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Does an Engineseer maintain independent character once he takes servitors. In other words, would I be allowed to take two servitors, then attach the Enginseer to my CCS and embark them all in a chimera?

 TheSilo wrote:


Tactical Auto-Reliquary: “When rolling Leadership tests for orders issued by an officer with the Tactical Auto-Reliquary, any successful Leadership test that results in a double will count as Inspired Tactics” it must be a successful test.

Take Aim!: “The ordered unit must make a shooting attack. When resolving this shooting attack, all models in the ordered unit have the Precision Shot special rule.”

This isn't ambiguous to me at all. The squad gains the precision shots rule, only rolls of a 6 to hit are precision shots.

Unfortunately the Smite at Will! command is similarly worded, suggesting that the successful order grants the splitfire special rule (meaning the squad must pass a second ld test to successful splitfire.

Additional question:

- Can CCS advisors (astropath, master of ordnance, OOTF) be equipped with camo gear or carapace armor like the veterans in the squad?

Copying from the other thread on this issue:

The mistake being made here is that the first sentence under Precision Shots in the BRB begins by defining how characters gain the Precision Shot rule. No characters, generally, have the precision shot rule. When they roll a 6 they gain the precision shot rule which allows them to allocate wounds. There are other sources as well that can grant the Precision shot rule. Rolling a 6 is not a requirement for precision shots, it is simply a mechanic by which all characters can temporally gain the precision shot rule. The rule doesn't limit it to characters or limit it only to rolling a 6. It provides the most common scenario and a universal rule for characters. Other rules can, and do, exist in codexes and on weapons that grant Precision Shots beyond the example listed under the Precision Shots rule in the BRB.

The logic works as follows:
Character rolls 6.
Character gains Precision Shots rule for that attack.

Squad receives the Take Aim order.
Squad gains the Precision Shots rule for their attacks.

In either case the BRB defines Precision Shots as allowing you to allocate wounds. It does not require rolling a 6. A character rolling a 6 is merely the most common mechanic for a precision shot to come up in the game because that situation specifically grants a Character the Precision Shots rule for that attack.

Edit: Emphasis

 Archive wrote:
Does an Engineseer maintain independent character once he takes servitors. In other words, would I be allowed to take two servitors, then attach the Enginseer to my CCS and embark them all in a chimera?

The Servitors are a unit unto themselves. Sort of like SM Command Squads.

farrenj: You are misquoting the rules... in a very significant way.

covered in other thread.

I didn't have the BRB in front of me so it wasn't verbatim from the rule book but it's still correct.

1. Do platoons still have the ability to come from Reserves with a single roll? Or are all units in a Platoon (including Storm Trooper Platoons) rolled for separately?

2. Can Ogryns ride around in the Valkyrie/Vendetta?

I believe that is all for now - thanks to those for providing solid answers.

 mr_bruno wrote:
1. Do platoons still have the ability to come from Reserves with a single roll? Or are all units in a Platoon (including Storm Trooper Platoons) rolled for separately?

Atm there is nothing that allows an entire platoon to come in on a single roll.

2. Can Ogryns ride around in the Valkyrie/Vendetta?

Is there a restriction in the Valkyrie/Vendetta rules?

farrenj wrote:
I didn't have the BRB in front of me so it wasn't verbatim from the rule book but it's still correct.

No, it certainly is not correct.

Apologies if this has been answered already, but is there a firing arc for the lasgun arrays? My friend who plays Guard says that in the codex it only says about firing from different sides.

There isn't a listed arc, so it would be as normal for a weapon on a vehicle, I would imagine. to be specific, if you can point the gun at it, it can shoot it. As these guns are kind of mounted ridiculously, I would prolly play it as a 45 degree angle, as per hull-mounted guns (assuming my opponent was fine with that).

Yes, No, Maybe?

There really is no hard rule and we are not sure if it is a vehicle weapon or not(for weapon destroyed results).

The best way to play it I have found is to treat it exactly like a vehicles weapons(One that just happens to be fired by embarked troops), because it uses the vehicles BS(veterans hit less often). Therefore it can fire in any arc the ball turrets can point to(about 165*+ or so on each side). But that is Purely HIWPI, not RAW(which is completely undefined).

