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 creeping-deth87 wrote:
more expensive power weapons, plasma pistols are 15 pts now instead of 10

Oh yeah, forgot about those. Yet more proof that GW isn't a business, it's a charity that exists to provide "productive" employment to incompetent idiots who would otherwise never rise above the level of burger flipper.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Agent_Tremolo wrote:

 NuggzTheNinja wrote:
I don't buy it. Codex: Inquisition Chimeras didn't get a points increase. Why would these?

Yay, Inquisition can also purchase Valkyries for 100 points basic. That's the dubious advantage of having a copy/paste job for a codex

Also, any news on Commissar Yarrick? I didn't see anyone mention him yet....

Oh yeah, he should be in the book. It would really suck if they were to just drop him....
Only to then release him in a $10 dataslate.

Frankly, I suspect the dataslate.

But remember there have been rumors of an Armageddon release shortly before/after orks... so who knows.

It's silly. If GW lowered points costs we'd need to buy more. Now, however, If my 2k army is now 2100, I got some eBay selling to do. What were you thinking GW?

 Peregrine wrote:

 creeping-deth87 wrote:
more expensive power weapons, plasma pistols are 15 pts now instead of 10

Oh yeah, forgot about those. Yet more proof that GW isn't a business, it's a charity that exists to provide "productive" employment to incompetent idiots who would otherwise never rise above the level of burger flipper.

Stop rebooting the asinine pessimism will you? The leaks on Pask, the Warlord Traits and the CCS orders show that the person who wrote the book at least on some areas (in my opinion certainly the most important ones, who cares about Ogryns, and screw another Codex duration of Vendetta spam) has his head screwed on and knows what makes those things good.

So, has there ever been a Codex that removed so many units from an army? at least special characters -- gone. Penal legions -- gone. Three different artillery pieces -- gone. Special weapons squads -- gone.

 Mr.Omega wrote:
Stop rebooting the asinine pessimism will you? The leaks on Pask, the Warlord Traits and the CCS orders show that the person who wrote the book at least on some areas (in my opinion certainly the most important ones, who cares about Ogryns, and screw another Codex duration of Vendetta spam) has his head screwed on and knows what makes those things good.

And those of us who don't want to run Ebenezer Pask's Tank Circus, his ridiculous rules are cold comfort indeed. I care about Ogryns. You are right, at least, in that the word "screwed" certainly has an important role to play with regard to this laughable release.

 krazynadechukr wrote:
It's silly. If GW lowered points costs we'd need to buy more. Now, however, If my 2k army is now 2100, I got some eBay selling to do. What were you thinking GW?

Why would you sell parts of your army if it exceeds 2000? Don't you have shelves?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Agamemnon2 wrote:
Special weapons squads -- gone.

Is that confirmed? I did not read they were removed on /tg/

 Mr.Omega wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:

 creeping-deth87 wrote:
more expensive power weapons, plasma pistols are 15 pts now instead of 10

Oh yeah, forgot about those. Yet more proof that GW isn't a business, it's a charity that exists to provide "productive" employment to incompetent idiots who would otherwise never rise above the level of burger flipper.

Stop rebooting the asinine pessimism will you? The leaks on Pask, the Warlord Traits and the CCS orders show that the person who wrote the book at least on some areas (in my opinion certainly the most important ones, who cares about Ogryns, and screw another Codex duration of Vendetta spam) has his head screwed on and knows what makes those things good.

I'll be as pessimistic as I want, thank you very much. This is a forum for discussion, and frankly I don't see how your opinion that everything sounds fine and dandy is any more valid than others who are disappointed with the news so far.

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

Is that confirmed? I did not read they were removed on /tg/

They are still there. The platoon diagram was leaked earlier in the thread and it showed special weapon squads.

 Agamemnon2 wrote:
So, has there ever been a Codex that removed so many units from an army? at least special characters -- gone. Penal legions -- gone. Three different artillery pieces -- gone. Special weapons squads -- gone.

Tyranid players were hit pretty hard. Units without a model had to be sourced outside or converted the hard way. Now they are gone.

At least special weapon squads are still available, the i-store preview I posted a few hours ago has a "special weapon squad" line.


edit : ninja'ed by 6 seconds by Palindrome.
repost of a cropped screenshot of platoon infantry squad :

I really hope the Tank Commander isn't overpriced, chimeras getting priced up is annoying.

