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I love that there's no canon supporting a link between Warhammer 40K and Warhammer Fantasy, but there's no canon disavowing a link either (Or at least if there is one way or another, I'm not aware of it). So, how do these two strikingly similar worlds co-exist? I developed my own theory on this while I was playing Age of Reckoning, rest in peace. I'm sure I'm not the first person to have thought of this, but here you go.

Warhammer is not merely a world lost in the clutches of the warp; it is the Astronomican itself. The world is a physical manifestation of the Emperor's power and subconscious will, it's growth influenced by his memories. The souls who find themselves on this world are ones formerly lost to the warp, insignificant enough to be below the notice or interest of malicious warp entities, or perhaps aided by benevolent ones, drawn to the distant light of the Astronomican. If they are lucky enough to reach it, to be embraced by the Emperor's light, they find themselves reborn on this world.
But naturally the corrupting influence of Chaos seeps through whatever cracks it can find. All the Gods have an interest in this one world, and while it isn't unheard of for one or more to become interested in a world or system and even war over it, I find it interesting that all four have taken such a strong interest in the development of this world in particular. The Emperor is at constant psychic war with the four of them after all. It makes a certain sense that their intrusion into the Warhammer setting is actually the product of their eternal struggle with the Emperor within the warp.

Another tidbit that supports this theory is how almost every race and species from 40K has a copy or strong counterpart in the Warhammer world (Humans have their Empire. Elves are split into light and dark factions. Necrons closely resemble the Tomb Lords and so on), but the Tyranids are strangely absent from Warhammer. Since the Tyranids came to the Milky Way well after the Emperor was set upon the Golden Throne, the Emperor has no knowledge of their existence, thus no memory. This fits the theory that life in the Warhammer setting is based on his subconscious memories from a time when he walked the galaxy.


That's my theory anyway. What are some other ideas about the link between these worlds?

Edit: I should point out that I'm aware that Warhammer came before 40K, but I'm having fun with the idea that there's nothing not linking the two worlds.

They are different universes connected by the Warp.

In the early days, 40K was just Fantasy in Space. Over time, however, the links between the two have separated, and now there's nothing actually connecting them, other than certain thematic memes due to being created by the same studio.

In the early days they used to be connected, but I believe GW has since then stated that the universes are not connected in any way.
And besides that, both universes have grown apart too much. The timeline regarding the Old Ones, Chaos, the Coming of Sigmar and the Birth of Slaanesh just does not add up anymore. It is simply not possible for both world to exist in the same universe without very major fluff conflicts.
I do really like your Astronomican theory however. That way, it would actually be possible to get around the timeline conflicts, as the whole Warhammer World is created from the Emperor's memories. It is a short, but very well thought out and creative idea. I like the idea so much it is going into my headcanon
The only problem I see with it however are the Skaven, Lizardmen and Vampire Counts, as they have no equivalent in the 40k universe.

 Iron_Captain wrote:
I do really like your Astronomican theory however. That way, it would actually be possible to get around the timeline conflicts, as the whole Warhammer World is created from the Emperor's memories. It is a short, but very well thought out and creative idea. I like the idea so much it is going into my headcanon

You are too kind

 Iron_Captain wrote:
The only problem I see with it however are the Skaven, Lizardmen and Vampire Counts, as they have no equivalent in the 40k universe.

But all three of those things have strong roots in human mythology. Since the Emperor has been around since basically the dawn of Man, he would have some memories of these things as well, I would think.

Still, it's a shame if GW did sever the link between the two. I like the idea of it being left unknown. Too many writers these days try to answer every question, and end up taking the magic out of their work in the process.

I like to imagine WFB occur on the last planet of the Imperium, thousands of years after 40k. Set on a 40k medieval agri-world, the different races are all aliens and 'magic' is part psyker powers, part old 40k tech. I got the idea from 1d4chan, so go look at it if you want.

 Valena wrote:
Still, it's a shame if GW did sever the link between the two. I like the idea of it being left unknown. Too many writers these days try to answer every question, and end up taking the magic out of their work in the process.

I'm fairly certain that they would simply have gone quiet about it, and not brought it up anymore rather than make some unnecessary, obvious statement saying they have no link at all. Do the guys present with more knowledge know one way or another?

I like to think of the WFB world as a lost Imperial world. Colonised before the GC, never rediscovered. It was already inhabited by Eldar Exodites and visited on occasion by Corsairs. A small ork force landed there once.

