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Look back to the 2nd Ed Goff Orks. They were basically doing squats, glutes perfectly parallel to the ground. FEEL THE BURN.

The Marines weren't much better, actually!

Most of GW miniatures use heroic scale where proportions are deliberately blown up for certain features of the depicted thing to make them stand out more. If you compare the Metal IG range to the current Cadians you will see that for example the mordian are a lot smaller in the body and look closer to normal proportions (although I feel the weapon is still a tad big on the miniatures) again if they were made to true scale imagine how often the little guys guns would break off or snap on particular areas where there just isn't enough material. The vehicles are also scaled to their appropriate factions in the sense that you can place a space marine next to the rhino and it would not be larger than it or look like at least one would be able to fit in it. Again they deliberately made the vehicles the size they are for more a practical reason. Think how big the rhino would have to be if you actually wanted it scaled so it could fit 10 tactical marines in it . I would hate lugging even a couple of them down to my local store for a game. As much as people like to bash GW they do know some stuff with regards to miniature production

Marines should be taller, going by the fluff.
As for poses, MFA is opposed to the epic poses GW like these days.

Vehicles are intentionally smaller than they should be. I think it's supposedly ~60%.

Marines are about 10-15% too small. However, I'm not convinced that the vehicles are drastically off scale. FW has listed measurements of most vehicles in the game, and it seems they are based on the same scale as the infantry; I find their numbers pretty credible. Real tanks are not as big people seem to think.

 Crimson wrote:
Marines are about 10-15% too small. However, I'm not convinced that the vehicles are drastically off scale. FW has listed measurements of most vehicles in the game, and it seems they are based on the same scale as the infantry; I find their numbers pretty credible. Real tanks are not as big people seem to think.

unless they need to carry 5-10 giant supersoldiers.

 Selym wrote:

unless they need to carry 5-10 giant supersoldiers.

Well, heroic proportions, bases and poses make hard to asses how much space the Marines would take in 'reality'. I'm sure the models would not fit (then again, ages ago I've seen ten marines modelled into the old, smaller, Rhino, so it could be possible...)

I said this in an another thread, but I repeat it here:
M113 is 4.86 metres and is meant for 13 people. It is pretty similar shape to the Rhino, but much smaller. FW lists Rhino to be 6.6 metres. Rhino is 1.4 times as long, 1.7 as wide and 2 times as tall (over four and half times the volume!) as M113. So it doesn't seem completely impossible to me that the Marines could fit.

The amount of space taken up by a seated Marine compared to a Guardsman is wildly different. A Marine's backpack alone is the equivalent of a Human torso. A Marine's shoulder pads make it at least a metre wide.
5 Marines side-by-side are getting close to the 6.6m length of a Rhino.

Since RT, GW has stated that their vehicles were scaled-down to fit on the table better.

 Skinnereal wrote:

Since RT, GW has stated that their vehicles were scaled-down to fit on the table better.

Then why they publish statistics of their vehicles which indicate that this is not the case?

 Crimson wrote:

 Skinnereal wrote:

Since RT, GW has stated that their vehicles were scaled-down to fit on the table better.

Then why they publish statistics of their vehicles which indicate that this is not the case?

Stats are fluff, where-as model sizes may not match existing models.

Games Workshop miniatures are designed to be heroically scale, meaning that parts of the model such as hands, heads, feet and weapons, with Cadian IG having this style more than others. This was done because said parts were too smaller and fragile to be properly used for 40k but improved material and casting technology means the older models look weirdly proportioned when compared to more modern styrene mouldings by Warlord and AFV club.

 Skinnereal wrote:

Stats are fluff, where-as model sizes may not match existing models.

I'm not sure I understood that sentence.

I think this is from some old WD, I'm not sure:


FW books have similar charts, and the numbers are pretty much the same. Leman Russ is a bit over 7 metres long (this is the length of the hull, as it doesn't vary between different variants.) The model is about 12 cm long. This is pretty exactly in scale with the infantry models. So I do not know where this idea that 40K vehicles are not to scale comes from; GW certainly doesn't seem to think so. Oh, and people who think Leman Russ is small, take a look at the measurements of some real tanks; it is not that small. (Chimera is huge though, which makes LR look small in comparison.)

