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I'm not sure how to tackle this, but I've heard that there was a rumour that the Void Dragon C'tan might be the Omnissiah, only the AdMech don't have a clue they're worshipping a star god and all that. I can't remember the ins and outs, but I just wondered if this ever came up in the fluff anywhere??

It's been all but confirmed by Mechanicum. The Emperor fought a shard of the Void Dragon C'tan on Earth and bound it. He placed it deep underground on Mars, where its dreams and thoughts would influence the development of the society that lived on Mars, which would grow into becoming the Machine Cult.

That said, it's more complicated than that. The Emperor is seen by the Machine Cult as an avatar of the Omnissiah, and in some ways he is. We don't actually know if the shard remains on Mars post-heresy, but there is a small sect of guardians on Mars, whose job it is to watch over the Dragon. There's still a lot we don't know about the specifics of it all.

 Mitranekh the Omniscient wrote:
I'm not sure how to tackle this, but I've heard that there was a rumour that the Void Dragon C'tan might be the Omnissiah, only the AdMech don't have a clue they're worshipping a star god and all that. I can't remember the ins and outs, but I just wondered if this ever came up in the fluff anywhere??

It most certainly did, in the previous Necron Codex.

There's a scene where Abaddon interrogates a Daemon which says that there is "a new form" of death on Mars, and he laughs when the Daemon reveals what is there. The implication is that the Void Dragon is very much there, likely whole, slumbering on Mars until some C'Tan loyalist Necrons can wake him up fully. There's other sections about it as well with tech-adepts rejecting the teachings of the AdMech due to finding out 'the truth'.

I've written some pretty detailed headcanon fluff about exactly this subject and how the battle of Necrons under Szarekh versus the C'Tan may actually been more of a '3rd war of secession' with the knowledge of this lost to all but the Silent King & Triarch Praetorians (who have tried to hunt down the remaining C'Tan loyalists for the 60 million years they've been active). Even come up with a special character that was made the Void Dragon's personal Nemesor... think Arkhan the Black in WHFB crossed with Transformers and you have the general idea.

Actually, we know for a fact that it's not whole because in WD 384, we're given a stat line for a shard of pretty much every living C'tan, Void Dragon included.

jareddm wrote:
Actually, we know for a fact that it's not whole because in WD 384, we're given a stat line for a shard of pretty much every living C'tan, Void Dragon included.

This is what I get for not buying WDs for years.

Oh well, my dude is going to be one pissed off guy when he finds that out.

 Tennants Lager wrote:

jareddm wrote:
Actually, we know for a fact that it's not whole because in WD 384, we're given a stat line for a shard of pretty much every living C'tan, Void Dragon included.

This is what I get for not buying WDs for years.

Oh well, my dude is going to be one pissed off guy when he finds that out.

Why? What's the big deal about going from full c'tan to c'tan shard? You're going from infinite power to a piece of infinite power. It's not like there was some scale of power among nightmarish creatures.

jareddm wrote:

 Tennants Lager wrote:

jareddm wrote:
Actually, we know for a fact that it's not whole because in WD 384, we're given a stat line for a shard of pretty much every living C'tan, Void Dragon included.

This is what I get for not buying WDs for years.

Oh well, my dude is going to be one pissed off guy when he finds that out.

Why? What's the big deal about going from full c'tan to c'tan shard? You're going from infinite power to a piece of infinite power. It's not like there was some scale of power among nightmarish creatures.

Well descening into said headcanon fluff a bit...



So given this development I bet if Necrons could swear I bet he'd be doing it now haha...

It actually shows how powerful the C'tan really were, when a starved shard of the Void Dragon nearly killed the emperor.

Kinda puts things into perspective.

 Sasori wrote:
It actually shows how powerful the C'tan really were, when a starved shard of the Void Dragon nearly killed the emperor.

Kinda puts things into perspective.

Necrons and everything on a whole are hilariously overpowered. Like Chaos, they look like they came straight out of Lovecraft or Doctor Who, given their insane levels of power. feth, a didn't a single non-capital Necron Ship tank/dodge all of Terra's defenses as it made a trench run for Mars?

Not quite.

A pair of Shroud-class Cruisers - stealth cruisers, like the Normandy SR-2 on steroids - came out of FTL near Titan and advanced at 1LS towards Mars. One of them was destroyed on the way in by Mars's orbital defences, the other landed but was destroyed by AdMech ground forces.

 Furyou Miko wrote:
Not quite.

A pair of Shroud-class Cruisers - stealth cruisers, like the Normandy SR-2 on steroids - came out of FTL near Titan and advanced at 1LS towards Mars. One of them was destroyed on the way in by Mars's orbital defences, the other landed but was destroyed by AdMech ground forces.

I thought it was about 5 of them, but yeah it was definitely Shrouds. Tied this little gem into the above as well.

Yep five Shroud class cruisers entered the Sol System, but only two managed to land on Mars before being destroyed almost immediately after landing.

