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With nids getting drop pods which looks to solve a lot of there issues. It got me wondering. If each codex could have one new unit that would potentially solve there problems what would it comprise of?

As an ork player I am always needed 2 things. Distance Ignores cover and some way of getting units into assault quickly. So I propose an av 14 tank with an sicarian tank style ignores cover weapon and a tellyporter weapon that sends units that are being transported directly into assault. the orks downside can be that it will kill some of your own and the unit you are tellyporting into as you would be materialising directly inside a unit.

What other codex deficiencies are there and how would you solve them?

Honestly questions like this are what lead to things like Riptides and Dreadknights and 6e-era power creep. Every Codex needs units that work too well or don't work at all fixed vastly more than they need more new units.

(That said I'd kill for a flyer that isn't fifty points too expensive in the DA book)

It is a bad way to fix a codex, if you make that one unit that "fixes" a codex everyone will get it.

 Quickjager wrote:
It is a bad way to fix a codex, if you make that one unit that "fixes" a codex everyone will get it.

Which is why Games Workshop loves to fix things this way - and thus is the most likely way something will be fixed. It's all about the money.

I don't think this is a good idea.

Bad units In Codexes should be made usable,
OP units should be returned to something approaching the norm.

The issues is getting the exact balance right - but it can't be much worse than the mess GW have made of it.

I agree with everyone else, you don't want all armies to have a Riptide/Wraithknight/Dreadknight equivalent.

Wow . I didnt expect that response. I wasn't sugesting that gw produce a riptide ect for everything. All Im suggesting is that all codexes receive the ability to succeed balance by getting the units that makes there raison d'être work. Which for orks I feal would be an effective way to get into assault quickly and have an answer to wave serpents. I think this can only enhance the game.

I think a drop pod equivalent would go a long way in making chaos very competitive.

I always thought tyranids were pretty competitive in casual play. There are still ork lists I know I'll never have a chance in beating (300+ boyz) without tailoring my list. What the tyranid units do is add some flavor to the codex. The main problem with tyranids and chaos and most of the books is there are only a handful of point effective units than can be squeezed into a list. Tyranids have several sweet units that never get playing time because the flying hive tyrant is so good for his cost, that most hyper competitive lists fit as many of those in as they can and minimize the number of troops or anything else you put in. The troop upgrade options are usually overly cost prohibitive as well. The same could be said for any other book.

I like that codices have weaknesses as it stays truer to the fluff. Although it would balance the game to give everyone AA, Ap2 etc, but it would probably make the game more boring (IMO).

I personally don't like the idea of other armies getting drop pods (even though I play Tyranids) as I think they should get other stuff instead.

For me, a Legion of the Damned 'advance squad' that doesn't require me to take a non-Legion squad to prevent a 'no models on board' first turn loss ('course, that'd kinda ruin their 'arrive in the nick of time to save XYZs bacon' flavoring).

Jimbanana123 wrote:
All Im suggesting is that all codexes receive the ability to succeed balance by getting the units that makes there raison d'être work. Which for orks I feal would be an effective way to get into assault quickly and have an answer to wave serpents.

...battlewagonz?..

Battlewagonz are to easy to explode and seem to never reach there target with the amount of high strength low ap shots that are used in 7th


And Battlewagonz are no answer to wave serpents

I would kill for a 30 ork transport of any variety (besides a pair of boots)

Jimbanana123 wrote:
Battlewagonz are to easy to explode and seem to never reach there target with the amount of high strength low ap shots that are used in 7th


And Battlewagonz are no answer to wave serpents

BW-s are one of the best assault transports in the game. I don't know what else you want. Ofc a 110 pt model will be easier to kill than a 250 pt landraider. You can't get benefits without drawbacks. Otherwise it's gona end up in a power creep that everyone hates. Play to your strengths. Orks can get to combat turn 2 with a bunch of wagons, trucks and bikes. You want an ultimate unit army? Name people who like playing vs serpent-spam eldar and don't call them boring.

and have an answer to wave serpents

And that's where I disagree - making the game better means fixing the actual broken units, not making new hard counters that will likely have their own issues.