Marines seem ~50% too small to me. Almost all races and units appear out of scale. Of course, scalings are contradictory. In one FW book, I think, Drop Pods are stated to actually be pretty small (Similar to tabletop size) whereas it's 'dozens of meters tall' in other places.


Ignoring the Battlesuit (I made it too small, fail on my part), something like this would be pleasant scale-wise, and would make for good-looking battles. (Apologies in advance, Crimson. You won't like this.)

 Ashiraya wrote:
Marines seem ~50% too small to me. Almost all races and units appear out of scale.

But maybe it is not so much the models that are faulty, than your idea of how big they should be? If you actually accepted the numbers the people who make the game give you, the scaling problem would be greatly lessened.

Of course, scalings are contradictory. In one FW book, I think, Drop Pods are stated to actually be pretty small (Similar to tabletop size) whereas it's 'dozens of meters tall' in other places.

Design studio and FW seem to actually have pretty consistent scaling and their fluff figures fit that. It is the BL authors whose numbers are all over the place, thus messing up the picture.

(Apologies in advance, Crimson. You won't like this.)

How did you guess!

 Crimson wrote:

But maybe it is not so much the models that are faulty, than your idea of how big they should be? If you actually accepted the numbers the people who make the game give you, the scaling problem would be greatly lessened.

But I won't blindly 'accept numbers' while they are contested.

Design studio and FW seem to actually have pretty consistent scaling and their fluff figures fit that. It is the BL authors whose numbers are all over the place, thus messing up the picture.

Unfortunate then that BL is on the same level of canon, eh?

How did you guess!

Mostly because you, like me, have already picked your favourite cherries out of the 40K bush, and now you, like me, zealously defend your choice?

Well I think my cron warriors should be a LOT taller

Da Stormlord wrote:
Well I think my cron warriors should be a LOT taller

As you can see on my picture, I am inclined to agree. May just be their über-widelegged stance though.

I would love for this whole 'heroic scale' thing to be phased out.

 Ashiraya wrote:
Marines seem ~50% too small to me. Almost all races and units appear out of scale. Of course, scalings are contradictory. In one FW book, I think, Drop Pods are stated to actually be pretty small (Similar to tabletop size) whereas it's 'dozens of meters tall' in other places.


Ignoring the Battlesuit (I made it too small, fail on my part), something like this would be pleasant scale-wise, and would make for good-looking battles. (Apologies in advance, Crimson. You won't like this.)

Spoiler:

Ohhh :\

Those marines are ginormous.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:
Marines seem ~50% too small to me. Almost all races and units appear out of scale. Of course, scalings are contradictory. In one FW book, I think, Drop Pods are stated to actually be pretty small (Similar to tabletop size) whereas it's 'dozens of meters tall' in other places.


Ignoring the Battlesuit (I made it too small, fail on my part), something like this would be pleasant scale-wise, and would make for good-looking battles. (Apologies in advance, Crimson. You won't like this.)

Spoiler:

Ohhh :\

Those marines are ginormous.

I prefer the term 'appropriate'.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:
Marines seem ~50% too small to me. Almost all races and units appear out of scale. Of course, scalings are contradictory. In one FW book, I think, Drop Pods are stated to actually be pretty small (Similar to tabletop size) whereas it's 'dozens of meters tall' in other places.


Ignoring the Battlesuit (I made it too small, fail on my part), something like this would be pleasant scale-wise, and would make for good-looking battles. (Apologies in advance, Crimson. You won't like this.)

Spoiler:

Ohhh :\

Those marines are ginormous.

I prefer the term 'appropriate'.

Ehh, these pictures may beg to differ...

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:
Marines seem ~50% too small to me. Almost all races and units appear out of scale. Of course, scalings are contradictory. In one FW book, I think, Drop Pods are stated to actually be pretty small (Similar to tabletop size) whereas it's 'dozens of meters tall' in other places.


Ignoring the Battlesuit (I made it too small, fail on my part), something like this would be pleasant scale-wise, and would make for good-looking battles. (Apologies in advance, Crimson. You won't like this.)

