Alabama forces children to pray in theocratic dictatorship move.

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**dogma**

Breotan wrote:
Actually, the establishment clause of the 1st Amendment applies only to the Federal Government.

Not according to Everson v. BoE.

**Laughing Man**

welshhoppo wrote:
Exactly why do you pledge to the flag everyday? Always confused me.

Because the only way to beat the Reds and win the Cold War is to... do exactly the same thing the Reds are doing by having all the kiddies recite a loyalty oath daily?

**Co'tor Shas**

Ouze wrote:

Nothing's as fiscally conservative as passing legislation that is clearly unconstitutional and then spending many, many taxpayer dollars defending it in court, losing all the way.

**Breotan**

MeanGreenStompa wrote:
Alabama's government is behaving like a dictatorship.

Not true. Tyrannical, yes, but not a dictatorship. Dictators are essentially one-man rule.

What we have here is more like a cult (think Jim Jones) where the elected officials are bending to the dogma of their evangelical constituents. Heck, some of those representatives are probably true believers themselves.

**Gentleman_Jellyfish**

Ouze wrote:
Are your kids being converted to Muslims???

Thanks Obama

**Alfndrate**

Ouze wrote:
Are your kids being converted to Muslims???

God I hope so, fethers could use some direction in their lives

**whembly**

Alfndrate wrote:
Ouze wrote:
Are your kids being converted to Muslims???

God I hope so, fethers could use some direction in their lives

I was thinking "why would that be bad again?"

**H.B.M.C.**

And again America continues to fixate on things that just aren't important. "On noes! School prayer again! We must makes the childrens speak to God all the time otherwise the gays will cause more cyclones and terrorism!"

Hey guys: Your economy is fethed. Get your damned priorities straight and deal with that first.

Yes I realise I'm conflating several things in that mock-quote above, but these are some of the day-to-day minutia that America seems utterly unable to move past.

**Laughing Man**

H.B.M.C. wrote:
And again America continues to fixate on things that just aren't important.

On noes! School prayer again!

Hey guys - your economy is fethed. Deal with that first.

We would, if certain idiots wouldn't keep spending tax dollars on school prayer.

**MrMoustaffa**

MeanGreenStompa wrote:
http://gawker.com/alabama-legislators-pass-bill-requiring-school-prayer-e-1529495374?utm_campaign=socialflow_gawker_facebook&utm_source=gawker_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow

A key committee in Alabama's House of Representatives has pushed through a bill requiring teachers and students at all of the state's public schools to spend 15 minutes every morning in Christian prayer, even though a majority of legislators present say they opposed the measure.

Alabama, of course, is a churchin' state, ranked the "2nd most religious state" behind its neighbor, Mississippi. Alabama is also home to Roy Moore, the state Supreme Court chief justice who fought to keep a massive stone sculpture of the Ten Commandments in the state court building.

But that stand seems lukewarm next to the current House measure's planned compulsion of religion among captive pupils. The bill passed through the chamber's education policy committee late last week, according to the Montgomery Advertiser:

The bill, sponsored by Rep. Steve Hurst, R-Munford, would require teachers to spend no more than 15 minutes in the first class of each day to read, verbatim, opening prayers said before a meeting of the U.S. House of Representatives or the U.S. Senate.

Rep. Mary Sue McClurkin, R-Indian Springs, chairwoman of the committee, said she heard more votes in favor of the bill.

"It's what I heard as chairman," she said.

Only McClurkin and one other Republican on the panel actually voted "aye" on the bill. Two Republicans and one Democrat insist they said "no" to the bill in the voice vote; three legislators weren't even present for the vote. The House's clerk told the Advertiser that "the chairman of each committee has the discretion to decide the outcome of a voice vote."

McClurkin also voice-voted through a bill "that would allow students to initiate prayer in school and express their religious views in their schoolwork."

The sponsor of that bill told the Advertiser: "Every bit of this bill is already legal. It's just that no one knows it's legal."

What is this, Iran?!? As a proud libertarian I am appalled at this religious dictatorship and attempt to brainwash children into State-approved religious practices.

So we're ignoring that little clause of "Separation of Church and state" now?

Also, the news site is gawker. I thought they were a really sensationalist website that posted a lot of crap. Are they a trust worth source for this?

**Laughing Man**

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/02/13/bill-seeks-to-let-alabama-teacher-read-prayers/

Another source, although it doesn't include the bit about the voice votes or it actually passing.

