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 Kanluwen wrote:

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Wouldn't be the first time that something like that has happened then.

Imperial Armour 8 was supposed to be the first of a two book cycle and 11/12 were supposed to be multiple books as well.

True dat. I weep for what could have been before HH took all their resources and time.

You have no clue how much we missed.

Ooooh I wanna know, what did we miss?

 Orock wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Platuan4th wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Wouldn't be the first time that something like that has happened then.

Imperial Armour 8 was supposed to be the first of a two book cycle and 11/12 were supposed to be multiple books as well.

True dat. I weep for what could have been before HH took all their resources and time.

You have no clue how much we missed.

Ooooh I wanna know, what did we miss?

So Volume 8 was going to be part 1 of 2. Initially it would be the whole failed decapitation strike on a nascent Ork Waagh! that we saw in 8, with 9 having been the Waagh! proper hitting a heavily fortified Imperial shrineworld. Cadians were going to be playing a big part in volume 9.

IA11 and 12 were both similar, they were going to start off as a "war on a single world" and then expand into a sectorwide conflict.
In the case of IA11, it would open with the fighting on the part of Alaitoc and the Corsairs to reawaken/recover the lost Phoenix Lord that we saw in IA11 and then it would expand to be the Dark Eldar coming in to start taking advantage of the mayhem ensuing.

IA12 was going to, again, start with a single world. It was going to be the Necrontyr awakening on their Tomb World and then the sector being revealed as a series of Tomb Worlds. Alaitoc and Illic Nightspear were to actually play a significant part in this.

Well if fantasy was a skirmish game...

I'd take a crack at it.

After the last few years, and the most recent report, it wouldn't surprise me at all if GW were flailing around and grabbing at any ideas they can get their hands on, and I don't blame them at all. It's common knowledge that well over 50% of their sales are from 40k, so drastically changing fantasy into a skirmish makes a lot of sense, and would definitely pillage my wallet.

 Daemonslave wrote:


By the sounds of it, first there will be either a major campaign or a series of campaigns about the end times in which Nagash returns.

LOL! GW gets another go at producing decent Nagash figure? This will be fun!

T

Oh goodie, this rumor again....

If Fantasy goes skirmish, it'll give me a good reason to finally sell all my Fantasy models. Regimental combat is what makes WHFB fun, though GW did kind of screw up with 8th edition IMO.

If they add a separate game again like Mordheim I'd be fine with that of course.

But that said... the "WHFB is going skirmish" is a rumour I've heard around gaming clubs and stores since forever and it's never happened.

Changing WHFB to a skirmish game will not be a move forward IMO, we don't need more skirmish games.

I would love to see a WFB supplement similar in vein to SAGA.

They could also use that as a vehicle to bring back the old Chaos Warband rules from the old RoC books.

That would definitely get me to put the sculpting tools down and start collecting a new army.

 Soggy Kittenz wrote:
It's common knowledge that well over 50% of their sales are from 40k,.

So you're saying one of their two major product lines makes up around half their sales. What?!

What they need to do is keep their current WHFB line and convert it to a skirmish game. For the big battles, they should go for a smaller scale (10-12mm) and give it a catchy name like 'Warmaster' ...

While they're at it, they can do the same thing for 40K. Such a game would be truly 'Epic' ...

WFB switching wholesale over to a skirmish game would be the final act that knocked me out of the hobby. I am barely hanging on at this point as it is. If I wanted to play a skirmish game, I'd play mordheim or, less likely, 40k.

I play warhammer to move ranked units around. Though the game is more expensive now, at least the armies are impressive to look at once completed.

By skirmish, I can only assume that it means 40k style skirmish, and not mordeheim skirmish.

GW problem with Fantasy is they do NOT cater to it. Barely gives it attention as they do 40K. That, on top of $40-$50.00 a box of 5-10 models ( in CORE for the most part) when you tend to need a sizable unit of 20+, is utterly ridiculous!

GW is in the market to sell toys oops i mean plastic miniatures, they killed of all the skirmish games because Kirby thinks skirmish games don't sell miniatures

 Kilkrazy wrote:
They have been growing 40K for several editions, though, in the pursuit of selling larger armies.

I dunno, if they tried this they failed after the 5th. During 5th edition, 2000pt games were very common, with movement towards 2500p, but in 6th edition it was usually 1500-1850.

Nowhere does it state that skirmish means less models. They could easily just move to individual round basing for everything to make it more cinematic and 40K like.

I predict the figure counts will be closer to 40K than Mordheim.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:Changing WHFB to a skirmish game will not be a move forward IMO

Thing is though... what exactly is the move forward for Fantasy? Answers on a postcard to Lenton, as they have no idea... (Like others, I'm reading 'skirmish' here as comparable to 40K, not 'dozen guys a side').

jojo_monkey_boy wrote:WFB switching wholesale over to a skirmish game would be the final act that knocked me out of the hobby...I play warhammer to move ranked units around.

There are other games that cater to people who want ranked units, it doesn't have to be a case of leaving the hobby.


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 cincydooley wrote:

 Soggy Kittenz wrote:
It's common knowledge that well over 50% of their sales are from 40k,.

So you're saying one of their two major product lines makes up around half their sales. What?!

Three major lines...

And I'd be amazed if 40K wasn't over 80% of their sales, and not surprised if it was breaching the 90s these days.

WHFB going skirmish would do wonders for Mantic, just sayin.

