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 Ashiraya wrote:
I am convinced that an assault-oriented Space Marine (Say one of those guys who are left in the assault squads because they lack the flexibility to be tacticals) with a chainsword and bolt pistol is about equal to a Howling Banshee or Striking Scorpion in combat.

Yeah, one of those guys. They would be pretty equal

It would be a pretty epic duel to boot.

It's a well known fact that Eldar have the most accurate divination in the known universe, especially so of the Craftworld Ulthwe that is depicted in the Video. So, unfortunately for the Imperium, Eldar do not do ''Awesome Battles'', because since Eldar lives are so important, Eldar only (Or at least, in the majority) partake in battles they are assured to win with minimal loss of life.

Combining the advantages of knowing exactly when, where and who will be there combined with superior Tech and Faster then Light travel, we can safely assume that if both parties are allowed pre-battle thought, the Eldar one will be much more thought out, effective and built to every weakness in the Space Marines they can perceive.

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
It's a well known fact that Eldar have the most accurate divination in the known universe, especially so of the Craftworld Ulthwe that is depicted in the Video. So, unfortunately for the Imperium, Eldar do not do ''Awesome Battles'', because since Eldar lives are so important, Eldar only (Or at least, in the majority) partake in battles they are assured to win with minimal loss of life.

Eldar, however, are few, and they often have to fight battles they have to fight.

They can far from always choose.

 Ashiraya wrote:
It would be a pretty epic duel to boot.

Indeed it would be. It was what I was hoping to see


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
It's a well known fact that Eldar have the most accurate divination in the known universe, especially so of the Craftworld Ulthwe that is depicted in the Video. So, unfortunately for the Imperium, Eldar do not do ''Awesome Battles'', because since Eldar lives are so important, Eldar only (Or at least, in the majority) partake in battles they are assured to win with minimal loss of life.

Combining the advantages of knowing exactly when, where and who will be there combined with superior Tech and Faster then Light travel, we can safely assume that if both parties are allowed pre-battle thought, the Eldar one will be much more thought out, effective and built to every weakness in the Space Marines they can perceive.

That's your opinion.

 Ashiraya wrote:
Eldar, however, are few, and they often have to fight battles they have to fight.

They can far from always choose.

That is a very good point. Sometimes they must fight even if it costs them dearly.

But they will surely use all they have in order to have as much of an advantage as possible, instead of dumping a valuable Farseer somewhere she gets to kill exactly one enemy before dying. Unless that's the one marine that would in the future have defeated their craftworld...

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
Now forgive me, I realize those were banshees in the video. I am not familiar with Eldar but now I know what they mainly look like (I only battled Eldar once on TT).

Interesting fact.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
As I mentioned earlier, the marines just dispersed. Why would you disperse when you know you'll be fighting banshees? That poor heavy bolter marine wouldnt have gotten raped by that warp spider if he had a brother by his side to help him.

Then the Eldar? They had like, one warp spider? Where the hell were his comrades at? A pathetic farseer that sat idly by as her fellows died to superhumans? I...don't understand any of that gak. But hey, I know there are very few 40k videos to refer to so we have no choice but to enjoy this nonsense.

I would like to point out we have no global scene at all. It feels like a bunch of separate scene, not a battle.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
Edit: about that assualt marine. He would not have died of a sword through the gut. I felt it was a cool scene but the wound should have been much more fatal. Would've been cool to see him have his head cut off, his throat sliced, or a giant slash across the middle of his chest and destroying his innards. A sword through the gut wouldn't have even fazed him, and he would've just hacked that banshee in two.

Well, if that sword cut his spine, then he cannot move his lower body part anymore. That is going to make him way less of a threat.

 Ashiraya wrote:
I am convinced that an assault-oriented Space Marine (Say one of those guys who are left in the assault squads because they lack the flexibility to be tacticals) with a chainsword and bolt pistol is about equal to a Howling Banshee or Striking Scorpion in combat.

You are not going to be surprised, but I personally think eldars from those path would be better than an assault-oriented space marine.

 Lord Tarkin wrote:
I believe tbat is their specialty but I DO believe a SM is slightly more intelligent.

As I told before, for me eldars are the true intellectuals here, and marines seems like gritty barbarians in comparison. I would believe the eldar to be much more intelligent. Not only are the eldars “elves in space”, but they usually have walked many path, and likely some as scientists or philosophers…

Spetulhu wrote:

 Ashiraya wrote:
Eldar, however, are few, and they often have to fight battles they have to fight.

They can far from always choose.

That is a very good point. Sometimes they must fight even if it costs them dearly.

But they will surely use all they have in order to have as much of an advantage as possible, instead of dumping a valuable Farseer somewhere she gets to kill exactly one enemy before dying. Unless that's the one marine that would in the future have defeated their craftworld...

