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I just c/p from the last thread I did since the previous thread was for unrelated matters.

Found something of very serious note that people need to know. There is a major difference between Undead Legions' Resurrecting fallen Warriors and the VC Resurrecting Fallen Warriors.

Undead Legions' states "........ A unit cannot be taken beyond be taken beyond its starting size." (I think the double be taken beyond in a typo printed in the book)

VC states "A unit cannot usually be taken beyond its starting size, though certain powers, spells and special rules may provide exceptions."

Does the mean that when you take an Undead Legion army you can't increase anything using Resurrecting fallen warriors or does the specific overwrite the general even if they are from more specific books (not BRB)?

Also while looking at the UL book came across this "If a special rule affects models with the Undead special rule, it also affects models with the Nehekharan Undead special rule, and vice-versa." I feel that this does mean that it will increase the starting size for Skeleton Archer units Since the models are Skeleton warriors with the undead special rule. (That is if my above "find" is incorrect which I feel that it is but might be important).


Edit: Reading even more into it (namely the BRB) under Basic rules and advanced rules the UL resurrecting fallen warriors rule IS an advanced rule since it talks about undead and is in the relevant army book.....Help?


Also does the wording from master of the dead mean the unit Skeleton Warriors or the model Skeleton warriors? Because going by wording saying unit of skeleton warriors =/= skeleton warrior unit but a unit that is composed of skeleton warriors which skeleton archers are composed of.

As I read it, only Zombies "Newly Dead" (VC book p34) can normally be taken beyond initial size.

The other exceptions being the Necromancer with "Master of the Dead" (VC book p28) and the Vampiric Power "Summon creatures of the night" (VC book p61).

Skeleton Archers are not Skeleton Warriors and as such cannot be enhanced in size beyond their starting size.

Again, as I read it, the text on page 19 of the new rules is generic, all soldiers being warriors, not just those called "Skeleton Warriors".

Just my take on a debatable point of the rules.

H

But skeleton archers are composed of skeleton warriors. The problem is if master of the dead means the unit or model, because of the way it is worded it could mean model.

Master of the dead "The Necromancer is able to use the Invocation of Nehek spell to increase units of Skeleton Warriors beyond their starting size"

It doesn't say Skeleton Warrior units but units of skeleton warriors. In the TK book skeleton archers are composed of skeleton warriors. This is the important part to know if "Units of skeleton warriors" means the unit skeleton warriors or the model skeleton warriors


As for RFW in the new book it is considered to be advance because it talks about undead model types. As per pg 11 in the BRB "Advanced rules apply to specific types of model, whether because they have a special kind of weapon (such as a spear), unusual skills (such as flaming attacks or the ability to regenerate damaged flesh), because they are different to their fellows (such as a standard bearer or a mighty hero), or because they are not normal infantry models (a knight, a cannon or even a Dragon.)"

we have three rules that conflict with each other master of the dead/ the zombie rules say they can increase starting unit size where as the RFW in the UL army book says you can't.

We played it as that it does affect the archers, didn't matter at all, but my 20 got over 40 by the end of the game.

I'd had a feeling it wouldn't matter that much at all. But just wondering is that how you read it arcardia?

Yup. applies to archers.

Wow that is awesome. Multiple small units of archers + a lvl 4 master necro and a lvl 4 liche priest. The amount of archers with multiple shots (2) you could have on the table at that point is just disgusting.

Or lvl 4 Necro with Lore of Undeath creating units then...
Lvl 4 Necro Lore of Vampires with MotD enhancing them!

In the unit profile. A skeleton archer is listed as a skeleton warrior. Therefore you can add them with master of the dead.

Huey11 wrote:
Or lvl 4 Necro with Lore of Undeath creating units then...
Lvl 4 Necro Lore of Vampires with MotD enhancing them!

14+ to make 16 archers. It's good, but you've got better things to do with that many power dice. I'd rather have the 12+ curse of years go off, or the 15+ wind of undeath go off.
If you want arches, just flood your core with archers. The lore of vampire direct damage spells are much better than trying to make more S3 shots hitting on 5+.

-Matt

So i was all only skeleton warriors but after reading your argument and looking at the tomb kings again, think you guys are right. Archers can be raised