouldn't be successful for Mantic. It would also allow them to stretch things out much longer and they could really gauge customer response to sculpts very early on in the process. If a lot of people pledge for X when the initial sculpt is shown, we have a winner and go to production. If not many people are interested, or many people actively move funds away, then they know to send it back immediately for a re-work. Getting honest communication from the masses within a comment section means you cater to the vocal minority most of the time. Looking at where dollars (or GBP) are being placed tells a much more accurate story.

Properly harnessed, that would be a most effective system. I can see a lot of places to feth it up though, and I'm sure Mantic would come up with a few more I haven't thought of (some on purpose, some not so much...). Still, if their new pledge manager could do it that might be the best situation for all parties.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't think cutting out KS is a good idea at all. KS is a trusted platform and Mantic would likely lose everyone who wasn't already a steady customer.

It may also open them up to direct liability that KS diffuses.
If enough folks got upset that they didn't get their stuff in X months and banded together, they might potentially come directly at Mantic (if Mantic crowdfunded internally versus using KS).

KS provides a shield of - hey, you knew it was a gamble when you spent your dough.
When it's the company expected to also produce the goods, I imagine it becomes easier for consumers to say I paid X for Y and didn't get my stuff from the manufacturer.

privateer4hire wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't think cutting out KS is a good idea at all. KS is a trusted platform and Mantic would likely lose everyone who wasn't already a steady customer.

It may also open them up to direct liability that KS diffuses.
If enough folks got upset that they didn't get their stuff in X months and banded together, they might potentially come directly at Mantic (if Mantic crowdfunded internally versus using KS).

KS provides a shield of - hey, you knew it was a gamble when you spent your dough.
When it's the company expected to also produce the goods, I imagine it becomes easier for consumers to say I paid X for Y and didn't get my stuff from the manufacturer.

Said differently, it would force Mantic to adhere to better program management and customer service practices.

I'm all for it.

The question is "Why does Mantic need crowd funding?"

It's not doing it on their own versus kickstarter, it's why is it needed period?

I understand they wanted to have lots if stuff for DBX on the docket, and in order to do that, they needed to dip further in DBO and it's teams, but would it have really been that hard to release DBX straight to retail? They've sold well over 10k copies of the original game. The limited stock of Deadzone they had for the initial release didn't last but a few weeks. Why couldn't Season 4/DBX been released through Dreadball revenue and then that revenue paid for Season 5?

Earth Dragon wrote:
The question is "Why does Mantic need crowd funding?"

It's not doing it on their own versus kickstarter, it's why is it needed period?

I understand they wanted to have lots if stuff for DBX on the docket, and in order to do that, they needed to dip further in DBO and it's teams, but would it have really been that hard to release DBX straight to retail? They've sold well over 10k copies of the original game. The limited stock of Deadzone they had for the initial release didn't last but a few weeks. Why couldn't Season 4/DBX been released through Dreadball revenue and then that revenue paid for Season 5?

I feel like the most obvious answer is the best one (though its not NEEDED). They just took in half a million dollars in pre-orders and took a TON of the risk out of the whole thing. If people are still willing to spend, why wouldn't you? Its the whole sense of community and excitement that a KS provides that makes people spend over 300$ at a time. I'm sure some people have, but I, nor anyone I have known have spent over 300$ on a pre-order from a company. Yet, with the excitement a KS builds, its just par for the course. The only reason I can see not to are the FLGS. But most companies don't seem to really care about them, lets be honest.

I wish they wouldn't do it either, but I think WHY they do it pretty much stares you in the face after every KS they do.

Half a million in pre-orders at, for many of the orders, massively discounted rates.

I feel like the more they do it, the more money they may be leaving on the table. And if course many wouldn't be ordering as much, but that also means they wouldn't have as many associated costs.

I myself am pretty much done with miniature KS projects. Quite frankly, the market is starting to get a bit bloated.

KS and miniature/boardgames are here to stay until this chart looks a lot differently than it does now:

ETA on survey?

Dreadball Xtreme update #50 is now up:



The Koris have been started – still work in progress.



Work-in-progress Kreed





The Medi-bot is finished! They can be taken as part of your team as equipment, much in the same way as coaching dice and cards. Cool little detail to tell you about - in the background, the pistons either side of the bed allow the medi-bot to extend the stretcher for patients of different sizes.

And that's your lot

Pledge Manager

We had hoped to get the pledge manager out this week but it was more important to test it thoroughly so we’ve delayed the launch.