Spoiler:

Ohhh :\

Those marines are ginormous.

I prefer the term 'appropriate'.

Ehh, these pictures may beg to differ...

Your pictures contradict one another.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:
Marines seem ~50% too small to me. Almost all races and units appear out of scale. Of course, scalings are contradictory. In one FW book, I think, Drop Pods are stated to actually be pretty small (Similar to tabletop size) whereas it's 'dozens of meters tall' in other places.


Ignoring the Battlesuit (I made it too small, fail on my part), something like this would be pleasant scale-wise, and would make for good-looking battles. (Apologies in advance, Crimson. You won't like this.)

Spoiler:

Ohhh :\

Those marines are ginormous.

I prefer the term 'appropriate'.

Ehh, these pictures may beg to differ...

Your pictures contradict one another.

Wait, how?

The pictures show a person's head being up the SM's chest.
The SM is the height of the armour, being far taller than a normal person.
So, no contradiction.

The Marine in the second picture is significantly larger than the one in the first.

Not as much as the models.
Anyway, everyone knows the Warp stretches people

 Ashiraya wrote:
The Marine in the second picture is significantly larger than the one in the first.

I believe Marines are usually 7-8 feet tall. They don't have to be 9 feet tall to look intimidating. The first picture is a good example of how big and buff they are, completely musclebound and physically unmatched by any human.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:
The Marine in the second picture is significantly larger than the one in the first.

I believe Marines are usually 7-8 feet tall. They don't have to be 9 feet tall to look intimidating. The first picture is a good example of how big and buff they are, completely musclebound and physically unmatched by any human.

I never said that nine feet is required to look intimidating.

I simply consider it the most aesthetically appropriate size.

 Ashiraya wrote:

 Lord Tarkin wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:
The Marine in the second picture is significantly larger than the one in the first.

I believe Marines are usually 7-8 feet tall. They don't have to be 9 feet tall to look intimidating. The first picture is a good example of how big and buff they are, completely musclebound and physically unmatched by any human.

I never said that nine feet is required to look intimidating.

I simply consider it the most aesthetically appropriate size.

Fair enough

Is the size of a 40k model an accurate representation of their actual size?


No

 Crimson wrote:

 Skinnereal wrote:

Stats are fluff, where-as model sizes may not match existing models.

I'm not sure I understood that sentence.

I think this is from some old WD, I'm not sure:


FW books have similar charts, and the numbers are pretty much the same. Leman Russ is a bit over 7 metres long (this is the length of the hull, as it doesn't vary between different variants.) The model is about 12 cm long. This is pretty exactly in scale with the infantry models. So I do not know where this idea that 40K vehicles are not to scale comes from; GW certainly doesn't seem to think so. Oh, and people who think Leman Russ is small, take a look at the measurements of some real tanks; it is not that small. (Chimera is huge though, which makes LR look small in comparison.)

Looks at the main gun: 120mm smoothbore it shall be
Obviously not to blame on GW. Our real 120mm guns are just too small ...................

The specs are partially nicely imagined and added to a Leman Russ, but It doesn't fit the model 100%.

LR plastic GW kit:

Length = 120 mm ( 708 cm )
Width = 80 mm ( 486 cm )
Height = 70 mm ( 442 cm )
Ground clearance = 12 mm ( 45 cm )

If 12 mm are 45 cm, then 120 mm are 450 cm. So if the numbers would work as intended, a lenght of 708 cm ( fluff ) would translate to a 188 mm ( Model ). But the Model is only 120 mm.
The main offender here is the ground clearance. They got it wrong. The specs should say ~ 70 cm.
If 12 mm are 45 cm, then 442 cm are ~117 mm. But the LR from Track to top hatch is 70 mm.
If 12 mm would be 70 cm, then 442 cm would be ~758 mm. Closer to the real Model.

Yep, I'm sure the numbers do not match 100%. However, they seem to be mostly accurate if we assume that the tanks are in same scale as the the infantry. If 30mm Cadian is 175cm tall in 'reality' then 12cm tank model is seven metres long.