Sort out the points, options, rules whatever over those units the community considers OP and the game environment is instantly healthier - the only issues is the exact details of how to fix them and getting people to agree "that unit" in their army need fixing. At the same time fix the units that are underpowered, have no role etc.

This is why Allies were created, to fill a role which was being missed. Unfortunately Allies were nerfed across the board (not sure why orks had to get a further nerf...) and I understand where you're coming from.

The catch is this: everyone instantly talks about giving CC armies things like Riptides and Wraithknights. This isn't really accurate. They both excel at shooting in an army which already excels at shooting. If games workshop will do anything, then they'll continue down this route, pushing an army towards it's strengths.

Orks were given very strong shooting units, but ignoring cover AP1 and 2 weapons is something I can't see happening. THIS is why Lootas are good (for example) as orks AP is so rubbish, we don't care if they're hiding in cover. A cover save vs. the armor save doesn't really matter.

What games workshop has done with the nids is this: they've seen which models they aren't seeing. So they release a model which is strong enough to alter the game plan of that army. It means nids players will be able to play those units, or buy them to use them.

Like Tankbusters. There's a reason codexes get refreshed so bad things become good. Remember when we rarely saw people playing Tau or Eldar?

Give the Orks a Battlefortress. That'll do. We already have it but the rules are scattered around and people can argue that they don't want to play against it. I would play it if I had made a model and the rules were legit (not just apocolypse).

Cheers sketchyfk that all makes sence.

It just seems wrong to try to ally with the orks.

Where are the rules for the battle fortress?

Well the only problem the Eldar codex has is getting assault units into combat. Therefore, I propose a Wave Serpent variant, that has all the perks of being a serpent, plus the assault vehicle special rule.

Nerf T8? Meh?

BA. Gimme an assault or open topped rhino.

Chaos Space Marine Chosen squads that can take a Mastery Level 1 Aspiring Champion upgrade for 25 points.

Havocs with plasma cannons. (Why is this one not discussed more?)

Chaos sniper rifles for Cultist squads and the infiltrator upgrade for basic CSM squads. (I know, I love Chaos)

and maybe some kind of summoning circle emplacement for Planetstrike.

Just my CSM ideas.

 Pyeatt wrote:
I would kill for a 30 ork transport of any variety (besides a pair of boots)

An Ork Rokk!?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Happyjew wrote:
Well the only problem the Eldar codex has is getting assault units into combat. Therefore, I propose a Wave Serpent variant, that has all the perks of being a serpent, plus the assault vehicle special rule.

I think it would have to lose something instead of just gaining something. That'd be like making Battlewagons assault vehicles despite not being open topped and increasing the AV by 1 on the sides, yet taking nothing away from it to make up for this. Adding Assault Vehicle is a huge change for a vehicle that is known to wreck face on a constant basis. So allowing it to wreck face AND deposite assault capable troops is pretty insane,

Melevolence wrote:

 Pyeatt wrote:
I would kill for a 30 ork transport of any variety (besides a pair of boots)

An Ork Rokk!? ...
I think it would have to lose something instead of just gaining something. That'd be like making Battlewagons assault vehicles despite not being open topped and increasing the AV by 1 on the sides, yet taking nothing away from it to make up for this. Adding Assault Vehicle is a huge change for a vehicle that is known to wreck face on a constant basis. So allowing it to wreck face AND deposite assault capable troops is pretty insane,

And yet GW decided that the Battlewagon was too expensive. Orks gained a points increase to this model and got NOTHING in return. NOTHING AT ALL. It's not like orks are a powerful army compared to Space Wolves, Nids, Astrum Millitarium, Tau, Eldar...

The Battle Fortress (the 30 man ork transport) is in the main apocolypse rule book. If you go by the Forge World rules, then you can take it as a Lord of War. Which I would much rather do than use the stompa tbh. The Stompa is by no means bad, it's pretty good IMO, but I would just like something with a bit more... wheels?

