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 Commander_Farsight wrote:


IMO IKs are overrated. Now that is biased a little by the fact that I play a full melta Farsight Bomb so I chew one up and spit it out every turn. Seriously though. If you avoid close combat, there is not that good of an armor ment on it. It's not worth taking 3 to me just to overkill infantry and not be able to touch most tanks. (Unless you take the Melta Knight but most people don't take it if you field 1 or 2

As I recall, you just barely finished the last HP off my Imperial Knight using 12 Fusion Blasters + Shadowsun's 2 w/ buff suit. Now imagine going up against 5 Knight Errants (melta blast) in 1850pts, 3 of them having the Adamantine Lance formation for re-roll invulns, re-roll charge range, and D3 Hammer of Wrath hits. There very few army lists out there than can counter or take out that many Imperial Knights.

 SabrX wrote:

 Commander_Farsight wrote:


IMO IKs are overrated. Now that is biased a little by the fact that I play a full melta Farsight Bomb so I chew one up and spit it out every turn. Seriously though. If you avoid close combat, there is not that good of an armor ment on it. It's not worth taking 3 to me just to overkill infantry and not be able to touch most tanks. (Unless you take the Melta Knight but most people don't take it if you field 1 or 2

As I recall, you just barely finished the last HP off my Imperial Knight using 12 Fusion Blasters + Shadowsun's 2 w/ buff suit. Now imagine going up against 5 Knight Errants (melta blast) in 1850pts, 3 of them having the Adamantine Lance formation for re-roll invulns, re-roll charge range, and D3 Hammer of Wrath hits. There very few army lists out there than can counter or take out that many Imperial Knights.

I agree with what you are saying. My point more so is that maybe such a broad statement was a little bit out of line, but if there was any list that had a good shot of having a chance I would say Farsight Bomb and full Melta Drop Pods would be some of the lists that would stand a better chance than your normal TAC army. In general I would say take out 2-3 if you can and then try to play around them as best as possible. If you have 3 Riptides and your getting your 3+ Invuln off and if you dont you still have a 5+, they are very good against the blast as its only one hit. if you want to shoot every blast at one riptide then i would say that overkilling a riptide is fine because you get a face full of melta. My point here is that i would think Tau have one of the better shots against them, and the way to beat them is to make them less devastating every turn, but play the objective game. If you have to play kill points against them, you army has my condolences, and so do you.

I can say from experience that a pure IK army is a nightmare to play against. I had a hard enough time playing against 3 IK's run by an inexperienced general. I'm not sure how to beat a 5 IK list run by an experienced general.

BTW, at the ATC just recently, I believe 3 of the top 10 armies there were IK armies.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 whembly wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
My predictions:

Imperial Knights
Eldar
Marines

Oh... good call. I'll have to second that.

How prevalent are Imperial Knights at tournaments? 1-2 as allies or 4-5 entire army?

1-2 people can handle. It's the 4-5 IK army which will be a nightmare for most armies to play against.

I don't think they will be too prevalent, but it's the 4-5 IK armies that you will see at the top.

 mortetvie wrote:

 Commander_Farsight wrote:

 Dozer Blades wrote:
Not Tau.

Why?

Because neither Jim or I are playing Tau .

I also didn't list Necrons as my top 3 and that is because I will not be running Necrons either.





Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Commander_Farsight wrote:

 mortetvie wrote:

 Commander_Farsight wrote:

 Dozer Blades wrote:
Not Tau.

Why?

Because neither Jim or I are playing Tau .

Oh ho! I will smack you down tomorrow night then with my Tau!

This I got to see. I'll bring the popcorn.

BTW, don't know if you saw my battle against Mortetvie recently, but here it is:


2000 Jy2's AV13-spam Necrons vs Mortetvie's Eldar

I don't think there is much hope for Tau finishing in the top 3. They didn't get any major perks with the advent of 7th edition.

I'm curious as to how things will turn out with the option to take a Lord of War.

 Dozer Blades wrote:
I don't think there is much hope for Tau finishing in the top 3. They didn't get any major perks with the advent of 7th edition.

Agreed.

Tau can potentially be a Top5 army but currently, I'd be hard pressed to call them a Top3 army.

Hollismason wrote:
I'm curious as to how things will turn out with the option to take a Lord of War.

With the exception of IK armies or IK allies, I promise you no other LoW army list will make it to the Top10.

Now they might if they had large, cover-ignoring weaponry, but all of those super-heavies are banned from this tournament.

Greater brass scorpion if khorne is allowed and it has a 5" s10 ap2 weapon that ignores cover!

The Barbed Hierodule has some weird gak as well but I always get it confused with other models.

 mortetvie wrote:
Greater brass scorpion if khorne is allowed and it has a 5" s10 ap2 weapon that ignores cover!

At least that isn't a Massive/Apocalyptic blast or a Hellstorm weapon.

Hollismason wrote:
The Barbed Hierodule has some weird gak as well but I always get it confused with other models.

It only has 12 S10 shots. Otherwise, it isn't anything special really.

You'll probably see InControl run it at the BAO. He's (the BH) not that scary.

 jy2 wrote:

Hollismason wrote:
The Barbed Hierodule has some weird gak as well but I always get it confused with other models.

It only has 12 S10 shots. Otherwise, it isn't anything special really.

You'll probably see InControl run it at the BAO. He's (the BH) not that scary.