I'll never understand the modern GW ethos that every single unit in the game needs to be purchaseable as a boxed set from day one, and the same goes for every single piece of terrain, building, and even the table itself. It's all just so paint-by-numbers, without surprises or variance.

Even something as simple as an alien cactus made of foam with cocktail-stick spines is too adventurous for them to feature.

 Agamemnon2 wrote:
I'll never understand the modern GW ethos that every single unit in the game needs to be purchaseable as a boxed set from day one, and the same goes for every single piece of terrain, building, and even the table itself. It's all just so paint-by-numbers, without surprises or variance.

Chapterhouse Studios terrified GW when they nearly managed to aqcuire the trademark for the Tervigon, mostly due to GW's legal department's incompetence so GW has taken the nuclear option, as it so often does.

I think people are overstating the "problem" of chimeras losing searchlights. How many were actually using Chimera searchlights instead of on something more durable? Also, I find it dubious that Chimera's will "lose searchlight" as a default option anyways. Why?

I just picked up todays WD, and it has the Wyvern in it. Wyvern is also 65 points, but has smoke-launchers and searchlight standard.

In addiion, I have the Militarum Tempestus Codex. Valkyries? Still have searchlights, but have the new point increase at 125 points.

The Taurox prime doesn't have a complete list of options on its page, but refers back to the "Militarum Tempestus Vehicle Equipment List". And one of those options listed is the Dozer Blade. Which the Taurox doesn't need. That list looks to be copy/pasted from the Astra Militarum book.

What I'm going to go out on a limb and guess, is that the "list" you were seeing underneath the chimera was listing the full "Astra Militarum Vehicle Equipment list". Which is listing everything that all the vehicles can take as long as they can select options from said table. Which doesn't necessarily mean that the Chimera "needs" to purchase it. The chimera could very well still have smoke launchers and a searchlight on its profile page

edit: grammar

 Palindrome wrote:

 Agamemnon2 wrote:
I'll never understand the modern GW ethos that every single unit in the game needs to be purchaseable as a boxed set from day one, and the same goes for every single piece of terrain, building, and even the table itself. It's all just so paint-by-numbers, without surprises or variance.

Chapterhouse Studios terrified GW when they nearly managed to aqcuire the trademark for the Tervigon, mostly due to GW's legal department's incompetence so GW has taken the nuclear option, as it so often does.

That's tragic if true, since the case is far from over. With all the appeals, it might be anothe few years before it's clear what, if anything, GW "lost".

The chimera thing doesn't bug me at all. I would always run them with stubbers. 5 points extra doesn't bother me.

 Agamemnon2 wrote:

That's tragic if true, since the case is far from over.

Its not anything to do with on going appeal, CHS simply made a Tervigon kit before GW did. This has forced GW into removing all unit entries that don't have an actual model.

 Smitty wrote:
The chimera thing doesn't bug me at all. I would always run them with stubbers. 5 points extra doesn't bother me.

You are wrong. Its game changer. Whole IG is now basically unplayable. You should sell your collection. Just let it sink. Chimera is 10 points up. And. Without. Searchlights. See? Its the end. Leave the game. Its over.

Awwww Ogryn's still cost the same, and the Bullgryns are even more expensive ( although that one didn't surprise me. ) Still a bummer though, I guess I was too optimistic for thinking that they would lower their PPM. I guess I won't be taking them outside of casual games or just for fun.

I'm still super excited to get some of the models though.

 UlrikDecado wrote:

 Smitty wrote:
The chimera thing doesn't bug me at all. I would always run them with stubbers. 5 points extra doesn't bother me.

You are wrong. Its game changer. Whole IG is now basically unplayable. You should sell your collection. Just let it sink. Chimera is 10 points up. And. Without. Searchlights. See? Its the end. Leave the game. Its over.

I never used those.

I was kind of expecting ogryns to be about 30 pts each.

I've never seen anyone take Ogryns or advise using them, but I still love them. Both their models ( new and old ) and their fluff. They just really appeal to me. So regardless of how good or bad they are now, I'll still be taking them and using them from time to time.

Edit: Oh whoops, thought you were talking about Ogryns, Smitty.

 Smitty wrote:

 UlrikDecado wrote:

 Smitty wrote:
The chimera thing doesn't bug me at all. I would always run them with stubbers. 5 points extra doesn't bother me.

You are wrong. Its game changer. Whole IG is now basically unplayable. You should sell your collection. Just let it sink. Chimera is 10 points up. And. Without. Searchlights. See? Its the end. Leave the game. Its over.

I never used those.