**whembly**

MrMoustaffa wrote:
MeanGreenStompa wrote:
http://gawker.com/alabama-legislators-pass-bill-requiring-school-prayer-e-1529495374?utm_campaign=socialflow_gawker_facebook&utm_source=gawker_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow

A key committee in Alabama's House of Representatives has pushed through a bill requiring teachers and students at all of the state's public schools to spend 15 minutes every morning in Christian prayer, even though a majority of legislators present say they opposed the measure.

Alabama, of course, is a churchin' state, ranked the "2nd most religious state" behind its neighbor, Mississippi. Alabama is also home to Roy Moore, the state Supreme Court chief justice who fought to keep a massive stone sculpture of the Ten Commandments in the state court building.

But that stand seems lukewarm next to the current House measure's planned compulsion of religion among captive pupils. The bill passed through the chamber's education policy committee late last week, according to the Montgomery Advertiser:

The bill, sponsored by Rep. Steve Hurst, R-Munford, would require teachers to spend no more than 15 minutes in the first class of each day to read, verbatim, opening prayers said before a meeting of the U.S. House of Representatives or the U.S. Senate.

Rep. Mary Sue McClurkin, R-Indian Springs, chairwoman of the committee, said she heard more votes in favor of the bill.

"It's what I heard as chairman," she said.

Only McClurkin and one other Republican on the panel actually voted "aye" on the bill. Two Republicans and one Democrat insist they said "no" to the bill in the voice vote; three legislators weren't even present for the vote. The House's clerk told the Advertiser that "the chairman of each committee has the discretion to decide the outcome of a voice vote."

McClurkin also voice-voted through a bill "that would allow students to initiate prayer in school and express their religious views in their schoolwork."

The sponsor of that bill told the Advertiser: "Every bit of this bill is already legal. It's just that no one knows it's legal."

What is this, Iran?!? As a proud libertarian I am appalled at this religious dictatorship and attempt to brainwash children into State-approved religious practices.

So we're ignoring that little clause of "Separation of Church and state" now?

Also, the news site is gawker. I thought they were a really sensationalist website that posted a lot of crap. Are they a trust worth source for this?

Now where is that clause written again??

**Co'tor Shas**

MrMoustaffa wrote:
MeanGreenStompa wrote:
http://gawker.com/alabama-legislators-pass-bill-requiring-school-prayer-e-1529495374?utm_campaign=socialflow_gawker_facebook&utm_source=gawker_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow

A key committee in Alabama's House of Representatives has pushed through a bill requiring teachers and students at all of the state's public schools to spend 15 minutes every morning in Christian prayer, even though a majority of legislators present say they opposed the measure.

Alabama, of course, is a churchin' state, ranked the "2nd most religious state" behind its neighbor, Mississippi. Alabama is also home to Roy Moore, the state Supreme Court chief justice who fought to keep a massive stone sculpture of the Ten Commandments in the state court building.

But that stand seems lukewarm next to the current House measure's planned compulsion of religion among captive pupils. The bill passed through the chamber's education policy committee late last week, according to the Montgomery Advertiser:

The bill, sponsored by Rep. Steve Hurst, R-Munford, would require teachers to spend no more than 15 minutes in the first class of each day to read, verbatim, opening prayers said before a meeting of the U.S. House of Representatives or the U.S. Senate.

Rep. Mary Sue McClurkin, R-Indian Springs, chairwoman of the committee, said she heard more votes in favor of the bill.

"It's what I heard as chairman," she said.

Only McClurkin and one other Republican on the panel actually voted "aye" on the bill. Two Republicans and one Democrat insist they said "no" to the bill in the voice vote; three legislators weren't even present for the vote. The House's clerk told the Advertiser that "the chairman of each committee has the discretion to decide the outcome of a voice vote."

McClurkin also voice-voted through a bill "that would allow students to initiate prayer in school and express their religious views in their schoolwork."

The sponsor of that bill told the Advertiser: "Every bit of this bill is already legal. It's just that no one knows it's legal."

What is this, Iran?!? As a proud libertarian I am appalled at this religious dictatorship and attempt to brainwash children into State-approved religious practices.

So we're ignoring that little clause of "Separation of Church and state" now?

Also, the news site is gawker. I thought they were a really sensationalist website that posted a lot of crap. Are they a trust worth source for this?