Well, 2 Biocannons so it could do 6 shots to two targets if it wanted to. It's BS3 though, so half the time it hits. It's also T8 with 6 wounds, so think of it as trying to kill a Wraith Knight with a much nastier gun.

 jy2 wrote:
I can say from experience that a pure IK army is a nightmare to play against. I had a hard enough time playing against 3 IK's run by an inexperienced general. I'm not sure how to beat a 5 IK list run by an experienced general.

BTW, at the ATC just recently, I believe 3 of the top 10 armies there were IK armies.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 whembly wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
My predictions:

Imperial Knights
Eldar
Marines

Oh... good call. I'll have to second that.

How prevalent are Imperial Knights at tournaments? 1-2 as allies or 4-5 entire army?

1-2 people can handle. It's the 4-5 IK army which will be a nightmare for most armies to play against.

I don't think they will be too prevalent, but it's the 4-5 IK armies that you will see at the top.

Just from a match up perspective, I wonder how a full Ravenwing* with melta spam can take on 4-5 IK army?

 jy2 wrote:

 Dozer Blades wrote:
I don't think there is much hope for Tau finishing in the top 3. They didn't get any major perks with the advent of 7th edition.

Agreed.

Tau can potentially be a Top5 army but currently, I'd be hard pressed to call them a Top3 army.

Hollismason wrote:
I'm curious as to how things will turn out with the option to take a Lord of War.

With the exception of IK armies or IK allies, I promise you no other LoW army list will make it to the Top10.

Now they might if they had large, cover-ignoring weaponry, but all of those super-heavies are banned from this tournament.

I hope you post some pics and brief reports, really always look forward to reading your Battelreports.

Yea I played against a 4 IK army in 6th and it was insane. Now in 7th I would just pray I don't draw that type of army list early lol. 7's to explode and 6 HP's is just too brutal to face with almost any TAC list.

 jy2 wrote:

 mortetvie wrote:
Greater brass scorpion if khorne is allowed and it has a 5" s10 ap2 weapon that ignores cover!

At least that isn't a Massive/Apocalyptic blast or a Hellstorm weapon.

The Fellblade has a t/l S8 AP3 massive blast weapon and a Demolisher Cannon, can take an upgrade to make them both ignore cover, and is allowed.

How does Scryer's gaze work with the Modified Maelstrom:missions?

Can they re-roll one of the dice?

Knights have some serious weaknesses, especially all-knight armies. Not only can many armies kill a couple early on, their firepower is relatively mundane for the points invested, and they are very, very easily movement blocked (especially if playing at a tournament that hasn't made up rules allowing them further transit through difficult terrain). Better players simply kill one or two as able, and then focus on mission while preventing them from going anywhere with throwaways. Giant bases that can't tank shock or jump struggle with life in the world of warhammer.

More well-rounded armies with paired knight support are a much bigger pain to deal with.

MVBrandt wrote:
Knights have some serious weaknesses, especially all-knight armies. Not only can many armies kill a couple early on, their firepower is relatively mundane for the points invested, and they are very, very easily movement blocked (especially if playing at a tournament that hasn't made up rules allowing them further transit through difficult terrain). Better players simply kill one or two as able, and then focus on mission while preventing them from going anywhere with throwaways. Giant bases that can't tank shock or jump struggle with life in the world of warhammer.

More well-rounded armies with paired knight support are a much bigger pain to deal with.

Perfect. I was going to ask you about the clear rAW 3d6 take the highest, as I didn't see it in the FAQ.

Should also mention, as nigh invulnerable as Adamantine Lance makes three Knights, it also makes them move together, whit his extraordinarily cumbersome.

Wish I could have been able to throw down with you gentlemen this weekend but the 2nd Founding of my army isn’t up tournament table top standards just yet. Will definitely make my way over there on Saturday in hopes of grabbing some swag and saying hi.

Headin' for San Jose, and packing deodorant and Irish Spring.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

AirConditioning or not, do not be a contributor to Nurgle-clouds.

 Brothererekose wrote:
Headin' for San Jose, and packing deodorant and Irish Spring.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

Deodorant.

AirConditioning or not, do not be a contributor to Nurgle-clouds.

Trolling your opponents before the weekend even begins? I like it Casey. The Mods may not, but I approve.

MVB which factions provide the best support for Knights ?

Good luck and have fun to all the participants

For the spectators, live pairings, results, and scores available on ToF:

http://www.torrentoffire.com/5345/live-updates-bay-area-open

Interesting Chart!

Still calling Tyranids for the win.

Will there be any live stream ?

I would like to watch.

Strong showing for Team Kittens going into round 3.

Interesting match ups, to bad can't use it to look at army lists.

Hollismason wrote:
Interesting Chart!

Still calling Tyranids for the win.

I pray that it is so! I notice on ToF that iNcontrol (Geoff from many FLG batreps) is 3-0 with Tyranids. Very impressive! I'm rooting for you buddy!

Yeah I just saw or at least I think it's correct in saying he won versus Seerstar in the last round, I think round 3 is over with. I'm mainly paying attention as I want my prediction to come true for the Top 3 Being Chaos Daemons, Eldar , Tyranids , with Tyranids taking the tournament overall. I think top 2 players w/ be Tyranids coming out of the 3rd round.

Hollismason wrote:
Yeah I just saw or at least I think it's correct in saying he won versus Seerstar in the last round, I think round 3 is over with. I'm mainly paying attention as I want my prediction to come true for the Top 3 Being Chaos Daemons, Eldar , Tyranids , with Tyranids taking the tournament overall. I think top 2 players w/ be Tyranids coming out of the 3rd round.

Yes sir! Tyranids appear to be leading after round 3 and in a tie with Space Marines/Knights for second place! Wow! Now, please don't make the bugs play eachother...