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This topic has been done many times before, but I'm still confused about the origin some of the Primarch names.

Fulgrim, Rogal Dorn, Roboute Guilliman and Leman.

I've never been aware of anything specific with those guys, sometimes stuff is just made up...

Tried Google translating some of them

Apparently a leman is a lover or sweetheart.

Magnus is Latin for great, mighty, and loud

Ferrus Manus in Latin translates to Iron Hand

Corax is Latin for raven

Guilliman is possibly a play on this guy: Robert Gillman Allen Jackson, th UN's "master of logistics", lol.

konrad curze is named for joseph conrad, author of 'heart of darkness', upon which the film 'apocalypse now'was based. the antagonist of heart of darkness was a man named kurtz, so i always figured that's how his last name should be pronounced. the bit about the imperium sending an assassin after him, and his acceptance of his fate, is also drawn from the story. furthermore, nostromo is the eponymous anti-hero of one of conrad's novels, which is very similar to kurze's homeworld of nostramo.

vulcan was the roman god of the forge.

as noted, corvus corax is the binomial term for the common raven.

for leman russ, the russ could refer to russia, whose people traditionally identified themselves as russ, pronounced like 'roosh' for a long time.

aside from others already mentioned, like ferrus manus, that's all i've got off the top of my head.

Horus= Egyptian Hero God
Sangunius= Latin for blood
Magnus= Latin for great
Angron= play on angry, or Greek Agrion (meaning wild)
Corax= Common Raven Latin
Ferrus Manus= Iron Hands in Latin
Peturabo= A play on to Perturb. Or to anger.
Rogal Dorn: Rogal sounds like Regal, and Dorn is German for thorn
Alpharius Omegon: The Alpha and Omega. First and Last.
Vulcan: God of the forge and volcanoes.
Lion Johnson: Named after a writer.
The Khan: Genghis Khan and Mongol rulers in general

 ThePrimordial wrote:
The Khan: Genghis Khan and Mongol rulers in general

Actually, he's more specifically derived from Chagatai Khan, who was Genghis's son.

Perturabo may also be a play on latin perdurabo (to resist, I think)
Fulgrim should be basd on fulgur, lightning

I dunno where Lemen comes from, but Russ likely comes from the old viking ruled medieval state of Rus.

which eventually became russia. Although Lemen Russ' back story actually owes more to the roman myth of Romulas and Remus.

lol why are you guys bringing up names I didn't ask for

Leman Russ used to be Leman of the Rus but where did Leman come from? Le Man, perhaps?

I heard that Guilliman is named after some historical monk, who is this monk?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
by the way, is Fulgrim pronounced as Full-grim of Foul-grim?

Maximus Bitch wrote:
lol why are you guys bringing up names I didn't ask for

Some people don't know the etymology of the other primarchs and may be curious. Some have posted about the ones you were looking for. I think Guilliman and Dorn have been explained and there's been a few theories on Leman Russ' etymology.

One theory I've heard for Leman Russ is that it was named after one of the GW studio named Russel Mann, however there is nobody of that credit in the RT rulebook where Leman Russ first appeared (unlike playtester Pete Cantor, for whom Pedro Kantor is named).

There was a WW1 Belgian General named Leman:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gérard_Leman
It's pretty tenuous, but his action in the war was fort related, and the example Space Marine Fortress Monastery in the RT rulebook was the Space Wolves one (though no battles involving it were mentioned IIRC).

Russ means 'Little Red one' from Old French
Leman means 'Lovely' or 'Willing'


Perhaps as the emperors puppy, he was a willing little ginger pup who wanted to do the Emperors bidding.



Lousy space pups

 Wulfmar wrote:
Russ means 'Little Red one' from Old French
Leman means 'Lovely' or 'Willing'


Perhaps as the emperors puppy, he was a willing little ginger pup who wanted to do the Emperors bidding.



Lousy space pups

I guess Fulgrim and Roboute Guilliman was GW's way of trying to give the Primarchs French and german names after giving them so many latin names.

 Kerrathyr wrote:
Perturabo may also be a play on latin perdurabo (to resist, I think)
Fulgrim should be basd on fulgur, lightning

Wouldn't that be way more in line with Dorn. Because of his fortifying everything style.

 Wulfmar wrote:
Russ means 'Little Red one' from Old French
Leman means 'Lovely' or 'Willing'


Perhaps as the emperors puppy, he was a willing little ginger pup who wanted to do the Emperors bidding.



Lousy space pups

or a play on Little Riding Hood and the Bad Wolf?

 Vector Strike wrote:

 Wulfmar wrote:
Russ means 'Little Red one' from Old French
Leman means 'Lovely' or 'Willing'


Perhaps as the emperors puppy, he was a willing little ginger pup who wanted to do the Emperors bidding.



Lousy space pups

or a play on Little Riding Hood and the Bad Wolf?

Just a thought. Couldn't the burning of Prospero be also related to that considering Magnus the RED is being chased by Leman Russ, the space WOLF?

Actually, looking at it, it does kind of look like a play on Red Riding Hood. What reason would they choose that though?

morpheuschild wrote:
konrad curze is named for joseph conrad, author of 'heart of darkness', upon which the film 'apocalypse now'was based. the antagonist of heart of darkness was a man named kurtz, so i always figured that's how his last name should be pronounced. the bit about the imperium sending an assassin after him, and his acceptance of his fate, is also drawn from the story. furthermore, nostromo is the eponymous anti-hero of one of conrad's novels, which is very similar to kurze's homeworld of nostramo.

vulcan was the roman god of the forge.

as noted, corvus corax is the binomial term for the common raven.

for leman russ, the russ could refer to russia, whose people traditionally identified themselves as russ, pronounced like 'roosh' for a long time.

aside from others already mentioned, like ferrus manus, that's all i've got off the top of my head.

