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No doubt. That is the purpose of the scene in ESB. It not only relates to what Yoda is teaching Luke but also foreshadows the big moment on Bespin. My point is, when we think back to the vision while watching Luke and Vader talk and later fight in RotJ, now the meaning is different for us and for Luke: it is the conviction that there is a person inside of all that fear, anger, and aggression.

If true, this could go either way.

In one way, never go M. Night Shyamalan. A twist for the sake of a twist isn't intelligent script writing.

In another, I recall the words of Aaron Eckhart's Harvey Dent. "You either die a hero, or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain." How does a man put a republic back together? And what would be the cost to that man to do so? This years revolutionary is next years despot.

Time will tell if this is A. true and B. effective as a plot.

 Manchu wrote:
No doubt. That is the purpose of the scene in ESB. It not only relates to what Yoda is teaching Luke but also foreshadows the big moment on Bespin. My point is, when we think back to the vision while watching Luke and Vader talk and later fight in RotJ, now the meaning is different for us and for Luke: it is the conviction that there is a person inside of all that fear, anger, and aggression.

But which person is it? Vader? That's certainly the implication. But could it be Luke? Could it be both? I think the new film could add a new layer of potential interpretations to Luke's vision in the cave.

I think it would make the most sense to see that an older Luke has withdrawn from public life, is disaffected from the New Republic and may have even lost control of the New Jedi Order. Luke's journey would not leave him a cynic and it is really difficult to imagine him falling to the Dark Side. After all, his idealism proved correct in the end. There were probably other, less idealistic voices in the Alliance (like Borsk Fey'lya in the now defunct EU).

I'm perfectly okay with Luke turning to the dark side in the new movies, if he can be redeemed without being killed by the end. He has definitely tip-toed the line to the dark side. I'm interested to see how this plays out. But it has happened before.

Luke isn't evil. A pussy, yes, but evil, no. Hell, in every movie he had to be carried by someone else.

In Star Wars, Han keeps Vader from shooting him out of the trench before he can fire the torpedo.

In Empire Strikes Back, Vader hands him his ass (and cuts off his hand) and once again he has to be saved by Leia and Chewy.

In Return of the Jedi, the Emporer is kicking his ass and daddy has to save him.

Raven911 wrote:
Luke isn't evil. A pussy, yes, but evil, no. Hell, in every movie he had to be carried by someone else.

In Star Wars, Han keeps Vader from shooting him out of the trench before he can fire the torpedo.

In Empire Strikes Back, Vader hands him his ass (and cuts off his hand) and once again he has to be saved by Leia and Chewy.

In Return of the Jedi, the Emporer is kicking his ass and daddy has to save him.

Really? I thought in 'return of the jedi' he pretty much came to Hans's and leia's rescue after they almost died and to be fair the only reason why the emperor was beating him so badly is because he wouldn't kill his father and possibly not the emperor either. Sure daddy saved him but he kicked dad's *ss beforehand and flipped off the emperor with his morality. Not only that but he saved his dad in the moral department in a sense.

------------

I more have problems with the character of darth vader. Does anybody know just how many officers he force choked to death? Seriously it's become a thing. I've complained about it before and i will here as well. Your leadership is going to take a serious hit if you kill off your own leaders more than assassins ever could. At the very least he could reward good service and punish bad service or even freaking torture them in an unspecified way. If you kill them it leaves the leadership with somebody less experienced with facing the current opponent. I wouldn't be surprised if they had some rookies that never faced the rebellion thrust into the position of command before being killed and being replaced by an even more inept leader. My problem is that experience is something you learn from (even with losses). You learn tactics and you get smarter. In vader's plans you need a 100% success rate or you get 'force choked' to death. Not an 80 or 90 percent success rate but 100%. If the imperial leadership was ever poor it was probably due to vader without him even meaning it.

Also even despite manipulation the baddies prove if you're going to be a jerk to people and they believe the opposing side will offer more and has a chance at winning then they'll probably switch to the nicer side. It's why using bombs (or a freaking death star planet destroyer) probably creates a lot more enemies than if you were more precise with who you killed and kept bystanders out of the line of fire.

The more hype, the more interest.

People will see it anyway, so fueling nerdrage is a good advertising strategy for this film.

I am happy to wait and see, and likely I will wait for video.

In the EU, Vader was pretty unhappy with the Empire as it stood. Maybe he was doing his part to tear it down so he could rebuild it in his image.

I'm disappointed.

