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I think the "ebay oddities" thread on dakka has some boxes for things like stormclaw that went for 125 usd

morgoth wrote:
I don't think most of the OOP stuff is worth a premium though.

Who wants the RT uglies anyway ?

Collectors, maybe?
They do have a quaint charm about them.

I wouldn't at all mind having some of the old necron warriors:



Not quite Rogue Trader, granted, but you get the idea.

The way I see it is, used is used. I bargain hunt like mad, and I know what I'm willing to spend. If someone feels their stuff is worth more, that's perfectly fine. But if it's above what I am willing to spend/value it at, then we just can't make a deal. I'm stingy. My entire Ork collection (over 5k points now) I bought for less than 800 dollars. Because I'm a cheap prick and let the Ebay auctions float into my pocket :p

I feel bad when I can't haggle further with people. I know they value their work, and I try my best not to be rude or insult people. The reason I also keep my bids low is because of the work I'll end up having to put into them. Unless something is SUPER nicely painted, to the point I don't want to ruin it, 99.9% of the stuff I buy is getting new paint to match my current scheme, even if my work will be inferior to theirs. Time is money, and I don't wish to pay top dollar for something I need to invest so much more time into. :(

You know what is funny, no one in my area appeared to buy that Sanctus Reach box. I think I walk by a couple most every day when I stop by the shop.

Super Newb wrote:Or at the other end of the spectrum:
http://www.engadget.com/2007/07/18/uk-teen-buys-ps2-receives-44-000/

And of course, the opposite of that:



"You can do this once every 30 times and still have a 97% positive feedback"

lol. That's why I only go with 99% positive or above.

As someone who is contemplating selling his Forgeworld army (thankfully it seems finances will work out so I wont have to , fingers crossed!) I actually have the OPPOSITE feel when it comes to selling. Often people will give very low offers despite the models being constructed well, in great condition and have a solid paintjob and im sorry but to me if they are all of the above you have the right to charge retail price if not more for the condition they are in.

It all depends.

Recently i decided to bolster my old eldar force.
Buying RT dreadnoughts at £1 + £2 P+P sounds fine to me

However, paying on average of £5 for a complete eldar guardian or dire avenger isnt as fun.


Some prices do make you wonder though.

Also, if i see something that is assembled and i can see it has been done well (mold lines removed etc) then i dont mind paying near on full RRP as it saves me a job.

Some times though there just isnt a great choice.

gmaleron wrote:As someone who is contemplating selling his Forgeworld army (thankfully it seems finances will work out so I wont have to , fingers crossed!) I actually have the OPPOSITE feel when it comes to selling. Often people will give very low offers despite the models being constructed well, in great condition and have a solid paintjob and im sorry but to me if they are all of the above you have the right to charge retail price if not more for the condition they are in.

But it's what purchasers will pay, not how much effort it took to produce. It's one of the many reasons why communism failed.

The thing that's important is how much the purchaser is going to get from buying your product that determines the value. In this case, by assembling the models you've saved them a bit of work, but you've also ruined the person's ability to do conversion work or kitbashing, or other customizing (which is a big part of the hobby). For lazy people you've slightly improved the value of the item, but for everyone else you've decreased it, as they now have to find a way to disassemble what you've already done without ruining the pieces. The same is true for painting. You might like your paint job, but others might not, and odds are good that your color scheme won't match their army, so they're going to have to paint it anyways. Except now they need to strip the minis first, so once again you've added more work for them to do.

It's sort of like if you bought a nice BMW sports car and then lovingly airbrushed a picture of a unicorn on the side. It doesn't matter how much you like the painting, and it doesn't matter how long it took you to make. Nobody wants a BMW with your unicorn on it. If they buy your car, the first thing they're going to do is have to repaint it, and that cost drives down the price people are willing to pay.

For most people, the easiest way to get the most consistent results is to buy stuff NiB and put in the effort to do it themselves. Anything else likely just adds work they have to do and adds risk that it might not come out how they want it (which is why things that have been plastic glued rightly sell for a tiny fraction of retail prices).

And on the other side of that coin, I just picked up a Stormtalon from eBay just primed black, the body merely slotted in, not glued, the engines mobile, the turret pivoting and loose (in the correct way), every gun on the sprues included (except lascannons) and the side gun sections themselves magnetized for $15 UNDER retail price. I'd have gladly paid retail or a few bucks more to get this quality of build.

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
And on the other side of that coin, I just picked up a Stormtalon from eBay just primed black, the body merely slotted in, not glued, the engines mobile, the turret pivoting and loose (in the correct way), every gun on the sprues included (except lascannons) and the side gun sections themselves magnetized for $15 UNDER retail price. I'd have gladly paid retail or a few bucks more to get this quality of build.

That's a darn good point. I've found well built vehicles can go for a good amount cheaper if you look around long enough. I love love love kitbashing and converting so I almost never buy glued together models, but vehicles are the exception - besides a few little bits slapped on top they are built the same as the instructions say to build them. But who wants to waste time doing that lol. For example I bought my chimeras for my Inquisition army at least ten dollars under regular list price and they were all glued together and primed. Saved me a lot of time that did...