But than you did it...wrongly! Really?! How could you ignore searchlights?! I guess you are not real player in that case. I guess you are ruining the game for real players who will have to quit, because Chimera is more expensive and without searchlights. I also guess you are on GW payroll. Maybe you even made these rules and you wish to publish Dataslate: Chimera with Searchlights!

But no! Real players wont suffer this anymore! They will quit! Again. They will show the world truth about the game. NO SEARCHLIGHTS!

(but, seriously, whine about 10pts rise on Chimera and no searchlight in price is one of the most ridiculous things I saw in WH40K net-raging)

 Sir Bubbles wrote:
I've never seen anyone take Ogryns or advise using them, but I still love them. Both their models ( new and old ) and their fluff. They just really appeal to me. So regardless of how good or bad they are now, I'll still be taking them and using them from time to time.

Edit: Oh whoops, thought you were talking about Ogryns, Smitty.

My bad.

Still waiting for the codex before I get excited/cry in my rootbeer .

 UlrikDecado wrote:

 Smitty wrote:

 UlrikDecado wrote:

 Smitty wrote:
The chimera thing doesn't bug me at all. I would always run them with stubbers. 5 points extra doesn't bother me.

You are wrong. Its game changer. Whole IG is now basically unplayable. You should sell your collection. Just let it sink. Chimera is 10 points up. And. Without. Searchlights. See? Its the end. Leave the game. Its over.

I never used those.

But than you did it...wrongly! Really?! How could you ignore searchlights?! I guess you are not real player in that case. I guess you are ruining the game for real players who will have to quit, because Chimera is more expensive and without searchlights. I also guess you are on GW payroll. Maybe you even made these rules and you wish to publish Dataslate: Chimera with Searchlights!

But no! Real players wont suffer this anymore! They will quit! Again. They will show the world truth about the game. NO SEARCHLIGHTS!

(but, seriously, whine about 10pts rise on Chimera and no searchlight in price is one of the most ridiculous things I saw in WH40K net-raging)

Indeed it is.

(Any users who saw my goof up, sorry for the double post. iPhone problems.)

UlrikDecado wrote:
(but, seriously, whine about 10pts rise on Chimera and no searchlight in price is one of the most ridiculous things I saw in WH40K net-raging)

When it's unnecessary and you're likely to take them in large numbers it adds up very quickly. For instance, in the last mechanized list I ran, assuming these new points costs, ignoring searchlights but buying smoke, that adds 165pts to the army, meaning I've got to drop a a chimera and an infantry squad and downgrade several others, and none of those are seeing any improvements in capability.

Err, weren't searchlights a pretty huge deal. Especially against Necrons.

Ogryn's still being pants makes me even more sad. I did have a soft spot for my squad of them.

GW seem genuinely determined for me to stay away from 40k.

 Vaktathi wrote:
When it's unnecessary and you're likely to take them in large numbers it adds up very quickly. For instance, in the last mechanized list I ran, assuming these new points costs, ignoring searchlights but buying smoke, that adds 165pts to the army, meaning I've got to drop a a chimera and an infantry squad and downgrade several others, and none of those are seeing any improvements in capability.

Exactly. And it wouldn't be so bad if the Chimera nerf was the only thing wrong with an otherwise awesome codex, but so far what we've seen suggests that the best way to save $50 on a new codex is to rip a few pages out of your previous codex and take a random unit out of your list. The only thing we've gained, other than some warlord traits that should have been FAQed in the day 6th edition was released, is HQ tanks. All of the other changes either increase the cost of stuff that didn't need to be more expensive, or remove units entirely.

 Vaktathi wrote:

UlrikDecado wrote:
(but, seriously, whine about 10pts rise on Chimera and no searchlight in price is one of the most ridiculous things I saw in WH40K net-raging)

When it's unnecessary and you're likely to take them in large numbers it adds up very quickly. For instance, in the last mechanized list I ran, assuming these new points costs, ignoring searchlights but buying smoke, that adds 165pts to the army, meaning I've got to drop a a chimera and an infantry squad and downgrade several others, and none of those are seeing any improvements in capability.

It's not impossible to assume that what we saw was just the universal vehicle equipment list rather than what the chimera comes with.

Hmmm:
- Good units nerfed
- Bad units not fixed
- New units not adding anything usefull
- Several old units deleted

Still hope, you IG-fans don't get the tyranid-treatment, but hope is fading.
Will this be another Codex where no designer wants to claim authorship because the beancounters think they can write better rules?