While I highly doubt that marine held any future relevance, it is a good assumption but not likely the case. Just.....a dead farseer....for no good reason.

 ZakFaire wrote:
Exactly what in the lore makes Inquisitors so insanely tough?

I'll admit to not having read most of the thread, but I'll throw in my tuppence.

Game stats are heavily exaggerated. Main "hero" characters get stats to make them important in the game. A Space Marine chapter master is not actually three times as damage resistant as a regular marine, but it's not very impressive in game play if he dies just as easily. The stats are not directly representative of the actual fluff.

In "reality", an Inquisitor is an above average human, but what need to be remembered is that he's an Inquisitor. The job description to investigate, not fight. Certainly, an Inquisitor who can't handle himself in a fight won't live very long, but the ones that are primarily warriors are a bit of a rarity - most Inquisitors work like in Dark Heresy, via agents, but even those that do themselves get stuck in will generally be outclassed by members of their entourage when it comes to a fight.

Looking at my characters from Inquisitor (which focuses on a more common breed of Inquisitor than the Coteaz type), I wouldn't give the Inquisitors themselves great odds. I mean, there's a few power and force swords amongst them, but they'd struggle to close the distance to make those meaningful before they were taken apart by bolter fire.

Mostly, it's their allies who'd have the best chance. Best odds go to the Imperial Guardswoman who "canonically" fought against the 13th Black Crusade (our timeline is currently 014.M42) and killed a couple of traitor marines then, and the Zeta-level pyrokine/telepath.

 MarcoSkoll wrote:

 ZakFaire wrote:
Exactly what in the lore makes Inquisitors so insanely tough?

I'll admit to not having read most of the thread, but I'll throw in my tuppence.

Game stats are heavily exaggerated. Main "hero" characters get stats to make them important in the game. A Space Marine chapter master is not actually three times as damage resistant as a regular marine, but it's not very impressive in game play if he dies just as easily. The stats are not directly representative of the actual fluff.

In "reality", an Inquisitor is an above average human, but what need to be remembered is that he's an Inquisitor. The job description to investigate, not fight. Certainly, an Inquisitor who can't handle himself in a fight won't live very long, but the ones that are primarily warriors are a bit of a rarity - most Inquisitors work like in Dark Heresy, via agents, but even those that do themselves get stuck in will generally be outclassed by members of their entourage when it comes to a fight.

Looking at my characters from Inquisitor (which focuses on a more common breed of Inquisitor than the Coteaz type), I wouldn't give the Inquisitors themselves great odds. I mean, there's a few power and force swords amongst them, but they'd struggle to close the distance to make those meaningful before they were taken apart by bolter fire.

Mostly, it's their allies who'd have the best chance. Best odds go to the Imperial Guardswoman who "canonically" fought against the 13th Black Crusade (our timeline is currently 014.M42) and killed a couple of traitor marines then, and the Zeta-level pyrokine/telepath.

It really depends on the inquisitor. most of the investigation is done by lackeys, but all inquisitors were at one point. The investigation often leads to quite a bit of fighting, attacks by gangs, chaos worshipers ect. Inquisitors are just human beings, but you have to remember that the recorces available to an inquisitor are huge.

 MarcoSkoll wrote:

 ZakFaire wrote:
Exactly what in the lore makes Inquisitors so insanely tough?

I'll admit to not having read most of the thread, but I'll throw in my tuppence.

Game stats are heavily exaggerated. Main "hero" characters get stats to make them important in the game. A Space Marine chapter master is not actually three times as damage resistant as a regular marine, but it's not very impressive in game play if he dies just as easily. The stats are not directly representative of the actual fluff.

In "reality", an Inquisitor is an above average human, but what need to be remembered is that he's an Inquisitor. The job description to investigate, not fight. Certainly, an Inquisitor who can't handle himself in a fight won't live very long, but the ones that are primarily warriors are a bit of a rarity - most Inquisitors work like in Dark Heresy, via agents, but even those that do themselves get stuck in will generally be outclassed by members of their entourage when it comes to a fight.

Looking at my characters from Inquisitor (which focuses on a more common breed of Inquisitor than the Coteaz type), I wouldn't give the Inquisitors themselves great odds. I mean, there's a few power and force swords amongst them, but they'd struggle to close the distance to make those meaningful before they were taken apart by bolter fire.

Mostly, it's their allies who'd have the best chance. Best odds go to the Imperial Guardswoman who "canonically" fought against the 13th Black Crusade (our timeline is currently 014.M42) and killed a couple of traitor marines then, and the Zeta-level pyrokine/telepath.

Another Marco, awesome!