The world was cut off by Warp Storms for thousands upon thousands of years, to this very day (999M41). The technology has been lost and degraded to the level in WFB. The Eldar Exodites split into two groups. Some stayed in settlements, eventually building them into cities and became the High Elves. The other group went into the forests and became Wood Elves. The Corsairs became Dark Elves. Orks and Gretchin backpedalled until they got stuck in with swords and axes and bows again.
One of the Primarchs, possibly one of the Unknown Primarchs, was Sigmar. He fights the profile. Ungodly powerful, rose to prominence to lead his people, supreme warrior and leader.
Imperial designation gave way to mythology as Gretchin became Goblins, Orks became Orcs, Eldar became Elves, Squats became Dwarves. Beastmen were already a thing, and with the Warp Storms around the planet they were created in higher numbers, running from their human enslavers and becoming their own people, workshipping Chaos as their saviors. Ogryns got the short end of the stick when it came to survival, in favour of their "normal" counterparts. They began to starve and went savage, devouring anything they could get their hands on, including humans. Became Ogres.
Ratlings also broke off when they say the Squats, Ogryns and Beastmen doing so, mutating immensely under the effects of Chaos and becoming Skaven.
The humans obviously became the Empire and Brettonia.

Vampire Counts are a result of the influence of Chaos and Psykers using Necromantic powers.
Lizardmen are experiments of the Old Ones, left to their own devices. Essentially natives to the world.

Draigo ended up in Warhammer Fantasy in one of the short stories (actually, I think that fact came up again in another short story since then, but my memory could be off).

So at the very least, it can probably be stated that they share the same warp, if you're taking Black Library into account.

Of course, sharing the same warp doesn't really tell much considering that it's... well, the warp.

The way the Fantasy background has developed, there'd be too many holes for the universes to be connected.

Sigmar can't be a primarch, (though I'd really, really want him to be) as he has confirmed human parents.

Elves lack the Eldar's natural psychic mastery, the first Elven mages were taught ages ago by the Slaan. This would also apply to Orcs, who do not have the technical skills which Orks do. Orc catapaults work perfectly fine when operated by humans, or anything else really.

While I like the idea, there are too many holes one has to patch up in order to make it work. Armies have equivalents in terms of gameplay (Skaven - Tyranids, Space Marines - Dwarves, etc.), but I don't think they do in terms of background (Vampires? Lizardmen? Even Ogryns society-wise are completely different than Ogres.)

Way back when, Genestealers were unconnected with the Tyranids, and they were a very obvious analogue for vampires. The cults were all about surrounding themselves with thralls and establishing influence over centers of power. So you could say the Vampire Counts are a strain of Genestealer that more closely mimics the host species than usual hybrids and the Broodlords are pulling the strings behind the more visible leaders. I admit I don't know VC fluff at all, so that might require a lot more tweaking or be completely incompatible, I don't know.

Someone above mentioned Ratlings becoming Skaven. While the name certainly fits, 40k Ratlings are actually a direct analogue to Fantasy halflings. You could maybe say that the race fractured because one branch were exposed to warpstone.

As for Sigmar having human parents, who's to say it isn't a Ma and Pa Kent situation?

Gw did indeed retcon the world's to be completely separate, thiswas a very long time ago and since has been retconned back to being connected through the warp.

There was also apparently a spokesman at some point that outright stated they were separate, he was wrong and didn't have a clue what he was talking about (if said statement is actually true) as gw has an abundant amount of things that directly connect the universe's.

The connections go as far back as the late 90's and continue to this day, belakor being the last one I can think of.

 Deadshot wrote:
I like to think of the WFB world as a lost Imperial world. Colonised before the GC, never rediscovered. It was already inhabited by Eldar Exodites and visited on occasion by Corsairs. A small ork force landed there once.

The world was cut off by Warp Storms for thousands upon thousands of years, to this very day (999M41). The technology has been lost and degraded to the level in WFB. The Eldar Exodites split into two groups. Some stayed in settlements, eventually building them into cities and became the High Elves. The other group went into the forests and became Wood Elves. The Corsairs became Dark Elves. Orks and Gretchin backpedalled until they got stuck in with swords and axes and bows again.
One of the Primarchs, possibly one of the Unknown Primarchs, was Sigmar. He fights the profile. Ungodly powerful, rose to prominence to lead his people, supreme warrior and leader.
Imperial designation gave way to mythology as Gretchin became Goblins, Orks became Orcs, Eldar became Elves, Squats became Dwarves. Beastmen were already a thing, and with the Warp Storms around the planet they were created in higher numbers, running from their human enslavers and becoming their own people, workshipping Chaos as their saviors. Ogryns got the short end of the stick when it came to survival, in favour of their "normal" counterparts. They began to starve and went savage, devouring anything they could get their hands on, including humans. Became Ogres.
Ratlings also broke off when they say the Squats, Ogryns and Beastmen doing so, mutating immensely under the effects of Chaos and becoming Skaven.
The humans obviously became the Empire and Brettonia.