Also, why don't Chaos have a drop pod? Did they just throw them out as an inconvenience when they turned traitor, saying "hmph! This'll show them damn Loyalists! We don't need super convenient troop transport that then becomes a light emplacement!"

Seriously. Wth.

Sketchyfk wrote:

Melevolence wrote:

 Pyeatt wrote:
I would kill for a 30 ork transport of any variety (besides a pair of boots)

An Ork Rokk!? ...
I think it would have to lose something instead of just gaining something. That'd be like making Battlewagons assault vehicles despite not being open topped and increasing the AV by 1 on the sides, yet taking nothing away from it to make up for this. Adding Assault Vehicle is a huge change for a vehicle that is known to wreck face on a constant basis. So allowing it to wreck face AND deposite assault capable troops is pretty insane,

And yet GW decided that the Battlewagon was too expensive. Orks gained a points increase to this model and got NOTHING in return. NOTHING AT ALL. It's not like orks are a powerful army compared to Space Wolves, Nids, Astrum Millitarium, Tau, Eldar...

The Battle Fortress (the 30 man ork transport) is in the main apocolypse rule book. If you go by the Forge World rules, then you can take it as a Lord of War. Which I would much rather do than use the stompa tbh. The Stompa is by no means bad, it's pretty good IMO, but I would just like something with a bit more... wheels?

Why does your stompa not have wheels?

 Mr Morden wrote:

Sketchyfk wrote:

Melevolence wrote:

 Pyeatt wrote:
I would kill for a 30 ork transport of any variety (besides a pair of boots)

An Ork Rokk!? ...
I think it would have to lose something instead of just gaining something. That'd be like making Battlewagons assault vehicles despite not being open topped and increasing the AV by 1 on the sides, yet taking nothing away from it to make up for this. Adding Assault Vehicle is a huge change for a vehicle that is known to wreck face on a constant basis. So allowing it to wreck face AND deposite assault capable troops is pretty insane,

And yet GW decided that the Battlewagon was too expensive. Orks gained a points increase to this model and got NOTHING in return. NOTHING AT ALL. It's not like orks are a powerful army compared to Space Wolves, Nids, Astrum Millitarium, Tau, Eldar...

The Battle Fortress (the 30 man ork transport) is in the main apocolypse rule book. If you go by the Forge World rules, then you can take it as a Lord of War. Which I would much rather do than use the stompa tbh. The Stompa is by no means bad, it's pretty good IMO, but I would just like something with a bit more... wheels?

Why does your stompa not have wheels?

Because I gave it a super-sized stormboy's rocket back-pack instead? My Stompa wasn't "stompy" enough for my liking, or his. Also it told me he was jealous of that Eldar LoW (the "Reaver Titan" I think it's called? Orks don't ask for names, we just ask for shiny leftover pieces to ork...)

Well for IG maybe just an order that lets them shoot into combat? fluffy and effective!

 Mr Morden wrote:

Why does your stompa not have wheels?

We have one. It's called Wheela.

Thatguyhsagun wrote:
Well for IG maybe just an order that lets them shoot into combat? fluffy and effective!

You don't need an order for that. Just use indirect fire blast weapons and BS3



Automatically Appended Next Post:

Sketchyfk wrote:

Melevolence wrote:

The Battle Fortress (the 30 man ork transport) is in the main apocolypse rule book. If you go by the Forge World rules, then you can take it as a Lord of War. Which I would much rather do than use the stompa tbh. The Stompa is by no means bad, it's pretty good IMO, but I would just like something with a bit more... wheels?

Gorkanaught in a hamster ball? Shows the 6" KFF off too as well...

DDT's

Deathwing Devastator Terminators follow the same squad setup as regular Dev squads but with Deathwing rules, with 4 heavy weapons, the model that carries a heavy weapon carries a CML aswell and can fire both.

DDT's cant pick melee weapons.

A Centurion equivalent in Deathwing flavour.