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2014/09/17 22:12:28
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
The truth about Zoe Quinn is that no one in the world deserves the gak that she has gotten. The truth is that these witch hunts over journalistic ethics and transparency and whatever bs dog whistle that 4chan and its ilk are using for their issues with a woman’s sexual agency are driving women out of the industry.
Yeah I stopped reading the second one about this point when actual women developers have actually listed why they were run out of the industry and it certainly wasn't this. They can speak for themselves after all.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/17 22:27:15
2014/09/17 22:27:23
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
She still could have faked the ones that sent her fleeing her home from the freshly created account just as much as she could have received death threats from someone that created that account that wasn't her. She certainly has received plenty of death threats and people are being donkey caves and I hope they're punished for their crimes. I don't like Miss Sarkeesian, I don't like her videos, and I don't like her face (but that's personal), but the woman doesn't need to receive threats on her life.
Because that's what this is about. This isn't about a woman getting death threats, this isn't about a jilted guy that didn't understand he should have just drowned his sorrows in booze like the rest of us. This is about journalistic integrity. Peregrine is right, this has been going on for the past decade, but back then magazines and other serials were just as popular as news sites. Today, that's not the case and the ZOEPOST that started this whole thing caused everything to rise to a froth when half a dozen sites posted hateful articles about the people that literally paid their bills in web traffic.
Gaming Journalists are bloggers with large audiences that get paychecks to blog about games. Unfortunately they brand themselves as journalists and do nothing that journalists should do.
DR:80+S++G+M+B+I+Pwmhd11#++D++A++++/sWD-R++++T(S)DM+ Ask me about Brushfire or Endless: Fantasy Tactics
2014/09/17 22:40:25
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Plus there is numerous people using the freedom of information act to see if the FBI is handling her case, if proven wrong it uncovers all sorts of things.
And its polygon reporting it. You cant trust what they say half of them are involved directly in this and silverstring.
You guys know there is this thing called AdBlock, right?
Ashiraya wrote: I don't care if you have swapped discussion to whatever, I just want to see some evidence before everyone forgets about it and accepts it without proof.
You might as well ask for proof that the twin towers were actually destroyed by explosive planted by the government, or that planes are using chemtrails to mind-control us all, or that God exists!
"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1
2014/09/17 23:25:57
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
You're right, I don't. It's a site founded by a right-wing nutcase with a bad history of lying and manufacturing "controversies" to attack his political enemies, and the site seems to be doing a good job of carrying on its founder's vision. If there's a Breitbart article claiming that the sky is blue any sensible person should still go take a look outside to verify it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/17 23:32:28
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2014/09/17 23:32:10
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Well, that's some pretty heavy lack of consistency going on right there if so.
Freedom of Information act was used for the death threats.
As for the other stuff, look at silverstring, they interconnect everything. There is loads of evidence.
Okay, that is priceless
Ashiraya: “What are the evidence? Please give me the evidence!”
Mechanical Crow: “There is loads of evidence. I am not going to give them because this is the end of my message, but there are lots of them. They must be unspeakable or something”
"Our fantasy settings are grim and dark, but that is not a reflection of who we are or how we feel the real world should be. [...] We will continue to diversify the cast of characters we portray [...] so everyone can find representation and heroes they can relate to. [...] If [you don't feel the same way], you will not be missed"
https://twitter.com/WarComTeam/status/1268665798467432449/photo/1
2014/09/17 23:43:56
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Mechanical Crow wrote: As for the other stuff, look at silverstring, they interconnect everything. There is loads of evidence.
I don't see evidence, I see speculation. Right now you're looking like the 9/11 conspiracy crowd: lots of speculation about how everything "connects", but very little evidence that any of the connections mean anything.
(And just in case it isn't clear, 9/11 conspiracy theories are almost all ing stupid and you really don't want to look like the kind of tinfoil hatter that believes in them.)
There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices.
2014/09/17 23:48:56
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Well, that's some pretty heavy lack of consistency going on right there if so.
There is no concrete evidence that Zoe and Quinn tricked people out of money. There is a load of circumstantial evidence that they have been acting skeevy and dishonest.
And once again, personally - like many other people involved - I didn't start caring about this whole deal until the concerted push to tell me that I am irrelevant, that a hobby and identity that has been near and dear to my heart for about 25 years is dead... because there are some jerks in it. I have a hard time giving a crap about Zoe's personal involvement except for as a member of that anti gamer group.
2014/09/17 23:55:54
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
That said, there is pretty solid evidence of dishonesty and shady as feth business practices among the games journos and developers - investing in a game and then providing coverage and/or cash prizes to directly benefit financially without disclosing those ties.
And the major push to keep things centered around those two and misogyny from the games media is in large part a smokescreen to keep people from caring about it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/18 00:02:33
2014/09/18 00:06:17
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
That said, there is pretty solid evidence of dishonesty and shady as feth business practices among the games journos and developers - investing in a game and then providing coverage and/or cash prizes to directly benefit financially without disclosing those ties.