NBC: School prayer, religious bills aplenty this Alabama Legislative session
And just for whembly

FOX: Alabama bill would require reading of congressional prayers in schools

**whembly**

I know that... I'm being snarky. The separation of church and state is a judicial construct. There's no "clause" like that in the founding documents.

**Co'tor Shas**

whembly wrote:
I know that... I'm being snarky. The separation of church and state is a judicial construct. There's no "clause" like that in the founding documents.

Establishment clause is usually cited.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." (IIRC, don't quote me on it)
Prayer is an establishment of religion.

**whembly**

Co'tor Shas wrote:
whembly wrote:
I know that... I'm being snarky. The separation of church and state is a judicial construct. There's no "clause" like that in the founding documents.

Establishment clause is usually cited.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." (IIRC, don't quote me on it)
Prayer is an establishment of religion.

This deserves its own thread... But re-read that... You'll see what I mean.

**Bullockist**

Gentleman_Jellyfish wrote:

I pledge allegiance. To the flag. Of the United States of America. And to the Republic. For which it stands. One nation. Under God. Indivisible. With liberty and justice for all!

Stuck for life

It seems to me to be liberty and justice for all as long as you pray to who I say, when I say and as long as i tell you to do it! Anyone who doesn't is an Islomunist.

I'm so glad you guys are flying the flag of freedom for the world. Alabama seems to be such a hotbed of repression reduction. I'm starting to think when god created the world 6000 years ago alabama was the opposite side of the world to the garden of eden because I think we are still waiting for the tree of knowledge apple to make it there.

**Co'tor Shas**

whembly wrote:
Co'tor Shas wrote:
whembly wrote:
I know that... I'm being snarky. The separation of church and state is a judicial construct. There's no "clause" like that in the founding documents.

Establishment clause is usually cited.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." (IIRC, don't quote me on it)
Prayer is an establishment of religion.

This deserves its own thread... But re-read that... You'll see what I mean.

I know what you mean. It says congress. I have had arguments with people about this before. But as I always say:
"I respect your opinion and your right to have it. You're just wrong."

**dogma**

Breotan wrote:
Not true. Tyrannical, yes, but not a dictatorship. Dictators are essentially one-man rule.

That isn't true. The word "dictatorship" has often been used to describe instances in which power rests in the hands of more than one man.

**djones520**

I like how no one seems to have yet noticed that this is just something that's been in committee.

It hasn't been voted on in the House, let alone the Senate, or made it to the Governor's desk yet.

Purely sensationalism threat titling.

**dogma**

whembly wrote:
I know that... I'm being snarky. The separation of church and state is a judicial construct. There's no "clause" like that in the founding documents.

Well, aside from the establishment clause.

**d-usa**

I'm always happy when legislators of another state are able to out-dumb Oklahoma.

**dogma**

djones520 wrote:

Purely sensationalism threat titling.

Well, it is Gawker.

**Seaward**

MeanGreenStompa wrote:
What is this, Iran?!? As a proud libertarian I am appalled at this religious dictatorship and attempt to brainwash children into State-approved religious practices.

You misspelled "socialist."

It won't get through the full House, and it'll be around for all of five minutes before the courts strike it down if it does.

**djones520**

dogma wrote:
djones520 wrote:

Purely sensationalism threat titling.

Well, it is Gawker.

Don't know why you edited. The part you took out what responsible for the title, not the Gawker. They had something completely different.

**Monster Rain**

I personally enjoyed the hyperbolicious thread title.

It would appear that this flavor of click-bait gets the most eyeballs.

**sebster**

Interesting that in another thread where people were talking about the 2014 election being the Republicans to lose, and that it would take something as boneheaded as the 2012 rape comments to lead to a defeat. I think more than a few Republicans read that and thought 'challenge accepted'.

**Cheesecat**

Monster Rain wrote:
I personally enjoyed the hyperbolicious thread title.

It would appear that this flavor of click-bait gets the most eyeballs.

Well, considering some of MGS's recent posts I'm not too surprised

.

**Monster Rain**

This is business as usual for these southern Red States, though.

**d-usa**

sebster wrote:
Interesting that in another thread where people were talking about the 2014 election being the Republicans to lose, and that it would take something as boneheaded as the 2012 rape comments to lead to a defeat. I think more than a few Republicans read that and thought 'challenge accepted'.

They are trying!

(Too lazy to start another "Republican says stupid thing" thread)