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So I played a few games over the week(first time playing DE since new codex). I must say, they really surprised me. 3+ jink is pretty nice to have; warrior gun boats with splinter racks also was nice to have.

The units that stood out the most were the venoms for sure. I played against SM,BA,Nurgle Daemons and Necrons. The hardest time I had was against the BA and their low scatter DS.

 Jimsolo wrote:

 Sinful Hero wrote:

Hollismason wrote:
I'm surprised not to see more Dark Eldar armies with allied in Hornets and shadow weavers.

A lot of folks are still allergic to Forgeworld. It's really odd to me.

The price is egregious. And secondhand minis are difficult to obtain, at least moreso than standard plastic ones.

It's really not that much of a price difference between a Hornet from Forgeworld and a Ravager. They're better than Ravagers in every single way.

The Ravager is $5 more expensive, approximately, but only if you don't consider the ridiculously high international shipping, which jacks up FW prices to the point of unaffordability.

Wellll...if you order over something like $500 you get free shipping. I believe they hand out free shipping vouchers occasionally, but you may have to order something small to get one, or know someone who bought something and won't use it.

Don't they ship for free to GW stores as well?

And if you go to a convention where they'll be present you can pick it up there for no extra charge(such as Gencon in Indianapolis).

 Sinful Hero wrote:
Wellll...if you order over something like $500 you get free shipping. I believe they hand out free shipping vouchers occasionally, but you may have to order something small to get one, or know someone who bought something and won't use it.

Don't they ship for free to GW stores as well?

And if you go to a convention where they'll be present you can pick it up there for no extra charge(such as Gencon in Indianapolis).

Unfortunately, there are no major cons or GWs anywhere near those of us stranded in the middle of the swamp in Southern Illinois.

Oh cool you live in Illinois? How far from Chicago.

Hollismason wrote:
Oh cool you live in Illinois? How far from Chicago.

Herrin to Chicago looks to be about 320 miles.

Yeah that's way to far to drive to pick up at a GW store.

I go to the Elk Grove GW when we visit my wife's family up there, (Matt runs a great shop!) but that's way too far of a drive just to save the shipping costs.

Hollismason wrote:

 Jimsolo wrote:

 Sinful Hero wrote:

Hollismason wrote:
I'm surprised not to see more Dark Eldar armies with allied in Hornets and shadow weavers.

A lot of folks are still allergic to Forgeworld. It's really odd to me.

The price is egregious. And secondhand minis are difficult to obtain, at least moreso than standard plastic ones.

It's really not that much of a price difference between a Hornet from Forgeworld and a Ravager. They're better than Ravagers in every single way.

Ravagers are better at hurting AV13 and much better against AV14 than Hornets.

mercury14 wrote:
Ravagers are better at hurting AV13 and much better against AV14 than Hornets.

Agreed - and even at the price point it's 125 v. 125, right? So it's not even a savings for army construction.
I guess it depends on how much AV 10-12 and how much AV 13+ you see in your meta, and also whether you are already taking Eldar as a flavor to your army, really.

 Jimsolo wrote:
I go to the Elk Grove GW when we visit my wife's family up there, (Matt runs a great shop!) but that's way too far of a drive just to save the shipping costs.

If you had it shipped to his store, would he then ship it to you? I'm guessing this may be a cheaper way... if "Matt" is willing to do it.

 Thor665 wrote:

mercury14 wrote:
Ravagers are better at hurting AV13 and much better against AV14 than Hornets.

Agreed - and even at the price point it's 125 v. 125, right? So it's not even a savings for army construction.
I guess it depends on how much AV 10-12 and how much AV 13+ you see in your meta, and also whether you are already taking Eldar as a flavor to your army, really.

It's no longer 125 for Hornets, they're substantially cheaper now. Price point is like 190 for two hornets with 4 Pulse Lasers. Also they have the special movement rules etc..

I think it's like 80 points base for a Hornet with 2 Pulse Lasers.

The ravager to me is just like pointless, it's to expensive for what it brings, I'd rather go with a Dark Eldar Raider list and take 3 Razorwings with more fire power and 3 less Dark Lance shot than a Ravager.

Ravager Load out = 3 Dark Lances, Night Shields = 140

Razorwing Dark Lances, 4 Missiles, Splinter cannon , Night shields = 165

I know which one I'd rather take. It's just not a contest.

Hollismason wrote:

 Thor665 wrote:

mercury14 wrote:
Ravagers are better at hurting AV13 and much better against AV14 than Hornets.

Agreed - and even at the price point it's 125 v. 125, right? So it's not even a savings for army construction.
I guess it depends on how much AV 10-12 and how much AV 13+ you see in your meta, and also whether you are already taking Eldar as a flavor to your army, really.

It's no longer 125 for Hornets, they're substantially cheaper now. Price point is like 190 for two hornets with 4 Pulse Lasers. Also they have the special movement rules etc..