 Riquende wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:Changing WHFB to a skirmish game will not be a move forward IMO

Thing is though... what exactly is the move forward for Fantasy? Answers on a postcard to Lenton, as they have no idea... (Like others, I'm reading 'skirmish' here as comparable to 40K, not 'dozen guys a side').

Honestly, I think GW have exhausted their good ideas for both Fantasy and 40k. I think they should have spent more time working on their specialist games rather than beating WHFB and 40k (especially 40k) to death. I really have no idea how to move the game forward, but moving to a skirmish style comparable to 40k really sounds like a horrible move.

If GW are genuinely in their death throes, it looks like they are going to take their games with them.

Granted if they're just adding another Mordheim type game, I'm happy enough with that.

Hmmm...

With the LoTR stuff presumably coming to an end in the near future, I wonder what the possibilities for porting the LoTR rules into the Warhammer universe are...

SoCxWarChief wrote:
GW problem with Fantasy is they do NOT cater to it. Barely gives it attention as they do 40K.

As a Tyranid player, I could've done without the attention GW has given since the 4th ed codex.

On another note re: the supposed new 'post apocalyptic' setting, I wonder if GW feel that the core background of Fantasy is too generic. We've seen a bit of a push from them in recent years towards a more 'protectable' IP (renaming the generic Imperial Guard for example).

Maybe they feel a proper warts 'n' all reboot of Fantasy from the ground is the way to go.

I just don't understand GW. Its not like they need NEW ideas... just a semi-sensible price-scheme, and revisiting games they own that we want.

I just spent $150-some-odd buying into Firestorm Armada this weekend. If GW had even a 25% more expensive, but in-print and supported Battlefleet: Gothic, that is where I would rather have been.

When looking into Dropzone Commander, I kept wishing Epic were still available...

And so on.

The only game of theirs which I feel has been decisively trumped for good, is Bloodbowl (with Dreadball), but even Bloodbowl still has a small, loyal, following.

GW just leaves money on the table wherever it goes, and wonders why we don't get excited for a new $165 Tyranid model.



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 N.I.B. wrote:

SoCxWarChief wrote:
GW problem with Fantasy is they do NOT cater to it. Barely gives it attention as they do 40K.

As a Tyranid player, I could've done without the attention GW has given since the 4th ed codex.

Oh, and ditto. I spent $600 getting my 'Nids up to date, in anticipation of our most recent Codex... and then I got ..... that.

MaxT wrote:
WHFB going skirmish would do wonders for Mantic, just sayin.

Not unless they've changed their rules so that models are individual models and not just counters to determine the starting amount.

I think if Fantasy turned into a pure skirmish game it would kill it. I think it would benefit from a dedicated skirmish ruleset however to help introduce new players into the core rules, with easy to buy battle, value sets for £40-50 a pop, but to change its identity completely would be a mistake, as would changing the background too much to accomodate said identity. I just feel it would alienate the current dwindling player base too much.

I think the main problem is the pricing of certain units. I think the bigger kits are often better value but when core units are £15-25+ for 10 models that's what really hurts player's. I preferred the size of armies in 4th and 6th Edition myself and I still prefer to play those editions when I can. GW need to realise it's their pricing and rules which are pushing away gamers into other things, as well as abandoning games where competitors can just fill the void as they have done so. There's nothing to stop them doing deals via their webstore/in stores, say 10% off for every £100 spent up to a maximum 30% off to help drive direct sales.

Still I'm interested in seeing what's around the corner for Fantasy, I just hope they don't screw it up.

 warspawned wrote:
I just feel it would alienate the current dwindling player base too much.

You mean those guys (and girls) who have already spent their £thousands on plastic crack, and are now jaded and (seemingly) stopping playing anyway? Yeah, I can't see why GW wouldn't want to jettison them for a market of pocket money-spending tweens eagerly buying boxes of the new Wolf Knights, Blood Knights, Dark Knights and Ultraknights.

 cincydooley wrote:

 Soggy Kittenz wrote:
It's common knowledge that well over 50% of their sales are from 40k,.

So you're saying one of their two major product lines makes up around half their sales. What?!

Didnt Rick Priestley state that space marine sales alone outstrip fantasy sales. I cant say how accurate it is but I have heard that around 5% is lotr and around 80% is 40k, leaving 15% or so for fantasy.

 warspawned wrote:
I think the main problem is the pricing of certain units. I think the bigger kits are often better value but when core units are £15-25+ for 10 models that's what really hurts player's. I preferred the size of armies in 4th and 6th Edition myself and I still prefer to play those editions when I can.

I agree with this completely. A really good example of this issue is the new dark elf core infantry. They're (in CAD prices) two dollars less than the high elf spearmen set, yet they contain six less models (~37% less). Couple that with, as warspawned pointed out, inflation in army sizes as game editions go on and it's easy to see how GW have priced players out of the game.

It's so hard not to be cynical about how GW carries itself. I get that they're a business and they need to make sales. Yet when I read things like the Chapterhouse case court transcripts and see how they view their clientele, it's clear that they're really not trying to find a way to increase sales by getting people to genuinely love their product. They're more like con-artists exploiting a vulnerability.

Graphite wrote:
Hmmm...

With the LoTR stuff presumably coming to an end in the near future, I wonder what the possibilities for porting the LoTR rules into the Warhammer universe are...

Well, I doubt GW look at the hobbit and think, "this is going great, lets adopt it to fantasy battle!".

I don't think it's LotR as a system that's the problem, the IP just isn't as popular as it once was. They grossly overestimated how popular the Hobbit game would be, as can be pretty clearly seen by the limited edition Hobbit starter that came out over a year and a half ago that's still for sale.