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Yeah, I heard about putting concrete on tanks. Not THAT useful, and can damage the vehicle (a LOT of weight, speed reduced, etc...), but I guess it's better than nothing.
This killdozer is really orkish^^
godardc wrote: Yeah, I heard about putting concrete on tanks. Not THAT useful, and can damage the vehicle (a LOT of weight, speed reduced, etc...),
Depends on the tank, too. Much as I hate to compliment the Soviet Union, but their ideas on tank engineering were very robust. Something about it still working after a collective farms tractor driver got his hands on it.
Shadow Captain Edithae wrote: Does it not run the risk of rock getting trapped in the moving parts and mechanisms of the tank's turret?
In most modern tanks, yes, though to what degree varies by tank.. But these things were designed to be driven and maintained by people who'd never even seen a tank, or probably fired a gun, before they were hearded into rail-cars and driven to the front. A mainstay of the poorly armed forces of tinpot dictators the world over, if you look up 'robust' in the dictionary, one of these might be pictured.
As the cheapest MBT on the market, if you see one, there's probably more.
Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
Very well against shaped weapons. So-so against most other things. I suppose the ablation would be effective longer than reactive armor.
I'm pulling from some WWII era knowledge, but I don't know if it still applies;
During WWII many Allied Tank crews would line their vehicles with wood, rocks, and sandbags. These increased protection against shaped charges like the Panzerfaust, but actually compromised the armor against anti-armor shells from anti-tank guns like the 88 (wood and rock basically became extra shrapnel). However this was of limited concern, as western allied crews were far far more likely to come across an infantry born anti-armor weapon than anything else.
Today this is still true, as shaped charges make up the bulk of anti-armor weapons not born by heavy vehicles or aircraft. In the kind of conflict we're seeing in the middle east, such weapons are far more common and dangerous for a crew than a jet fighter or another tank.
T-72M from the looks of them. T-72Ms, T-54/55s, and Chinese Type 59s are like crackerjack boxes, you never know what you'll find inside because they get modified so much by so many, so performance varies from 'serious threat to an Abrams' to 'turkey shoot'. Depends mainly on how much money gets spent per tank in upgrade kits, service life extensions, and whatever wild ideas the local government had about reactive armor and increased armament. I think there's something like over standardized variants of the T-55, if you count Chinese knockoffs and local frankentanks, IIRC.
Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
Why do AT missiles corkscrew like this? Is this wire guided or what?
The way some laser guided ats work is that after the initial launch they have to find the targeting laser. Once they do that, they adjust course to try to align two sensors with the laser, and then they corkscrew in around the laser tighter and tighter until they hit the target. This is known as 'beam riding'.
Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
Out of interest to those who have worked with the Ahbrams/know a lot about it, does that look like the tank was destroyed/crew survived, or was it just the ammo-box failure door thing blasting open?
Homosexuality is the #1 cause of gay marriage.
kronk wrote: Every pizza is a personal sized pizza if you try hard enough and believe in yourself.
sebster wrote: Yes, indeed. What a terrible piece of cultural imperialism it is for me to say that a country shouldn't murder its own citizens
BaronIveagh wrote: Basically they went from a carrot and stick to a smaller carrot and flanged mace.
Co'tor Shas wrote: Out of interest to those who have worked with the Ahbrams/know a lot about it, does that look like the tank was destroyed/crew survived, or was it just the ammo-box failure door thing blasting open?
Not being an Abrams guy, I'd take what I say in this post with a grain of salt, but it looks like the missile passes through the gap between turret and hull at 0:14. They've got no chain skirt on the turret, so this might have hit the crew compartment and/or the ammo rack. You see the hatches come off at 0:15, and by 0:23 fire is definitively coming out of the crew compartment. The tank is a kill. Personally, I'm hoping for their sake they were the heads bobbing around slightly to the left of the tank at the start of the video, because I don't see anyone bail out in the film
Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
Co'tor Shas wrote: Out of interest to those who have worked with the Ahbrams/know a lot about it, does that look like the tank was destroyed/crew survived, or was it just the ammo-box failure door thing blasting open?