And the major push to keep things centered around those two and misogyny from the games media is in large part a smokescreen to keep people from caring about it.
This I do not deny. I think it's outrageous to use feminism and anti-misogyny as a shield to hide corruption, and that it is harmful to those fighting true sexism.
But I see people's protests crossing over into 'feminism is bad and sjw' which is just as bad, in the other direction.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/18 00:08:10
That said, there is pretty solid evidence of dishonesty and shady as feth business practices among the games journos and developers - investing in a game and then providing coverage and/or cash prizes to directly benefit financially without disclosing those ties.
And the major push to keep things centered around those two and misogyny from the games media is in large part a smokescreen to keep people from caring about it.
This I do not deny. I think it's outrageous to use feminism and anti-misogyny as a shield to hide corruption.
But I see people's protests crossing over into 'feminism is bad and sjw' which is just as bad, in the other direction.
I think that a lot of that is people who are like me, only less well adjusted or more willing to abuse internet anonymity. The mindset is that "These people are coming into my hobby, these young, fairly attractive people, and telling me that I am doing it wrong. All the crap I went through growing up, video games were what I used to deal with it... and now these a-holes are telling me I need to do things their way? Screw that!" So they go on the attack.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/18 00:11:37
2014/09/18 00:21:14
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
That's pretty much how I feel about this. I have stopped telling people in our hobby to stop playing games x, y, or z because they're bad (ala GW vs PP debates here on dakka). This has traveled over into just generally how I feel about people and their fun time.
Gamers play video games, we play what we like and will buy what we want. Unfortunately for indie devs trying to progress video games beyond eye candy and action heroes, the major corps are not going to pick those up and give them the press that games like Call of Duty get.
But when someone tells me that I'm doing my hobby wrong, then I get defensive because the only person that can tell me I'm hobbying wrong is me, everyone else can feth off.
DR:80+S++G+M+B+I+Pwmhd11#++D++A++++/sWD-R++++T(S)DM+ Ask me about Brushfire or Endless: Fantasy Tactics
2014/09/18 00:31:33
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
Your opinion is factually incorrect, Alf. I know this.
An example I had recently involved Flames of War, it's really hated by a by some who will badmouth it continuously to anyone asking about it. Nothing constructive or pointing out issues, just saying "It's wrong and bad and you're a bad person if you consider it".
My response was to just hand them the rules and some scenarios, explain a bit how it works and leave it at that. Sigh.
Prestor Jon wrote: Because children don't have any legal rights until they're adults. A minor is the responsiblity of the parent and has no legal rights except through his/her legal guardian or parent.
2014/09/18 00:36:41
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
There is no concrete evidence that Zoe and Quinn tricked people out of money.
Thank you, that was everything I was asking for!
Here's the problem, I can spend a few hours writing a post with all the links all the connections and tons of 30 minute videos that show the proof. Would you actually go through it all? Probably not.
And here's the other problem, peregrine and hybrid have already admitted to doing no research or ignoring it without watching/reading. So why bother doing the leg work for you when I already know the response? Peregrines been using ad hominems like crazy, Hybrid has a hard on for me and both will twist it to agree with them no matter how far. Corporate is posting some links but its all the polygon, kotaku stuff, and we cant really take their word on it with all the counters provided. It seems pointless to try and convince you when you've proven to be nothing but obtuse and dismissive. Spending that amount of effort on convincing people that don't matter seems like a waste of time.
In the meanwhile, Im writing letters and emails to all the advertisers and actually doing something for this. You can keep polluting this thread but you are doing nothing to stop it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/18 00:39:20
MrDwhitey wrote: Your opinion is factually incorrect, Alf. I know this.
An example I had recently involved Flames of War, it's really hated by a by some who will badmouth it continuously to anyone asking about it. Nothing constructive or pointing out issues, just saying "It's wrong and bad and you're a bad person if you consider it".
My response was to just hand them the rules and some scenarios, explain a bit how it works and leave it at that. Sigh.
I rescind my previous statement, the only one that can tell my I'm hobbying wrong is me Whitey.
DR:80+S++G+M+B+I+Pwmhd11#++D++A++++/sWD-R++++T(S)DM+ Ask me about Brushfire or Endless: Fantasy Tactics
2014/09/18 00:44:25
Subject: The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
There is no concrete evidence that Zoe and Quinn tricked people out of money.
Thank you, that was everything I was asking for!
Nor have I ever said as much, but there are lots of personal relationships that go on in games journalism they are completely obvious and they are not disclosed.
From whom are unforgiven we bring the mercy of war.
2014/09/18 00:45:42
Subject: Re:The Gamergate, Scandal, Conspiracy, and Journalism Corruption
ing stupid and you really don't want to look like the kind of tinfoil hatter that believes in them.)