It’s a new system where you'll be able to check what you ordered, make additions too (which are charged via paypal or credit card) as well as update your contact and delivery details. It’s a much more sophisticated system and the most complex the designer has built, so we’re taking the time to get it right.

We hope to release it soon!

Beware the Perils of the Jungle

24 players, 12 pitches, 1 trophy.

Want your first taster of a DreadBall tournament? On the 17th May we’re holding the DreadBall Azure Forest Tournament at the Mantic Games Open Day, held in Nottingham, UK.

Played using Original DreadBall Rules, all you need to do is download the tournament pack, bring your team and you’re all set to compete to become Azure Forest Champion! Click here to book your spot and view the tournament pack.

DreadBall Xtreme Previews

The Mantic Open Day is a true day of gaming but we’ve also got our studio on hand to show you all of the sculpts and artwork for our latest games – including DreadBall Xtreme!

You’ll be able to see all of the models we’ve had done, plus you can tackle Jake with your Xtreme questions.

If you want to know more about what’s on at the Open Day, check out the blog here – and grab your ticket here! Single and Group tickets are available at a low introductory rate until 31st April and will go up in price after that date. In the mean time, we’ve got some new sculpts to show off…

Link to the original post: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1744629938/dreadball-xtreme/posts/799747?at=BAh7CDoMcG9zdF9pZGkDAzQMSSIIdWlkBjoGRVRpAzTlYEkiC2V4cGlyeQY7BlRJIhgyMDE0LTA1LTA0IDExOjQ1OjQ3BjsGVA%3D%3D--caf8f71c9649754212b02ad1010231014e6c2c16&ref=backer_project_update

Well, this Kickstarter is officially still running, so I guess it's time to keep updating it!

We just got another MVP added to Rampage and there's another one on the way.

Sweet! Those sneaky devils.

Won't say no to more freebies!

My DBX pledge manager came through over the weekend.

I had initially put in for the soft original pitch and some scenery for $25.

I've just filled it in and something has come down in price, as I managed to get a rush marker cheerleader mini for free!

Bonus.

Hopefully I'll get some games in and my teams painted before the new pitch arrived...

Hmmm no posts here in 8 months but the N&R thread got retired so here's the deluxe original Dreadball pitch

Lovely. I really wish they had just told us from the get go that the second Kickstarter was just to add more stuff for DBO and we should buy DBO, this DBX thing is really just some sort of joke.

#77
Plague Outbreak!



Posted by Mantic Games



Happy Easter everyone!

We’re sorry it has been so long since the last update, and for not keeping Mission Control more regularly up to date – we hope that you are enjoying playing DreadBall Xtreme and painting your Season 4 teams.

This update is primarily to do with the miniatures, which are all now in our warehouse except the Plague and the Mechanites. These were the last tool to be completed are about to leave the manufacturer. With them on the water, it means that we’ve completed the figures side of things!

As we’re sure you’re aware, the Plague and Mechanics are the only teams that don’t come preassembled – instead there are a whole bunch of bits with which you can choose to customize your figures.

Here is our sample studio Plague team:
New! Kovossian Mutants Team

These are the horrific plague-hybrids of the Kossovian Mutants. The basic players are relatively simple to build, with each torso/legs parts being identifiable as being a Jack, Guard or Striker. There are strange biological Dreadball glove set into arms, as well as a few Judwan arms for the strikers.



After building the basic set ups for your players, you will be able to add extra details and mutations onto your players. This kit is jam-packed with extra components such as tails, vestigial wings, and heads from several different alien races. You can combine parts together to build a Zz’or-esque Guard, or randomly combine components for a Namless/Yndij/Human/Grogan player!

What do you think of these? Which teams of the next wave are you looking forward to?

We’ll be bringing plenty more shots and images out for all of the new miniatures as we gear up for our third shipment in late May. We will have had all of the digital content out well before then, and we will get DreadBall Xtreme Mission Control up to date in the next week as well.

Thanks for your support, and your patience.

Yikes!

Those aren't very good looking models - and they really show off how bad those 'integrated bases' are too!

I disagree. I think they look decent for board game pieces. Hopefully there's a few more odds and ends that aren't on display there as well. Need more heads!

I will concede the integrated bases though. At this point though, I pretty much expect every Dreadball figure to have them so as to facilitate using the hex bases.

I didn't realize they were gonna be Frankensteined that much, I was thinking more mutant less stitch/graft... but there's plenty of bits coming to play around with.