Vampire Counts are a result of the influence of Chaos and Psykers using Necromantic powers.
Lizardmen are experiments of the Old Ones, left to their own devices. Essentially natives to the world.

No, this wouldn't be possible.
If we say that the Old Ones survived the War in Heaven somehow and indeed arrived for some reason on the Warhammer World. Slaanesh was born in M30 while the Old Ones arrived on the Warhammer World in 15.000 IC, so that would be around M20, M18 or something like that. The Old Ones on the Warhammer World were destroyed by Chaos 5600 years IC, at which point Slaanesh was already present. This means that the crowning of Sigmar (0 IC) was in M36. Current events on the Warhammer World take place in about 2500 IC, which would place it in M39.
The Great Crusade took place in M30, which means that humanity should have already long been present on the Warhammer World at that point, while in fact they just appeared for the first time around the time the Old Ones were destroyed. Ergo, the Warhammer World can not have been colonised before the Great Crusade, and should both settings take place in the same universe, WHFB would actually take place after 40k. Also, Sigmar was born way too late to be one of the missing Primarchs.
And all of this of course does not take into account the massive amount of conflicts that exist between both settings: What was that Old One doing on the Warhammer World only a few thousand years ago? They are supposed to have been wiped out long ago. Why are the Winds of Magic only present on the Warhammer World? Why does no one on the Warhammer World have psychic powers? How did pretty much every race in the 40k universe end up on the Warhammer World? If all races come from space, than why does not a single race have any memory or myths of that? If the Elves are Eldar, how do they prevent themselves from being eaten by Slaanesh? Why don't the Chaos Gods use the same powers and servants on the Warhammer World as that they use in the rest of the universe? The whole thing just doesn't add up, both universes have grown massively since they were connected in the RT era, and too many conflicts have arisen since then. The only way I can see for them to still be connected is the OP's Astronomican theory.

Iron it seems your comment is based on one underlying mistake, the warp, time is meaningless there, the old world could exist in the millions of years prior to 40s setting and could have been the test bed for the 40k races before they were released into the 40k universe, it could also exist millions of years prior and at the same time due to warp junk.

The problem with the OP is that we know the Astronomicon is centered on Terra, and the planet of the Old Word has two moons, thus cannot be Terra (as Holy Luna still gets some mention).

 Psienesis wrote:
The problem with the OP is that we know the Astronomicon is centered on Terra, and the planet of the Old Word has two moons, thus cannot be Terra (as Holy Luna still gets some mention).

The Astronomican is centered on Terra because that is where the Emperor (who is powering the Astronomican) is. The Astronomican World itself would be a realm in the Warp I guess.

Why would the Astronomican have a world anyway? It's just a load of normal psykers being flung around like a torch.

 Iron_Captain wrote:

 Psienesis wrote:
The problem with the OP is that we know the Astronomicon is centered on Terra, and the planet of the Old Word has two moons, thus cannot be Terra (as Holy Luna still gets some mention).

The Astronomican is centered on Terra because that is where the Emperor (who is powering the Astronomican) is. The Astronomican World itself would be a realm in the Warp I guess.

But is not the Emperor, himself. It's a psychic beacon situated on Terra, the Emperor simply directs its light. You could consider him as a sort of keeper of a light-house, focusing the beam to provide the longest-range illumination.

The old Liber Chaotica books, while not canon in the sense that they were written by a "madman", clearly depicted chaos marines and war machines and described by him, though he didn't know what he was seeing. So there's definitely still a link, however in RL terms the only link originally was they shared a trademark so they had to have certain similarities.

 Stormphoenix wrote:
The old Liber Chaotica books, while not canon in the sense that they were written by a "madman", clearly depicted chaos marines and war machines and described by him, though he didn't know what he was seeing. So there's definitely still a link, however in RL terms the only link originally was they shared a trademark so they had to have certain similarities.

Here is a post made by the writer of the Liber Chaotica books that goes into the cross over between the two realms.

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?45416-Warhammer-Cross-Over-Fluff&p=871142#post871142