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I'm really considering running the Hellfire pattern (TL Lascannon and Missile Launcher) to solely go after MC's and Tanks. I know that the two TL auto cannons are better, but I'm not too willing to spend the money for the foreworld equivalents or the Aegis defense line to simply throw away the wall (None of my armies can use it).

So, is the Hellfire pattern really that bad? I need long range anti tank/MC in the form of a dreadnought.

I hate to be 'that guy' but it's really not.

For 5 points more you could get a tri-las predator, which, thought it can't move and fire all 3, still has a Tlinked cannon and 2 sponsons and usually survives longer.

if you're really set on dreds though (because, let's face it, they're bad-ass) it's ok, but krak missiles aren't the best at tanks/MC hunting, and a TL lascannon is still only 1 cannon. For a fun and characterful unit for friendly games though, it's ok! just don't expect it to win you matches single-handedly

Ah okay then. I was just truly wondering if it was complete trash or not. So I'm assuming the best tank hunter dread is still the 2 TL auto cannon dread?

Well, I wouldn't say that, best tank hunter dread (imo) is melta drop pod (again for 135 points) the rifledread is good for light transports and makes an ad-hoc anti air unit, but I think it's time has passed.

Ah, thats a damn shame. The poor dreadnought is seeing some hard times nowadays. Thankfully it's still viable in a few areas.

The real problem is that a dreadnought is an elites choice, and elites choices are all about versatility. If you give a dreadnought two guns, then he's not versatile anymore, he's just there for the firepower. Units that are just there for the firepower are what heavy support choices are.

Which makes sense that trying to make a heavy support choice out of an elites choices winds up with something that's not as good of being a heavy support choice as a heavy support choice.

So, my new question is: What is the best set up from the standard dreadnought box. Missile launcher/Assault Cannon? Assault Cannon + Fist?

Something with a fist, or fist-like weapon. Vehicles are bad in close combat. Dreadnoughts aren't, necessarily. That's what most makes dreads different than preds.

If you're willing to get the latest Imperial Armour Space Marines vehicles book you can get a standard dreadnought with dual TLAC, Skyfire and Interceptor for 125pts (Mark V Mortis Dread), standard weaponry is dual ML for cheaper, you can also go with dual TLLC for more pts. It's my ADL/quad-gun replacement, for 25pts more (than the ADL)you get more flexibility (easier to deploy, can be in reinforced terrain for a nice cover save, etc...). Regular SM can take one per detachment, if you're DA you can take as many as you can fit in your Elites slot (per the fluff, DAs were the ones who first used it).

2x TLLC Mortis Dreads all the way! A tad pricey, but fantastic anti-air/armor/MC.

 Demdiddydizzy wrote:
So, my new question is: What is the best set up from the standard dreadnought box. Missile launcher/Assault Cannon? Assault Cannon + Fist?

AC&ML isn't a bad combo. You have two weapons with a flexible range of targets. The real only drawback is the lack of range thanks to the AC but that's still workable with a drop pod.

It works differently than a melta suicide squad, going for HP stripping vs instant kill. This might make it better as a second turn pod for clean up duty.

I agree with the Drop Melta Dread, and use it frequently.

Long range Dreads can be useful, but a single lascannon hit and a single rocket hit just aren't very impressive for the points. You're getting an AV12 firebase that can use cover (not bad), but looses super high strength CC attacks. For the points, you can get the same firepower or better out of a lot of things, like LSTs from FA, or Sternguard Vets with Hvy Weapons. Five Stern with two Lascannons can sit and hug cover and actually probably survive longer, having wounds instead of AV.


For armor hunting, try the Drop Pod idea.