 Ailaros wrote:

Super Newb wrote:Or at the other end of the spectrum:
http://www.engadget.com/2007/07/18/uk-teen-buys-ps2-receives-44-000/

And of course, the opposite of that:

"You can do this once every 30 times and still have a 97% positive feedback"

Xalt for XKCD.

Also, ebay deletes negative feedback (they've deleted mine), so you could have 99,9%


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
And on the other side of that coin, I just picked up a Stormtalon from eBay just primed black, the body merely slotted in, not glued, the engines mobile, the turret pivoting and loose (in the correct way), every gun on the sprues included (except lascannons) and the side gun sections themselves magnetized for $15 UNDER retail price. I'd have gladly paid retail or a few bucks more to get this quality of build.

$15 under retail is like 20% off right ?
Good for you that it was properly built though, that must be damn lucky

Most people want to make their money back if they are getting out of 40k. Unfortunately most of the used stuff i see on ebay is assembled like a turd and not worth the time and effort to refurb it.

OOP metal models are a preference thing. it might be nostalgia it might be that you really like the older models. Metal is by far the easiest to refurb. you can use harsh chemicals to remove paint completely and this will often timed eat the glue away too.

All my striking scorpions are the 2nd edition ones except the exarch, who is a converted 3rd ed version. Same with my dark reapers, i am haording up the 3rd ed version because i simply like that sculpt the best.

Yes, generally speaking, people who have models that are actually well painted/assembled dont have to go to e-bay because their stuff sells locally by those who know it firsthand and the peopl want to give their buds first crack at it. This means the stuff that makes it to e-bay is almost by definition crap no one is willing to pay the outragous prices for. Of course, once in a great while, you get lucky but generally speaking, only non-gamers are fooled. lol
Usually, I'd rather settle for a "mere" 20% off knowing its coming from a reputable dealers with some sort of customer servicethan gamble with a total stranger for only slightly lower prices. Bird in hand and all that. I've bought online but am REALLY picky and even so, still got burned for an al rahem model the guy never packed and never answered my questions to him about it (disapeared from the face of the earth apparently) and I am glad to have only been cheated out of that single model by him. of course, there is also the time i bought a "NOS/NIB set of assault marines where the guy cherry picked the special weapons out of the box along with all but one head.....

 SharkoutofWata wrote:
And on the other side of that coin, I just picked up a Stormtalon from eBay just primed black, the body merely slotted in, not glued, the engines mobile, the turret pivoting and loose (in the correct way), every gun on the sprues included (except lascannons) and the side gun sections themselves magnetized for $15 UNDER retail price. I'd have gladly paid retail or a few bucks more to get this quality of build.

While that's great, that's an exception rather than a rule. Almost all built second hand stuff I've gotten hold of, I frankly wish I hadn't bloody bothered and just bought new. It's gotten to the point where I wouldn't fork over more than 10% msrp for something built and painted unless it's actually very high quality work. I've had to deal with far too many Brother Thickpaint Mcmeltyfaces. Metal and new on sprue are all I'm willing to pay serious prices for now.

There's some actual psych studies on point about this sort of thing. If a person puts effort into constructing a thing, they will value it more highly. They see significant time investment. You see messy glue and brush strokes.

Yeah, bad modelers should stick to superglue, so it just breaks in the paint removal process.

I had to remove WalMart orange spray from skimmers, made you feel like a hundred coats of GW + 'ardcoat + something to make it even worse.

Yeah... I never buy used. Just think, some snot nosed brat or dirty geek had his grubby mitts all over what you're buying. Those long nights just sweating all over those minis as he painted away. Moar like defiled, amirite? That noise! I'm really nitpicky about things like that. If the seal is broken, it's not a virgin anymore and I don't want it.

Add to that, people seem to think that a crummy paint job somehow makes their miniatures more valuable. Nope. It makes it less valuable.

Just saying...

I love to watch the bits market too, a bit of maths and you can do wonders... The other day I scored 6 Devilfish chassis (new off sprue) for $2 a pop, got the engines (new off sprue) for $5 a pair... I now have 6 devilfish at 8$ each... Sure they got no weapons but I just wait a few months till the sucker has lost hope of selling the rest of the parts to make up for his loss or just make my own...



Automatically Appended Next Post:
I also only buy NIB... I've had enough experience fixing/removing dodgy paint jobs, some times the NIB are only a few bucks more expensive and come with options... also it may be in good condition, but it angers me when some 10 y/o attachs the engines backwards, i mean c'mon, you get instructions...

The bits market is very weird, you can often get chassis for nothing, and then small bits cost you the price of the tank.

I tried buying bits to convert my Falcons.. it would've cost as much as a new Wave Serpent anyway.

morgoth wrote:
I don't think most of the OOP stuff is worth a premium though.

Who wants the RT uglies anyway ?

Not that many want them but they are collectible because of nostalgia and genuine interest in the older things. The supply of some RT stuff is very limited which drives the prices up for the few that want it.