In the newish audio story Hunter's Moon, the Space Wolf character in the story speaks of Leman Russ as "Leman of the Russ", with an "oo" sound for the u.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Roboute Guilliman always reminded me of the name of the actor Robert Guillaume, although I doubt there's any connection at all.

I really don't think it's Leman of the Russians - There aren't any other links in their background to Russia and it makes no sense. The Space Wolves are VERY Scandinavian and so I reckon links to the Norse are closer. I don't think it has anything to do with a handful of Norse settlements in Russia

Heck, even THIS Scandinavian meaning of Russ has more validity than the Russia link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russ

Leman of the drunken rowdy students


In fact, even that joke link fits in nicely with other terms used in the Space Wolves Lexicon such as the Rout - which among other thinks means 'the rabble' or 'the mob'



Thinking about the little red ridinghood link - I think that's rather entertaining.

Little Red Riding Hood Vs The Big Bad Wolf
Magnus (Large/Great) the Red Vs The Pretty Little Wolf

Bear in mind all the viking stuff was retconned in towards the end of RT, whilst Leman Russ' name dates from the 1st edition rulebook itself.

Leman Russ was originally just an Imperial general right? Hence why the tank is named after him. So maybe it *was* a Russian reference. Russian tanks, anyone?

He was the example Space Marine Commander, though he was stated to have been instrumental in founding the Space Wolves. He rose to prominence during the Lucan Crusade, was appointed Adeptus Terra Special Agent then appointed Imperial Commander Lucan (obligatory note: In RT every Space Marine Chapter Master held the Adeptus Terra rank of Imperial Commander, at no point was Leman Russ ever stated to have been a part of the Imperial Army/Guard).

He was never stated to have anything to do with tanks, the name of the tank is one of those little mysteries, along with why the Baneblade and Shadowsword - which appeared about the same time - were initially called the Falchion and Glaive only to have their names inexplicably changed a few months later.

 ThePrimordial wrote:

 Kerrathyr wrote:
Perturabo may also be a play on latin perdurabo (to resist, I think)
Fulgrim should be basd on fulgur, lightning

Wouldn't that be way more in line with Dorn. Because of his fortifying everything style.

Well, Iron Warriors are also well versed into siege and fortifications, if I remember correctly.

Anyways, to sum up/reorder things:

1. Lion El'Jonson from Lionel Johnson, english poet who wrote "the dark angel"
2. Expunged from Imperial databases
3. Fulgrim from latin fulgur (lightning) and spanish fulgor (dazzlimng, brightness)... Trivia: phoenicians were the first to use purple (main livery colour of the Emperor's Children)
4. Perturabo, from Alesteir Crowley's motto "frater, perdurabo" (brother, I shall endure)
5. Jaghatai Khan, from the second son of the Genghis
6. Leman Russ... Rus are 'those who row' in (old) Norse. Freki & Geri are Odin's wolves.
7. Rogal Dorn from a variant of regal/royal and dorn which is 'stronghold' in old english and 'fist' in gaelic (royal fist, primarch of the imperial fists!)
8. Konrad Curze from Joseph Conrad (author of 'heart of darkness') and apocalypse now's Kurtz. Notably callidus assassin M'shen reflects Martin Sheen, who assassinates the colonel in the film
9. Sanguinius from latin sanguinis (blood). Also, italian 'sanguigno' means passionate and prone to outbursts (black rage anyone?)
10. Ferrus Manus from latin ferrus (iron) and manus (4th declination,has singular and plural identical, meaning hand/hands) (so iron hand, primarch of the iron hands!)
11. Expunged from imperial databases
12. Angron from anger (but I think there is a god of destruction with a similar sound,like Angri, Argri, orsomething similar)
13. Roboute Guilliman may remind of Robert C. Guillemin, street artist who used acrylics, but it seems that Rick Priestley made up a name that sounded like a West Indian revolutionary in some French colony...
14. Mortarion from latin mors (death)
15. Magnus the Red, from latin magnus (great) and Albert Magnus, who willed coexistence of religion and science. Red.... Well he was sol 'coloured'...
16. Horus Lupercal from egyptian god Horus and latin lupercal (the cave where romulus and remus were raised by a wolf)
17. Lorgar probably from afghan loy (great) ghar (mountain); prophets in old testament receive the Word on great mountains...
18. Vulkan from latin god of fire and smithing
19. Corvus Corax is the species name for the raven
20. Alpharius Omegon from alpha and omega (beginning and end)

Leman translates from sweedish as gentleman.

Seems like Lucan got corrupted into Leman.

Maybe he should've been called Remus Russ.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Fulgrim and lorgar are real names though

I don't remember who said this before - and if you pop up on this thread, all credit goes to you for pointing this out a long time ago - but Alpharius and Omegon are not named for the First and the Last. Rather, they are named after the star Alpha Hydra - or Alphard - which is the brightest star in the Hydra constellation but is actually an optical double star as there is a star behind Alphard which we didn't identify til not too long ago. So the perceived brightness of Alphard is actually that of two stars and not just one.

I never actually bothered to check if it's true, but if it is, it looks as one of the more interesting primarch name etymologies in my opinion. (And I deliberately plead ignorance to keep it so, lol)

 soupfly wrote:
Leman translates from sweedish as gentleman.

As a Swede, no, no it doesn't, no matter what Google Translate tells you.

Damn it, and I was told the internet never lied

 soupfly wrote:
Damn it, and I was told the internet never lied

As Abraham Lincoln said, never believe any quote you read on the internet.

I'm always a bit baffled when people say Angron is derived from Anger/Angry but then go on to say Lorgar's name is derived from an obscure foreign word for mountain which I doubt anyone at GW knows, surely its far more likely to have simply been a play on the word Lore.