I think it's like 80 points base for a Hornet with 2 Pulse Lasers.

The ravager to me is just like pointless, it's to expensive for what it brings, I'd rather go with a Dark Eldar Raider list and take 3 Razorwings with more fire power and 3 less Dark Lance shot than a Ravager.

Ravager Load out = 3 Dark Lances, Night Shields = 140

Razorwing Dark Lances, 4 Missiles, Splinter cannon , Night shields = 165

I know which one I'd rather take. It's just not a contest.

I have never really had a problem with ravagers.... So far they have done the job I have set for them. That's all I could ask for. Reapers are great, but so far my experiences with "One hit wonders" has been very bad.

Yeah although I find Ravagers aren't outright bad they are a bit underwhelming for their points cost now. I think the Razorwing is one of the better value flyers in the game, I just wish they had given us an option with one of the missiles to not be a blast so it could hit other flyers.

ryuken87 wrote:
Yeah although I find Ravagers aren't outright bad they are a bit underwhelming for their points cost now. I think the Razorwing is one of the better value flyers in the game, I just wish they had given us an option with one of the missiles to not be a blast so it could hit other flyers.

It seems the Fighter has a Multi purpose role. That's what makes it nice to have

ryuken87 wrote:
Yeah although I find Ravagers aren't outright bad they are a bit underwhelming for their points cost now. I think the Razorwing is one of the better value flyers in the game, I just wish they had given us an option with one of the missiles to not be a blast so it could hit other flyers.

I'm painting up a second Razorwing for exactly this reason, they seem very good for their points. A pair of them coming across the map in formation really hurts stuff without preventing you from still running MSU.

DaKKaLAnce wrote:

ryuken87 wrote:
Yeah although I find Ravagers aren't outright bad they are a bit underwhelming for their points cost now. I think the Razorwing is one of the better value flyers in the game, I just wish they had given us an option with one of the missiles to not be a blast so it could hit other flyers.

It seems the Fighter has a Multi purpose role. That's what makes it nice to have

I still like it, I'd just like it better if the Razorwing could be kitted out as a dedicated anti-air option akin to the Crimson Hunter (what I imagine a "fighter plane" should be) and the Voidraven for ground forces. The missiles are good, I especially like Shatterfields, but we already have hundreds of poison shots which do the same job. The Voidraven is just a bit flimsy to justify its points. We're talking Stormraven/Stormwolf points once you put the missiles on it.

Another thing going for the Razorwing is the price of the kit. £23 from discount sites is very good going for a GW product.

EDIT: Also, it would have been better had the Razorwing stayed in Heavy Support!

I like the razorwing in fast attack.....The realspace raider detachment is great for them. lets you get up to 6 FA , which is great for DE

Everytime I write a list I have that same problem. Fast Attack is just too crowded for what I want to run.

Hollismason wrote:
The ravager to me is just like pointless, it's to expensive for what it brings, I'd rather go with a Dark Eldar Raider list and take 3 Razorwings with more fire power and 3 less Dark Lance shot than a Ravager.

Ravager Load out = 3 Dark Lances, Night Shields = 140

Razorwing Dark Lances, 4 Missiles, Splinter cannon , Night shields = 165

I know which one I'd rather take. It's just not a contest.

I take both, personally.

No reason not to bring both. They don't even compete for slots anymore. The Razorwing is harder to destroy, but vastly less maneuverable. I like both.

I could see a beta strike list being particularly nasty with a combination of Razorwings , Ravagers, and Eldar Hornets.

Something like.


Dark Artisan

Scalpel Squadron

HQ w/ Venom

2 Squads w/ Venom

1 Reaver
2 Razorwings

3 Ravagers w/ Dark Lances

1 Autarch

3 Hornets

Comm Relay or whatever

2 Razorwings kitted, 3 Ravagers , 3 Hornets = 780

That's 25 ST8 AP2 Shots, 13 of which have Lance special rule. All of which can come on with a beta strike.

That is a nasty list. Not a huge fan of allying in CWE but I'm forced to admit that they can do AT a little better than the DE.

Unfortunately there is no way to "fit" a Dark Artisan in it that I can find and a Scalpel Squadron. Dark Artisan is my favourite formation. At least not in 1850.

I gotta say, y'all are starting to grow my mild interest in Dark Eldar into an obsession! They seem a lot less daunting now that I have read so much about them.

Well DE is a great army to play....A good glass cannon army imo. Hit hard, but cant take a hit(nice cover saves)

It's not really even that much of a glass cannon considering what you can do with Cronos and FNP etc..

Hollismason wrote:
It's not really even that much of a glass cannon considering what you can do with Cronos and FNP etc..

Well using a coven list makes it less of one.... But DE like to hit hard and fast. Thats one of their perks.

Well specifically Grotesques and Talos would be fun army to play. I dunno how hardcore it would be but something like

Grotesquiries

Dark Artisans

and then take a Detachment to take some flying support.