So Just under straight forward on each flank to just under straight back(the way I play it).

Ok, thanks for the responses - I think we'll play it as it can hit what the ball turret can actually be turned to see. I guess it's a bit like the ball turrets on the Fire Raptor.

I'd probably play it similar to the FAQ for the Necron Gauss Flayer Array:

Q: What is the arc of fire for a gauss flayer array? (p53)

A: As it is mounted on the hull it will have a 45 degree arc of fire. However it is slightly unusual in that it has multiple gun barrels. As long as you can draw line of sight along one of them, you can target the unit.

 Ghaz wrote:
I'd probably play it similar to the FAQ for the Necron Gauss Flayer Array:

Q: What is the arc of fire for a gauss flayer array? (p53)

A: As it is mounted on the hull it will have a 45 degree arc of fire. However it is slightly unusual in that it has multiple gun barrels. As long as you can draw line of sight along one of them, you can target the unit.

Forgive me if I am wrong, But aren't the guass flayer arrays in what would be considered a hull mount?

As in, can they(or do they look like the could) freely move or are they in a static position on the model?

Either way I would use that FAQ as precedent(even though the flayers operate differently):
If the Flayers are static, then they are hull mounted and thus a 45* arc. And the non-static Lasguns also follow the vehicles weapons rules Per the FAQ.
If the Flayers mobile, then Both Flayer and Lasguns are 45* arc per the FAQ.

Yes, they are static mounts. The main precedent that I was looking at was if one 'gun' in the array had line of sight then they all would. That is assuming they're all considered one 'weapon' on each side of the Chimera, as I don't have the codex.

 Archive wrote:
Does an Engineseer maintain independent character once he takes servitors. In other words, would I be allowed to take two servitors, then attach the Enginseer to my CCS and embark them all in a chimera?

Yes.

 Ghaz wrote:
Yes, they are static mounts. The main precedent that I was looking at was if one 'gun' in the array had line of sight then they all would. That is assuming they're all considered one 'weapon' on each side of the Chimera, as I don't have the codex.

They are pretty different; The lasguns require 1 passenger per gun fired; So I could see each Lasgun needing LOS on its own.

On the other hand they are all 3/side as 1 array(it is a really complex rule, that is mostly simple but the questions not answered by the rule just about spiral out of control.)

 Kommissar Kel wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:
Yes, they are static mounts. The main precedent that I was looking at was if one 'gun' in the array had line of sight then they all would. That is assuming they're all considered one 'weapon' on each side of the Chimera, as I don't have the codex.

They are pretty different; The lasguns require 1 passenger per gun fired; So I could see each Lasgun needing LOS on its own.

On the other hand they are all 3/side as 1 array(it is a really complex rule, that is mostly simple but the questions not answered by the rule just about spiral out of control.)

Each weapon needs to be able to see separately is how I see it. It's not like a twin-linked weapon where you're really only shooting once, you get to shoot three times so you should need to see three times.

Is the laser array a single weapon or three? Is the profile listed for the whole array or for each individual gun in the array? If the profile is only for the whole array, is there anything in the rules that would allow you to 'split' the array?

 Ghaz wrote:
Is the laser array a single weapon or three? Is the profile listed for the whole array or for each individual gun in the array? If the profile is only for the whole array, is there anything in the rules that would allow you to 'split' the array?

It's kind of like a Hurricane bolter in that it's a single weapon that consists of multiple weapons.

Then I stand by my statement that the FAQ for the Necron Gauss Flayer Array sets the precedent that only one 'weapon' in the Laser Array needs line of sight in order to fire.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:
Is the laser array a single weapon or three? Is the profile listed for the whole array or for each individual gun in the array? If the profile is only for the whole array, is there anything in the rules that would allow you to 'split' the array?

It's kind of like a Hurricane bolter in that it's a single weapon that consists of multiple weapons.

No, it isn't. One Centurion can man a Hurricane bolter. One Centurion could not man 3 lasgun arrays, even with decimator protocols. The two weapons are not similar enough to compare.

