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It seems that when I compose a detachment, only restriction is that units must belong to same faction:


FACTIONS
All units belong to one of the many Factions that are fighting in the 41st Millennium. This will often be represented on the unit’s Army List Entry with a symbol, the key for which can be found to the right. A unit’s Faction applies regardless of how you choose your army, but is especially relevant to Detachments because many state that you can only include units of a particular Faction. Factions are also used when including Allies, and some special rules will apply only to specific Factions. Note that Fortifications are an exception in that, unless otherwise stated on their datasheet, they do not have a Faction.

In the case of older publications, the Faction of all the units described in a codex is the same as the codex’s title. In the case of codex supplements, the Faction of all the units described in that publication is the same as the codex it is a supplement of.


ARMY LIST ENTRIES IN DIFFERENT PUBLICATIONS
There are a few units whose Army List Entries are presented in more than one Games Workshop publication. Daemon Princes, for example, are presented in both Codex: Chaos Daemons and Codex: Chaos Space Marines. In these instances, the unit’s Faction is determined by whichever codex it was chosen from. Be sure to keep track of which is which if you decide to take one from more than one source.


RESTRICTIONS
This section of the Detachment lists any additional restrictions that apply to the units you can include as part of this Detachment. If an Army List Entry does not adhere to a particular restriction, it cannot be included as part of this particular Detachment. For example, in order to include a Combined Arms Detachment, all of its Army List Entries must have the same Faction.

If a Detachment does not list any Restrictions then it has none.


COMBINED ARMS DETACHMENTb
Restrictions
All units chosen must have the same Faction (or have no Faction).


ALLIED DETACHMENT
Restrictions
This Detachment cannot be your Primary Detachment.
Your Warlord can never be chosen from this Detachment.
All units chosen must have the same Faction (or no Faction).
All units chosen must have a different Faction to any of the units in your Primary Detachment (or no Faction).


Rulebook seems pretty clear about it.
Despite this "clearity" I think its not what they had in mind.
Please, give me a goos reason to not misc all units from my chaos codex sulìpplements. Say me anywhere in rulebook ther's a sentence that deny me to do that...

Nope, as I understand it (and, honestly, you're typing/spelling is a little off, so I may have misunderstood what you're saying) under 7th rules, you can indeed take units from say, Crimson Slaughter as part of a CA CSM detachment.

If you are saying that the rules as written allow battle forged armies to have any units from the codex in any number you are mistaken. See page 120.

"1) Force Organization Chart
This shows the number of units of each battlefield role that you may include in this detachment. Black boxes are choices you must include to take this detachment, whilst grey boxes are optional choices."

In other words page 120 states that the diagram on page 122 outlines what unit roles by number are permitted.

azreal13 wrote:Nope, as I understand it (and, honestly, you're typing/spelling is a little off, so I may have misunderstood what you're saying) under 7th rules, you can indeed take units from say, Crimson Slaughter as part of a CA CSM detachment.

CrosisDePurger wrote:If you are saying that the rules as written allow battle forged armies to have any units from the codex in any number you are mistaken. See page 120.

"1) Force Organization Chart
This shows the number of units of each battlefield role that you may include in this detachment. Black boxes are choices you must include to take this detachment, whilst grey boxes are optional choices."

In other words page 120 states that the diagram on page 122 outlines what unit roles by number are permitted.

I'm saying for my battle-forge army I can create a single combined detachment with units taken by different supplements.

example:
HQ:
Lord from Chaos Spase Marine Codex
Troops
Cultists from Crimson Supplement
Cultists from Crimson Supplement
Heavy Support
Obliterators from Black Legion Supplement

etc.
etc.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
it was alredy discussed.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/600590.page

I found it only now..

I see. It seems clear to me that you can do that.

Have you even read the crimson slaughter rules?

The bonuses and penalties of crimson slaughter are for "units within a crimson slaughter detachment" (same goes for any other supplement.

If it has a mix of units from regular codex and crimson slaughter its obviously not a crimson slaughter detachment.

Either you can designate a detachment as "crimson slaughter", therefor effecting every unit in it without leaving you choice, or you cant-and by that you can never use anything in any supplement.

Jeeese...why do everyone keep reading from one source to judge how another source works. read the damn thing you are interacting with too!
You follow the BRB rules just fine, but you ignore the supplement rules themselves.
I might as well have crisis suits and stealth suits in the same team, the BRB does not forbid it. (the codex does)

Some rules from Supplements:
Farsight: Note that you can only use the options from one codex supplement when choosing your army.
Iyanden: Note that you can only use the options from one codex supplement when choosing your army.
Black Legion: Note that you can only use the options from one codex supplement when choosing a detachment.
Sentinels Of Terra: Note that you can only use the options from one codex supplement when choosing a detachment.
Claun Raukaan. When choosing a Clan Raukaan detachment, you may only use the Iron Hands Chapter Tactics.
Crimson Slaughter: no note about this.