I thought the big spoiler would be that Han came out as a Furry, divorces Leia and runs off with Chewie. Meanwhile, R2 and 3PO adopt a droid despite being a same sex droid couple.

Those would have been spoilers.

How do you R2 isn't female?

"He" has never really displayed any specific gender programming.

 Grey Templar wrote:
How do you R2 isn't female?

"He" has never really displayed any specific gender programming.

Come now, "connecting" to other machines with a phallos-looking probe tjingamajig.

 Grey Templar wrote:
How do you R2 isn't female?

"He" has never really displayed any specific gender programming.

R2 is a robot and therefore doesn't have a gender.

No, but droids can have masculine or feminine programming.

3P0 obviously has a masculine personality(albeit a rather effeminate one)

Chopper in the new Rebels series has definite masculine programming.

 flamingkillamajig wrote:
Sure daddy saved him but he kicked dad's *ss beforehand ...

Which is all the more impressive when you consider that Anakin was supposedly one of the best lightsabre duelists around, while Luke's training largely consisted of a week running around in a swamp with an ancient mogwai on his back...

 insaniak wrote:

 flamingkillamajig wrote:
Sure daddy saved him but he kicked dad's *ss beforehand ...

Which is all the more impressive when you consider that Anakin was supposedly one of the best lightsabre duelists around, while Luke's training largely consisted of a week running around in a swamp with an ancient mogwai on his back...

It's the prequel we really need:

 d-usa wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

 flamingkillamajig wrote:
Sure daddy saved him but he kicked dad's *ss beforehand ...

Which is all the more impressive when you consider that Anakin was supposedly one of the best lightsabre duelists around, while Luke's training largely consisted of a week running around in a swamp with an ancient mogwai on his back...

It's the prequel we really need:

But not the one we deserve

I debated on whether or not to start a new thread, but I decided to post this here to keep Episode VII rumors somewhat consolidated.

Nerdist has some pretty awesome Episode VII concept art that has leaked out to the internet: http://www.nerdist.com/2014/10/star-wars-episode-vii-concept-art-leaks-onto-the-web/

I looked through it and all I can say is... AWESOME!

Some stuff that stood out to me:

Nice! There's some cool stuff there. I changed the threat title to reflect this find.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Gosh I hope this isn't Luke:

....I hope it isn't Luke too. And didn't they burn the helmet of Darthvader along with the rest of his armor

That would explain this picture I saw earlier:



I didn't know if it was a real thing, but since it's mentioned in the article it seems like it could be legit.

Sining wrote:
....I hope it isn't Luke too. And didn't they burn the helmet of Darthvader along with the rest of his armor

Yes, which is why the helmet is damaged. I know the prop was made of plastic (ABS I believe), but the "real" armor isn't so there is a good chance that most of it would survive a fire.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
This is my favorite picture so far:

It will be interesting to see how they pull everything off, so far the art seems to match the other stuff that has leaked pretty well:

 Manchu wrote:
Nice! There's some cool stuff there. I changed the threat title to reflect this find.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Gosh I hope this isn't Luke:

Spoiler:

Maybe its...

Zombie Palpatine!

 Grey Templar wrote:
Zombie Palpatine!

I would be okay with that.

... or something similiar ...

It says "cybernetic trooper" and "knight trooper". I wonder if they'll have relevance to Dark Troopers?

 insaniak wrote:

 flamingkillamajig wrote:
Sure daddy saved him but he kicked dad's *ss beforehand ...

Which is all the more impressive when you consider that Anakin was supposedly one of the best lightsabre duelists around, while Luke's training largely consisted of a week running around in a swamp with an ancient mogwai on his back...

Vader's lightsaber and Force prowess was severely limited by his life support armor.

 Knight wrote:
It says "cybernetic trooper" and "knight trooper". I wonder if they'll have relevance to Dark Troopers?

I'd say most likely not.

I'd venture to guess that it something original to the new movie.

This stuff does look great, very Ralph McQuarrie in places. I think we all know this film will be visually stunning, so if the feel of the Original Trilogy comes through in writing as well, we could be in for a treat!

No way is the 'Graverobber Luke- we've all seen Mark Hammill's epic BEARD, haven't we? He is one with the Wampas now!

 Gitzbitah wrote:
No way is the 'Graverobber Luke- we've all seen Mark Hammill's epic BEARD, haven't we? He is one with the Wampas now!

It is just concept art though...

Plus, it could be Evil Luke's apprentice.