It is a single weapon in the same manner that the Gauss Flayer Arrays on the ghost ark are a single weapon.

 Scipio Africanus wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:
Is the laser array a single weapon or three? Is the profile listed for the whole array or for each individual gun in the array? If the profile is only for the whole array, is there anything in the rules that would allow you to 'split' the array?

It's kind of like a Hurricane bolter in that it's a single weapon that consists of multiple weapons.

No, it isn't. One Centurion can man a Hurricane bolter. One Centurion could not man 3 lasgun arrays, even with decimator protocols. The two weapons are not similar enough to compare.

I was thinking about on a vehicle, not in a Space Marine's arm pits. But fair enough.

Looking at the model and looking at the rule again, more closely, I can't imagine too many times that 3 lasguns spaced that closely together (they're like what, an inch, inch and half across for all three?) can't see the same target, but if that some how happened I'd say it'd still probably be treated as a single weapon as the three lasguns are treated as a single lasgun array collectively. Mostly because the Line of Sight arguments over if one of the guns can/can't see something would get a bit ridiculious in most cases.

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
It is a single weapon in the same manner that the Gauss Flayer Arrays on the ghost ark are a single weapon.

Are the gauss flayer arrays fired by the necrons on board a ghost ark?

Because if they are not, they are not alike.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

I was thinking about on a vehicle, not in a Space Marine's arm pits. But fair enough.

Looking at the model and looking at the rule again, more closely, I can't imagine too many times that 3 lasguns spaced that closely together (they're like what, an inch, inch and half across for all three?) can't see the same target, but if that some how happened I'd say it'd still probably be treated as a single weapon as the three lasguns are treated as a single lasgun array collectively. Mostly because the Line of Sight arguments over if one of the guns can/can't see something would get a bit ridiculious in most cases.

Usually it won't be an issue, and most people won't care that much about 6 S3 shots. But, uh, let's pretend it'll matter.

The issue here is that you guys are looking at the Lasgun array as if it were a weapon on the tank. the fact is, it is not a weapon. It is actually a special rule. The Special rule allows you to fire 3 weapons - three lasgun so long as you have 3 infantry in transit to fire them individually. You only fire two lasgun arrays if you don't have 3 guys who are not already firing (for example, a CCS squad of 5 shooting both arrays may only fire 5/6).

As an aside, do we treat six dudes firing 6 lasguns as two sets of three lasguns? We don't, so we don't do that here.

Just because the Laser Array requires three embarked models in order to fire does not invalidate the precedent set by the Gauss Flayer Array. Needing models in order to fire the weapon doesn't change how or where that weapon can fire.

 Ghaz wrote:
Just because the Laser Array requires three embarked models in order to fire does not invalidate the precedent set by the Gauss Flayer Array. Needing models in order to fire the weapon doesn't change how or where that weapon can fire.

Except that the two are not similiar and thus the gauss flayer array cannot be used as a precedent.

One is a weapon, the other is a special rule. The gauss flayer array has NO bearing here.

 Scipio Africanus wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:
Just because the Laser Array requires three embarked models in order to fire does not invalidate the precedent set by the Gauss Flayer Array. Needing models in order to fire the weapon doesn't change how or where that weapon can fire.

Except that the two are not similiar and thus the gauss flayer array cannot be used as a precedent.

One is a weapon, the other is a special rule. The gauss flayer array has NO bearing here.

How aren't they similar? Aside from being reclassified as a Special Rule instead of a Weapon, and aside from requiring embarked passengers, they're practically identical.

Speaking of the Array some more, I had a thought: is it eligible to use for Overwatch? It's being fired by models embarked in a transport which is the only way (without special wargear/options) that a vehicle can Overwatch.

Just one of those "huh" moments is all.

 ClockworkZion wrote:
Speaking of the Array some more, I had a thought: is it eligible to use for Overwatch? It's being fired by models embarked in a transport which is the only way (without special wargear/options) that a vehicle can Overwatch.

Just one of those "huh" moments is all.

Probably not. It is still a vehicle weapon, it just requires embarked models to be fired. Of course the FAQ will probably allow it.