So you can use units from codex and a single supplement in a single detachment (so you can use a codex plus a supplement?).

In future if there will be a new chaos supplement without this note you could use units from this supplement and Crimson Slaughter supplement and base codex.

----------------------

Another point is the one regarding this rule:
"In the case of codex supplements, the Faction of all the units described in that publication is the same as the codex it is a supplement of."

Supplements does not describe new units.. they only use the ones of the base codex plus same rule change..

 BoomWolf wrote:

The bonuses and penalties of crimson slaughter are for "units within a crimson slaughter detachment" (same goes for any other supplement.

I think you are right but the real question is: what is a "Crimson Slaughter Detachment"? or what is a "Black Legion Detachment"?

Is it really relevant WHAT they are?

They are a requirement.
Either a detachment IS or it ISNT one, there is no other option.

If it IS, then its rules apply to anything in it, if it ISNT then you cannot apply its rules to any single unit in it.


So you are left with two options.
Go raw, and by raw you can never ever access any supplement rules as there is no definition of what IS a "supplement detachment"
Or aceppt the RAI that a "supplement detachment" is simply a detachment of any type that is designated as that supplement, much like yo designate a codex normally.

Any other argument is so weak it wont even fly in the USA's idiotic court of law.

In order to have the units or special rules from Crimson Slaughter you must have a Crimson slaughter detachment(whatever that is); this is specified in the first page of the crimson slaughter rules.

As near as we can tell a Crimson slaughter detachment would be either a CAD or and Allied Detachment that you specify at the beginning of list creation to be a Crimson slaughter detachment, and then you follow all the requirements and gain all the benefits found in the crimson slaughter supplement.

Detachment in 6th is not the same as 7th. raw its legal but you must follow the rules of the where you purchase the unit from. For instance if its a black legion unit they must have veterans of the long war etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Furthermore the rules the op outlined also mean we may never take supplement forces as allies to thier parent codex.

 Bausk wrote:
Detachment in 6th is not the same as 7th. raw its legal but you must follow the rules of the where you purchase the unit from. For instance if its a black legion unit they must have veterans of the long war etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Furthermore the rules the op outlined also mean we may never take supplement forces as allies to thier parent codex.

Some of the supplements have been changed to their detachments as of 7th.

RAW you cannot use the supplements at all.

The only work around that makes them usable and follows the rest of RAW(and supported by the Ork supplement) is that they are all or nothing.

I'm with Kommissar Kel on this one,
The Ork Supplement has proven we now have a way to determine if something is a 'supplement Codex,' at least Ork related ones.
That way makes all 6th edition Supplements useless as they lack these instructions... so please, house-rule it so Sixth Edition Supplements can use the default Rulebook Detachments.

The only thing I disagree with Kel on is that one can't mix Supplement and mother Codex Units, though he is more then correct in pointing out that the Rules are Detachment based since the Frequently Asked Questions. This does mean it is a matter of schematics, as the reason one would want to use those Models is to gain access to those very Rules, but it is still legal to mix Supplement and Codex Models in the same Detachment. It might be required for certain Supplements in order to access Models from the mother Codex that are not mentioned at all in the Supplement, such as Longstriker and other named Models not out-right restricted.

JinxDragon wrote:
I'm with Kommissar Kel on this one,
The Ork Supplement has proven we now have a way to determine if something is a 'supplement Codex,' at least Ork related ones.
That way makes all 6th edition Supplements useless as they lack these instructions... so please, house-rule it so Sixth Edition Supplements can use the default Rulebook Detachments.

The only thing I disagree with Kel on is that one can't mix Supplement and mother Codex Units, though he is more then correct in pointing out that the Rules are Detachment based since the Frequently Asked Questions. This does mean it is a matter of schematics, as the reason one would want to use those Models is to gain access to those very Rules, but it is still legal to mix Supplement and Codex Models in the same Detachment. It might be required for certain Supplements in order to access Models from the mother Codex that are not mentioned at all in the Supplement, such as Longstriker and other named Models not out-right restricted.

Lack of Longstrike restrictions matters just as much as having Harker in a Cadian army(I have a scratchbuilt cadian harker from before he became over costed), not at all.

In fact there is no issue at all with having Longstrike in a Farsight Enclave as he would not fall under any of the requirements and restrictions of the farsight enclaves.

Nice to hear.

In the case of older publications, the Faction of all the units described in a codex is the same as the codex’s title. In the case of codex supplements, the Faction of all the units described in that publication is the same as the codex it is a supplement of.

I need more coffee.

yes.