 Sir Arun wrote:
OOP stuff always costs more than it did during retail. You're in luck if you find a... well... idiot who doesnt know the value of his stuff and lets it go off for cheap.

I managed to get a metal techmarine with a really nice paint job (in my armies colors) for around $8 including shipping

dsmith10 wrote:

 Sir Arun wrote:
OOP stuff always costs more than it did during retail. You're in luck if you find a... well... idiot who doesnt know the value of his stuff and lets it go off for cheap.

I managed to get a metal techmarine with a really nice paint job (in my armies colors) for around $8 including shipping

There are still many auctions like that. It doesn't sound like particularly cheap.

Personally I will pay 30-40% on new on sprue, and a little more on assembled and primed, then less on painted since I have to remove paint. Its an order of precedence thing. I value NIS models less than I value assembled and primed as that saves me a lot of work, and when I sell things I sell them accordingly as well. If I have done a decent job painting them in what can be seen as a normal paint scheme(ie a codex scheme, not a home brew), I might very well sell them at price or at no more than 10% off full price. I have only done that with a few armies however.

Sounds fair too. I wish I could get 40% on NIS though.

 Ailaros wrote:

gmaleron wrote:As someone who is contemplating selling his Forgeworld army (thankfully it seems finances will work out so I wont have to , fingers crossed!) I actually have the OPPOSITE feel when it comes to selling. Often people will give very low offers despite the models being constructed well, in great condition and have a solid paintjob and im sorry but to me if they are all of the above you have the right to charge retail price if not more for the condition they are in.

But it's what purchasers will pay, not how much effort it took to produce. It's one of the many reasons why communism failed.

The thing that's important is how much the purchaser is going to get from buying your product that determines the value.

This.

It amazes me that people sell OOP models but use current GW pricing for the base.
Example some months back I saw a guy listed 30 dire avengers on bartertown. I sent him a message and he wanted 50% off retail at 41 bucks a box of 5. That didn't seem awful to me. They were already built he said. So that's a plus. Then he sent me pics of these hideous metal models(hideous to me). I of course said no.
That's the kind of stuff that makes my face hurt. Most OOP is worse then its new versions. Notice I said most. Yet people think its worth current value.

I think most is really a good word there

morgoth wrote:
I'm looking for some things for my Eldar army right now, and I keep on bumping into threads where people ask for more than the RRP, or at most 20% under, which I can get new (of course).

It used to be that you could often find 40K used stuff at 50+% off but it seems some people have just gone crazy...

There are Eldar armies in the dakka swap shop that are listed for more than their RRP (or even just RRP) even though they contain horrible outdated models, incomplete options, ugly paint to be removed ...

dafuq!

Is it me or is that really a trend ?

How do you guys find good deals ?

Trading is infinitely better.

morgoth wrote:The bits market is very weird, you can often get chassis for nothing, and then small bits cost you the price of the tank.

That pricing scheme sort of makes sense, but it's weird that that's the one consistent deal I can almost always find: chassis. I made my three hellhounds for bumpkis - like $5 per chassis and a bit of time spent with plasticard and PVC.

GreyHamster wrote:While that's great, that's an exception rather than a rule. Almost all built second hand stuff I've gotten hold of, I frankly wish I hadn't bloody bothered and just bought new. It's gotten to the point where I wouldn't fork over more than 10% msrp for something built and painted unless it's actually very high quality work. I've had to deal with far too many Brother Thickpaint Mcmeltyfaces. Metal and new on sprue are all I'm willing to pay serious prices for now.

Yeah. I have gotten a couple of deals in the past where it was on partially assembled stuff that was a good deal. Like, the person cut all the bitz off the sprue and horribly plastic glued one of them together, and is selling it for 50% off. Even considering that 1 of the 5 models is a complete throwaway, the rest was effectively on-sprue (they didn't horribly hack it when they removed them), which meant I got NiB 80% for 50% the price, which is still almost 40% off.

EVIL INC wrote:Yes, generally speaking, people who have models that are actually well painted/assembled dont have to go to e-bay because their stuff sells locally by those who know it firsthand and the peopl want to give their buds first crack at it.

An interesting hypothesis.

Another thing to consider is that real, proper professional painters that consistently make money off their work don't use eBay. They have their own businesses, or sorts. They take clients and have contracts, etc.

Like look at GMM. You have to call him up with a project, and he accepts, and then you pay him, and he does what you want, and then you get your minis. He doesn't paint up minis and then go to eBay and hope somebody wants to buy them.

 Ailaros wrote:
Another thing to consider is that real, proper professional painters that consistently make money off their work don't use eBay. They have their own businesses, or sorts. They take clients and have contracts, etc.

Like look at GMM. You have to call him up with a project, and he accepts, and then you pay him, and he does what you want, and then you get your minis. He doesn't paint up minis and then go to eBay and hope somebody wants to buy them.

Even better, most good artisans are booked for at least six months.

And they're well worth the six months wait (Mike @ Terranscapes for example)