Dread w/ Multi-Melta
(and Heavy Flamer, it's cheap, and why not? Now you can victimize Scouts and Rangers, too!)
Drop Pod

= Not a lot of points for something that can come in almost unerringly behind a nasty vehicle and get a MM shot. Given, it's not twin linked, but has a better chance overall against AV14, for sure.

 phoenix darkus wrote:
If you're willing to get the latest Imperial Armour Space Marines vehicles book you can get a standard dreadnought with dual TLAC, Skyfire and Interceptor for 125pts (Mark V Mortis Dread), standard weaponry is dual ML for cheaper, you can also go with dual TLLC for more pts. It's my ADL/quad-gun replacement, for 25pts more (than the ADL)you get more flexibility (easier to deploy, can be in reinforced terrain for a nice cover save, etc...). Regular SM can take one per detachment, if you're DA you can take as many as you can fit in your Elites slot (per the fluff, DAs were the ones who first used it).

Can you use this in a "normal" game of 40k? i.e. are the Imperial Armour books compatible with your run of the mill game at your FLGS?

Could I do it with my Blood Angels? (It would say in the book, huh?) I'm really trying to think about some anti-air support for my BA...

Anyway, in response to the general Dreadnought query, for us, the best Dreadnought is the Fragnought, brought down in a drop pod. With the Heavy Flamer option, you are getting 3 templates, and it's pretty effective. Because it's a Furioso variant, it's also got slightly better armour. It's not very useful against vehicles or MC, though, so that doesn't help you in that respect.

 Ailaros wrote:
The real problem is that a dreadnought is an elites choice, and elites choices are all about versatility. If you give a dreadnought two guns, then he's not versatile anymore, he's just there for the firepower. Units that are just there for the firepower are what heavy support choices are.

Which makes sense that trying to make a heavy support choice out of an elites choices winds up with something that's not as good of being a heavy support choice as a heavy support choice.

If you are not playing super competitive people who demand absolute WYSIWYG I enjoy playing my Space Marines as Iron Hands, if that is the case, you can take Dreds as Heavy support.

Its a fun way of mixing things up. I have loads of dreds that I never use becuase they kinda suck, but sometimes I run my Ultramaines as IH just for the fun of playing with loads of dreds, you can make good lists too because you can still take some Elites. I made a fun 1500 point list with 4 dreds, some Termies and LOTD and it was pretty hard to beat too, the 6+ FNP really pays for itself over the course of a game, and IWND if awesome for your SM Captain and the Dreds.

Its not uber competitive, but its effective and a really fun way to play with the ever awesome but not particularly good Dred.

Being a Sons of Medusa Player I either always field a Master of the Forge, or am playing as Clan raukaan.

As such I always field 4 Dreads, 2 each of Asscannon/Storm bolter and MM/HF, They and my Storm Talon are my only vehicles. I rarely lose more than 1 vehicle per game(although that might be opponent quality) because I put several other units out there in harms way saturating my opponents with targets.

Nice. I really like that, especially the Iron Hands variation where it again ties in with the fluff.

I have 4 BA Dreads as well--one with the Frag Cannon, one with MM/HF, one Death Company (actually falls in the Troops category!) one with talons, and one Librarian. It is fun to trot them all out together, but it's cool that you're finding them pretty durable, @Kel.

One of the best uses for dreads is a double - heavy flamer ironclad in a droppod. Instead of shooty regular dreads you don't feel like: "I know that i could have taken someone who fills this role better for the same points but i just love dreads...". Ironclad is tough having 13 front and side armor. It's gona burn the hell out of infantry and threaten the backfield and it WILL draw attention and frighten the small guyz out of their cozy ruins.

However, if you're eager to take a regular dread, i'd go with Assault Cannon+Fist or Lazcannon+Ml for backfield heavy support.

I actually am running an Iron Hands Drop Pod army with Ironclad dreadnoughts up the whazoo. I hope to have at least 3 by 1500pts.

Because Ironclads with IWND is stupid and beautiful.

I know about the classical MM/HF combo (from my salamanders), but I guess if I had to build out of the standard box I guess I'm gonna have to go Ass cannon/Power fist.

Kinda sad, but the first kind of dreadnought I fell in love with. Maybe giving it a HF would be nice to mop up light infantry?