Okay enough, back on topic lol

Inquistors are still fairly tough in a fight. They also have access to ridiculously powerful weapons that would make things a tad unfair for the SM. But then again, a SM has way quicker reflexes than average humans and the Inquisitor will find his head exploded in a shower of gore before he could efficiently react.

I give a 50 50 chance.

Co'tor Shas wrote:It really depends on the inquisitor.

Well, yes. Certainly there's a massive spectrum of Inquisitors, but I have to see the front-line brute Inquisitor as something of a rarity. They just happen to be the type players of the main table-top game are most familiar with - and, likely, the Imperial populace too, as Inquisitors who go out and smack aliens around the head are going to be more noticeable than the ones successfully and quietly conducting investigations under cover.

Front-line war is going to be an even higher risk role than the Inquisition normally is, so life-expectancy ain't gonna be great. Yeah, I know we hear about Inquisitors making it to their three hundreds or older, but let's be honest, Games Workshop aren't going to commission a novel series about an Inquisitor who dies six months into the job; we're by default hearing the interesting stories about the very best (and luckiest) characters.
I'd be highly surprised if many Inquisitors survived more than a decade or two in the role, particularly when talking about those that deliberately get into fights.

That said, the kind of Inquisitor who's likely to have it in their mind to teach a Marine a lesson probably is one of these combatant Inquisitors, but it depends on the full scope of the question being asked.

Lord Tarkin wrote:Inquistors are still fairly tough in a fight. They also have access to ridiculously powerful weapons that would make things a tad unfair for the SM.

Wellllll... yes and no. While Inquisitors might have access to such weapons, it doesn't mean they're carrying them at any given time - they often tend to be rather impractical due to weight, unreliability, limited shot capacity, cumbersome "handling" or the like. If the lethality of these weapons isn't actually necessary for the mission, I'd expect to see most Inquisitors opting for something more mundane.

However, if the Inquisitor expected to face a Space Marine, there's no reason they wouldn't take something or someone that could kill or disable said marine.

 Melissia wrote:
However, if the Inquisitor expected to face a Space Marine, there's no reason they wouldn't take something or someone that could kill or disable said marine.

Or vice versa. Astartes usually do not walk around with archeotech, but they have lots of rather deadly weapons.

Given the respective occupation of inquisitors and marines, the inquisitor is much more likely to come unexpected.
After all, the four main weapons of the Inquisition are surprise, fear ruth,less efficiency, and an undying devotion to the pope, nobody expects them, and yadda yadda …

 Melissia wrote:
However, if the Inquisitor expected to face a Space Marine, there's no reason they wouldn't take something or someone that could kill or disable said marine.

Certainly there isn't... but if you're talking about an Inquisitor expecting and fully prepared to face a Space Marine, then you're setting up a very one sided fight. Even on an entire chapter level, it takes plot armour such as that afforded to the First and Second Foundings to save a chapter from being wiped out (or nearly so) by a well prepared Inquisitor or Inquisitors.

Under those circumstances, I couldn't name a single Inquisitor I've ever written who couldn't pull in allies or weapons that could curb-stomp a Space Marine, which makes it an almost meaningless answer to the question.

Indeed. Inquisitors can command almost anyone. If they are allowed to prepare that much they can just keep throwing guardsmen at the problem until it goes away.

 MarcoSkoll wrote:
Under those circumstances, I couldn't name a single Inquisitor I've ever written who couldn't pull in allies or weapons that could curb-stomp a Space Marine, which makes it an almost meaningless answer to the question.

Like all "can X beat Y" topics, it was always a meaningless question to begin with, so that's okay.

 MarcoSkoll wrote:

Co'tor Shas wrote:It really depends on the inquisitor.

Well, yes. Certainly there's a massive spectrum of Inquisitors, but I have to see the front-line brute Inquisitor as something of a rarity. They just happen to be the type players of the main table-top game are most familiar with - and, likely, the Imperial populace too, as Inquisitors who go out and smack aliens around the head are going to be more noticeable than the ones successfully and quietly conducting investigations under cover.

Front-line war is going to be an even higher risk role than the Inquisition normally is, so life-expectancy ain't gonna be great. Yeah, I know we hear about Inquisitors making it to their three hundreds or older, but let's be honest, Games Workshop aren't going to commission a novel series about an Inquisitor who dies six months into the job; we're by default hearing the interesting stories about the very best (and luckiest) characters.
I'd be highly surprised if many Inquisitors survived more than a decade or two in the role, particularly when talking about those that deliberately get into fights.

That said, the kind of Inquisitor who's likely to have it in their mind to teach a Marine a lesson probably is one of these combatant Inquisitors, but it depends on the full scope of the question being asked.

You said is better than me. If you haven't, I would recommend you check out DH and it's splats. Some of the inquisitors detailed in there are practically space marines already .

On equal terms the Astartes has the advantage since battle is his specialisation.