Not being an Abrams guy, I'd take what I say in this post with a grain of salt, but it looks like the missile passes through the gap between turret and hull at 0:14. They've got no chain skirt on the turret, so this might have hit the crew compartment and/or the ammo rack. You see the hatches come off at 0:15, and by 0:23 fire is definitively coming out of the crew compartment. The tank is a kill. Personally, I'm hoping for their sake they were the heads bobbing around slightly to the left of the tank at the start of the video, because I don't see anyone bail out in the film
Most TOW missiles now a days are going to shred MBT's. Especially export models. My support with the Army involves Aviation and Light Infantry, so I'm in no means an expert on armor, but I'm imagining that no one got out of that alive.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/11/01 00:52:50
That missile is either wire guided or a beam rider. Most missiles leave their tubes with an imparted spin. This allows two control veins to control the missile in all axis. The greater the maneuvering or the slower the missile, the more pronounced the corkscrew.
Not an expert on the ATGMs, but any sufficiently modern ATGM should be able to punch through an M1A1's rear ammo rack. That's the equivalent of a knife kill in Counterstrike or a headshot or whatever you crazy kids are doing these days
djones520 wrote: Yeah, that's a wire guided missile. As to why it corkscrews? No clue.
It's probably because there's no positional feedback from the fins. That would add weight and expense to the missile and you'd have to send signals back from the missile to the controlling platform, adding more weight and technical complexity AND you'd have to have more wires attached to the missile.
As such there's no damping which leads to something called hunting - you have a line you want to follow and you make corrections to get back on line, but because of the momentum of the missile you overfly and now have to correct in the other direction. This is normally negated by positional feedback from moving surfaces allowing the computer to control how much correction is needed, reducing the correction as you get closer to the optimal line - which is why a plane on autopilot doesn't feel like a roller coaster. (It's also the method used by heat seeking and laser guided missiles, but they're much more expensive).
The longer the hunting is allowed to persist the greater effect it has until your missile looks like it's making a sine wave. The platform can't tell the missile "You're off target, but only by a little bit, so turn left just a smidgen", all it can do is say "Turn left, now turn right, now turn left" and you're going to corkscrew all over the place.
I'm no weapons specialist, but this is my best avionics guess.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/11/01 02:05:37
Co'tor Shas wrote: I thought the Abrahms wasn't sold to other countries?
You keep the M1A2 to yourself, but the older M1A1 is sold. Australia has 60 M1A1, and Egypt has about 1,000. Saudi Arabia has 300. Iraq has 150. There's
Just looked this up on wiki to see if I forgot any countries, and learned Kuwait has the M1A2. Which the US wasn't selling to us. Not fething happy America.
ISIS have been building a lot of bomb carrying units that roll toward enemy positions packed with explosives. Some are controlled by remote, others by kids sold a dream of martyrdom.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/11/01 07:54:28
“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”
Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something.
I'm not saying that there is no bomb victims, but here is an example of how material for news is fabricating (this one made in Iraq, but maybe for "Russia bombed Syria" titles)
Mordant 92nd 'Acid Dogs'
The Lost and Damned
Inquisition
I have to agree. I hate to point this out, but if that's the quality of their fabrication production, no one would ever believe them. A real bombing, and real bomb victims, don't look like that.
so, nice Russian propaganda video, but I don't buy it. It's missing the required amounts of burned and shredded human flesh.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/11/03 21:20:12
Fate is in heaven, armor is on the chest, accomplishment is in the feet. - Nagao Kagetora
Freakazoitt wrote: I'm not saying that there is no bomb victims, but here is an example of how material for news is fabricating (this one made in Iraq, but maybe for "Russia bombed Syria" titles)
sebster wrote: Just looked this up on wiki to see if I forgot any countries, and learned Kuwait has the M1A2. Which the US wasn't selling to us. Not fething happy America.
Well the US Marine Corps still uses the M1A1 so I don't know what you're complaining about.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/11/04 02:31:00
I have to wonder about the cost to usefulness of the Ahbrams in the middle east nowadays. What with the advancements in missile tech and suchlike, it would seem they are much more expensive than what you will get out of them. I think the t-90 might be more useful, not because it's in any way better (it's not), but because it's like 1/5th the cost. Then again, what do I know?
Homosexuality is the #1 cause of gay marriage.
kronk wrote: Every pizza is a personal sized pizza if you try hard enough and believe in yourself.
sebster wrote: Yes, indeed. What a terrible piece of cultural imperialism it is for me to say that a country shouldn't murder its own citizens
BaronIveagh wrote: Basically they went from a carrot and stick to a smaller carrot and flanged mace.
Mordant 92nd 'Acid Dogs'
The Lost and Damned
Inquisition