I think I heard somewhere that THE EMPRAH imprisoned the Void Dragon shard, but then seeded the Omnissiah Cult in such a way as to prevent worshipping the Void Dragon, thus ensuring it couldn't regain it's strength.

Yea, I thought the Emperor TRICKED the void dragon into INSPIRING the Omnisiah, not being it. (this technically means it's possible to interpret the Emperor as the true Omnisiah in a way, kinda. If one defines "The Omnisiah" as the god responsible for instilling mankind's quest for knowledge, Emps is the true culprit of that)

He didn't trick anything. He clubbed it on the head and stuck it in a prison cell on Mars so it's aura could influence the minds of the Martians into technological feats to complete his omnissiah prophecy that he planted.

Simples.

Remember that the Emperor beat this C'Tan into submission while mounted on a horse, wearing primitive armor and wielding an iron sword. This would have been in the 3rd or 4th century AD.

The artwork of Saint George and the Dragon is inspired by this historic battle.

The Omnissiah is viewed as the mortal representation of the Machine God. Sort of like a Robo-Jesus to the Tech-God.

So in 40k, it is likely that the Omnissiah really is the Emperor. The Machine God, though, that's very likely the C'Tan.

Worshipping a C'Tan doesn't do anything for it, though. These things exist only in the realm of physical reality, and cannot interact with or enter the Warp. They are, in a sense, diametric opposites of the Chaos Gods. As such, they don't feed off of emotional energy or anything like that, they just consume energy of a physical sort, like feeding on the radiation emitted by stars.

The Omnissiah and the Machine-God are the same thing. Supposedly the Emperor was the living manifestation of the Machine-God, but this is mostly just propaganda to keep the Eclessiarchy from declaring the AdMechs heretics and trying to kill them all.

 Sasori wrote:
It actually shows how powerful the C'tan really were, when a starved shard of the Void Dragon nearly killed the emperor.

Kinda puts things into perspective.

What? The Big E wrecked the void dragon in pre-medi eval gear, then stuck him in a room on Mars.

The Emperor really was the most OP of OP.

 Imperator_Class wrote:

 Sasori wrote:
It actually shows how powerful the C'tan really were, when a starved shard of the Void Dragon nearly killed the emperor.

Kinda puts things into perspective.

What? The Big E wrecked the void dragon in pre-medi eval gear, then stuck him in a room on Mars.

The Emperor really was the most OP of OP.

He beat a Shard Of the Void Dragon, which is a fraction of a Fraction of the Void Dragons power. The Current fluff has the C'tan doing things that the emperor wishes he could do.

He didn't "Wreck" it either. he BARELY won, only be discovering a small chink in the Shards armor.

He still beat a Star-God into submission with an iron sword.

Think about that for a moment.

He did imbue it with some of his psychic power though.

His armour may have also been covered in psychic powered wards to make it extra shiny.

While that may be the case at its foundation, it's still Roman-era armor and weapons. Saint George (which, in 40K, is how humanity translated the Emperor defeating the Void Dragon) is a 3rd/4th Century AD figure.

The Emperor is a tough cookie.





Or he had used some prior knowledge or precognition skills to determine a specific weakness or advantage he needed to complete his "task" against the Void Dragon.

 Lord-Captain Cepinari wrote:
The Omnissiah and the Machine-God are the same thing. Supposedly the Emperor was the living manifestation of the Machine-God, but this is mostly just propaganda to keep the Eclessiarchy from declaring the AdMechs heretics and trying to kill them all.

It might not be entirely propaganda. Even ignoring that he purposefully seeded the Cult of the Omnisiah himself, Emps was a very VERY knowledgeable scientist who preached that man-kind was supposed to follow the idea of logic and science instead of worship. This is something you'd actually expect a god of knowledge and machinery to preach.

Of course, IMHO, the fact that Emps is the one who created (in a way) the cult of the Omnisiah in the first place means he really could be equated to the Omnisiah, albeit not exactly as most Ad Mech would envision it.

There's an interesting omission about how the Emperor actually got the Void Dragon TO Mars, if he defeated it during the dark ages.........

Really strong catapult?

He tied a rope to its tail, hitched it to his saddle, and rode his horse into the sky and all the way to Mars.

It was a Horse Made out of Solid Diamonds.

I mean, I guess he could have locked it away on Earth until after Mars was colonized, but that's kind of boring, frankly.

Well I'll be damned...

I bet you they had better technology than what "historical"... "evidence" would lead us to believe. At least the people holding the reigns of control over the Earth's populace had access to better tech. The Emperor would be one of these people.

The time before the medieval dark ages on our earth, the time before the great flood, the FIRST EVER civilization on earth - I bet THOSE guys had wicked tech, eldar type tech. The Emperor probably managed to unearth this past, and it helped him sway the local groveling sub human population (the dirt farmers), as well as deal with high tech threats like the shard of a shard of C'Tan.

You wear your hair real funny, don't you?